| Author | Message | ||
     Ceejay |
After getting about 3,000 miles on my new to me XB and I'm really digging it for street riding and I was just wondering why the switch back to the longer wheelbase? Things just wouldn't fit? Testing had shown the longer wheelbase to be better? Racers complained? Seemed to be a buell sticking point with the XB's, people either loved it or hated it, and I was just wondering why the switch. I know the XB's had longer wheelbase derivatives some via swingarm, some via extended frame rails(another question-was that just for testing purposes?) And since the geometry of the XB series was lauded for it's handling prowess-why go to the longer wheelbase? Thanks! | ||
| Joee |
Probably had alot tougher time keeping the front end on the ground with the existing wheelbase specs and the increase in power. | ||
| Brad1445 |
I'm 6'2" I'm happy about the longer wheelbase. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
I believe a longer wheelbase will aid in stability given the 1125r's higher speeds. Also, limiting the wheelie factor as previously mentioned. I know on my XB things get a little jittery over 90 or so--especially when cornering. The rake and trail were kept very aggressive like the XBs, so lets hope we get the best of both worlds in the 1125r--the exceptional cornering ability we have come to love & a smooth, stable machine at triple digit speed. | ||
| Snackbar64 |
Will this bike actually e capable of being cat walked? I have never done it before, but I know that all the top end liter bikes can do it. The previous XBs couldn't be walked. Sure the front tire would pop off the ground and right back down, but you couldn't change gears on one wheel. Does this new bike have that kind of power? The video is inconclusive. | ||
| Jlnance |
but you couldn't change gears on one wheel. Next time Bubba Blackwell is doing a show in your area, be sure to stop by.  | ||
| M1combat |
"Sure the front tire would pop off the ground and right back down, but you couldn't change gears on one wheel." Hengh??? Keep practicing. | ||
| Davegess |
but you couldn't change gears on one wheel. that would be an inaccurate statement | ||
| Aeholton |
Next time Bubba Blackwell is doing a show in your area, be sure to stop by. Doesn't Bubba run a huge rear pulley on his stunt bikes? I consider that cheating. On the other hand, a Buell is plenty capable of gear changes on the rear wheel. | ||
| Xbullet |
Will this bike actually e capable of being cat walked? I have never done it before, go to you tube and look up psychobuell. they have been doin' it to xb's for a while. | ||
| New12r |
Snackbar, Shifting while on the back tire is something that requires practice, not a specific type of bike. You can follow me on my Uly with the bags and watch if you like. | ||
| Jlnance |
Doesn't Bubba run a huge rear pulley on his stunt bikes? On some of them yes. I'm not sure which ones. He gets all 5 gears in one wheelie, but I couldn't swear it was on the bike w/o the pulley mod. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Talking with our race driver, the longer wheelbase is a help for high speed stability in addition to rider space ("Built from the rider down", remember?). His quick geometry lesson made sense - short swingarm equals massive angle changes for relatively small wheel travel; longer swingarm at same wheel travel amounts gives less angle change. End result is more consistent / predictable handling at speed. Me? I'm 6'4". I like the idea of more room than an XB (the reason I own 2 tubers at the moment). And more fuel | ||
| Metalstorm |
I don't know about the longer swingarm creating more room than a Firebolt being that it's the same tail section.The foot peg placement on the 1125R makes a huge difference for the better though. It doesn't pitch the whole body forward like the Firebolt does. Most folks of varying heights who sat on it (including me) walked away amazed at how comfortable it was and wanting to know very badly how it feels when in motion. The extra 2" of wheelbase is an excellent move for stability. And at the front end the bike enjoys the same rake & trail as the Bolt. Yippie Kai Yay! | ||
| Ceejay |
I can understand the responses, but one has to look at how much design went into the 1125r. While some testing was ongoing using the XB's which aided in the new bikes design, I'm still wondering why the departure from the shortened wheelbase. My tuber had the longer 55". My XB is the 52" variety. Maybe it has something to do with wieght(I'm 240 with gear) but I've had my 9r over the hundo mark in sweepers with no wavering, twitching, etc. and it still seemed to have more available in regards to the handling. My tuber was often a handful cranked over at these speeds. I can see how a longer wheelbase would help with more HP in theory, but can't really see the problem in the real world. Granted my little bolt doesn't seem to get much over 120 with me on it and the new bike will most probably tack on about 40mph to those numbers. I have put peg drops and helibars on, which has helped with comfort(I'm 6'2" and four hour rides are pretty good, granted I have to stop for gas every hour and half ). I guess what I'm getting at here is did buell come to the conclusion that the short wheelbase wasn't as good as they thought? At normal speeds, other than wind buffeting, I'm having trouble seeing what the longer wheelbase benifits are. Keeping the front wheel on the ground is more of a rider preference than anything. Especially given the fact that there's a 54/46% weight distrubution on the newer bike. The swingarm length from what I can derive has more to do with allowing for better rear wheel sensitivity(basically a longer moment arm)Especially when they could place the motor further forward in the chassis it seems very possible that Buell could have stayed with the 52" wheelbase. So why not? I'm not a racer(other than the offhand stop light to stop light things-but I do have a few track days coming up) so I have little understanding of how bikes handle at 180 mph. Does that mean that Buell was designing their bike around the sporty motor instead of designing the motor to fit the bike, as it seems they are now? | ||
| Diablo1 |
Why put so much weight on the front wheel (54%)? Isn't that an unusual weight bias for a sport bike? I see other great handling bikes out there with 50/50 bias. | ||
| Bob_thompson |
Ted (Diablo1), maybe thats the unladen weight bias. Anybody know for sure? If you look at pictures of the 1125R with a rider you will see that the riders weight is slightly behind the center of the wheelbase. With the riders weight added toward the rear it might be that it puts the weight bias right near 50-50. But maybe there are other considerations for the 54/46 bias such as braking and steering traction. | ||
| Elvis |
I'm no expert, but I'd prefer more weight on the front. I've never done an unintentional "stoppie", but I have had the front wheel start to lift under hard acceleration, and that feeling of losing contact on the front end is frustrating when you're trying to go fast (and not just showing off in a straight line). Like I say, I'm not an expert and I'm no great rider, but if there's a way I could give it more gas without the front end lifting (and without making a change like extending the front fork that would make it more difficult to get around corners), that would probably be one of the key things that would help someone like me go a little faster a little more safely. In theory, a more forward weight bias seems like it would do that, but I'd be interested to hear from those who know more than me. | ||
| Bob_thompson |
Elvis, I totally agree with you and believe the new longer swingarm on the 1125R will help with that somewhat. | ||
| Gregtonn |
Front weight bias helps keep the front end from sliding during hard cornering. Sliding the rear wheel during during cornering might be uncomfortable for the uninitiated. Sliding the front wheel in a fast corner sucks. Elvis, Bob is right about the longer swingarm. Extending the front fork would make it easier to lift the front end. On drag bikes we use straps to compress the forks. This helps keep the front end down on the launch. You're right about the rest of it. Good post. G. | ||
| Rick_a |
Most guys who ride my S1 from other sportbikes, even XB's, have complained that the front end feels light and a bit disconnected...or perhaps it is the larger torque than they are accustomed to  | ||
| Rick_a |
I really don't buy that "bigger guy needs bigger bike" mentality. Changing a bike ergonomically to fit the rider is a fairly easy task. Big guys do look funny on tiny bikes, though. | ||
| Chadhargis |
Yes...we do! We look funny off the bike as well.  | ||
| Ratbuell |
Chad - please tell us the guy whose name is on the bike is laughing *with* you...right?  Aside from genetics (I have the same issue) you don't look any worse than my 6'4" frame on my S1W, LOL. People ask if I think I look funny on that bike. I don't think about it, I'm having fun. Screw what I look like; it'll take much more than a "proper-size bike" to make me look good!! Oh, and I'll be sure to post how the bike rides come Sept 25/26. heheh.... | ||
| Chadhargis |
No...He's laughing AT me. | ||
| Metalstorm |
I'm thinking 54% of the weight is on the front to be able to keep the steep rake and short trail with out sacrificing stability. I wish I could take credit for that theory but I'm pretty sure I read that in one of the rags. | ||
| M1combat |
"I'm no expert, but I'd prefer more weight on the front. I've never done an unintentional "stoppie", but I have had the front wheel start to lift under hard acceleration, and that feeling of losing contact on the front end is frustrating when you're trying to go fast (and not just showing off in a straight line). " Exactly. | ||
| Djkaplan |
I think everyone was very gracious to the 'cat walk' dude. Heh... cat walk. | ||
| Ratbuell |
To address Ceejay's post waaay early on in the thread - I think the main difference in high speed cornering between your tuber and the XB isn't the wheelbase, but frame flex. The XB has one of the stiffest frames (torsionally) of any bike ever produced. The tubers, while great in their day, are still a trellis, and they do flex. I think the shorter wheelbase contributes to initial turn-in compared to the tubers; a 12Ss or a Uly has turn-in characteristics and slow-speed maneuvering comparable to my S1 or S2, but a 52-incher feels twitchy to me. | ||
| M1combat |
A shorter wheelbase also makes the corner bigger. The XB's are indeed razor sharp . |
