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Buell Forum » Quick Board Archives » Archive 0207 (July 2002) » A VROD Based Streetfighter?! » Archive through April 01, 2002 « Previous Next »

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Court
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 09:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Well....I darn sure was last night......at least they were firing blanks....

Sopranos


By the way...if you want REAL motorcycle excitement.....bring your butt to New York City on April 3rd :) . . I'll take you to Rockefeller Center and show you something you'll not soon forget!
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S320002
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 11:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
José_Quiñones,

José, I don't know you personaly and you may be a realy good guy. I am not nasty by nature but I must say, for a government-employed pot-hole engineer you sure presume to know an awful lot about running a motorcycle company. Feel free to flame on.

Greg
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Jim_M
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 11:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
For the record (not that anyone asked), I would pick up an XB9R (with a helibar set up, or somthing similar), or an S2 with Aaron's mods done to it.

I hold judgement on any XB12R until I see it. Bottom line, 100 rhp is more than I can use on the street, though it's getting nicer out, I doubt I'll find much use for my top end. Usable power is more my interests now.
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Mitchelob
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 12:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
BTW, the ONLY reason I'm passing on the XB9R is legroom. At 6'4" I could only get my knees tucked into the frame recesses by scooching my butt as far back as possible in the saddle. That was with jeans, forget about it w/full leathers. I'm hoping the next Buell will allow a little more room or atleast a tail section with a one piece seat that Corbin or Sargent could gain me the additional room needed. If they throw in a few extra horsepower I promise not to complain!
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Dynarider
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 02:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
I didnt have any problems fitting on the firebolt, sure its not as spacious as my X1 but it wasnt bad. I go 6'3" & almost 220 lbs too. Be real sweet if thecame out with a 1200 version & stretched it about 3".
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Blake
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 02:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Greg/S320002: WTF???? "pot-hole engineer"??? That's pretty hateful sounding. Were you molested by a civil engineer or something?

At least you used the proper "é" and "ñ". That shows some respect I guess.
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S320002
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 03:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Blake,

Actualy before I was an engineer I did some highway and bridge construction work, I guess you had to be there.

Greg
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Rick_A
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 03:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
José, Katanas have fairly large oil coolers...and the oil cooling system is far more integrated and substancial then that on the XB. It does a bit more than just spray the underside of the pistons. Oil jets spray the entire valve train with cooled oil as well.
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Shot_Gun
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 07:33 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Can you feel the love in here?
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Eeeeek
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 07:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Until about 1994, the GSXR was not liquid cooled. To this day, the Ducati 900SS is air cooled and there are others, too.

My guess is it's about the same principle as an airplane's cowl. Many private planes are air cooled and the cowlings direct the air over the engine. A private plane without the cowling will overheat.

Vik
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Raymaines
Posted on Saturday, March 30, 2002 - 08:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
I made a fairly high quality scan of the V-Rod Harley \ Buell street fighter in the May issue of Cycle World. I've cleaned it up a bit and sized to fit a computer screen and am using it for wallpaper. I'd be happy to e-mail you a copy if you want. E-mail me and tell me what size you want it to be and I'll send a .JPG copy.

Happy Easter. Ray
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Rick_A
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 12:32 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Vik, the cooling systems of those motors were designed with the use full coverage bodywork in mind, were they not? You can't say that about any Buell. A cowl does no good at a stop or low speed on a motorcycle. I think to make a fully faired Buell streetbike feasible you'd need at least a bigger oil cooler and bigger fan(s). Correct me if I'm wrong...but didn't X1's tend to run the rear cylinder a bit hotter than other models, even with the scoop, due to the plastic coverage?
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José_Quiñones
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 08:39 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
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José_Quiñones
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 08:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
SUZUKI ADVANCED COOLING SYSTEM

My point was that it CAN be done, the Firebolt design has many of the same features that the Suzuki system uses.
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Anonymous
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 09:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Buell is to be kept as the sport bike representation and Harley will remain cruiser. The execs at Harley remember all too well what Brand dilution does to an American company.

All the juicy rumors were that the Porsche engine was destined for a top of the line Buell. Don't let HD fool you, the powertrain was designed to be sold at that price point. But, for that matter, HD has shown some styling crossover. Look at all of the Buellesque stuff on the V-ROD.

HD (and Buell) are scheduled to have a major introduction every year to overcome model stagnation. We had the TC88, the Blast, the TC88B, the Firebolt, the V-ROD, etc. Harley has been able to keep up the pace, but Buell has been less responsive. This year will inevitably be dominated by 100th anniversary product. There is a good argument to stick with the usual anniversary fare - ugly paint combinations and free tassles on your antenna. Or, this could be the best opportunity to sell the idea that HD is getting technologically current with their product. About a year ago the debate was still raging within the walls on Juneau Ave.
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Court
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 09:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
>>>About a year ago the debate was still raging within the walls on Juneau Ave.

And still is. May personalities and "gad's we're rich, don't change a thing" mentality" be eclipsed by innovation and foresight.
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Rick_A
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 11:47 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Above all, to ye who want fairings, is why cover up a perfectly good looking motorcycle??? A 1/2 or 1/4 fairing with a large cowl or belly pan below I think would be best...something like the Britten...yeah. Buells should be kept nekkid.
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Eeeeek
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 03:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Rick:

Again, look to the Ducati 900SS.

As a side note, all air cooled bikes are designed around moving for cooling. The scoop on the X1 is useless if you're not moving.

Vik
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Jssport
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 03:32 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
- Buell will be folded into the HD line, look for 3-4 toal HD/Buell bikes.

- The new VRod sport bike will be strickly HD.

(Don't shoot the messenger)
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Dynarider
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 03:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Jssport, is this just a guess or do you have some deep secret inside info from the mother ship?
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Jssport
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 03:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
To say the VR1000 was a failure is completly wrong. The only bikes to place ahead of them were the factory race bikes. The HD VR team was always ahead of the privateers, and some of those guys had some powerful built engines.
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Jssport
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 03:37 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
At risk of an Alien probe, I can not divulge any more info.
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Rick_A
Posted on Sunday, March 31, 2002 - 07:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Yes...look at the 900SS...I always liked the CR version best! and would rather have a Monster
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The Setta
Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 03:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
For a small amount of perspective, I thought that I would tell a little bit about the v-rod I tested on Saturday. They had demo rides at the Trev Deeley dealership in BC, and I was one of the few that got a test ride. The engine was something very different than Buell or Harley. Since it was a group ride, I never got above 80 kph, but I never got out of first gear either. The engine did not sound like a Harley, nor did it rev like one. It was smooth, fairly quiet, and pulled like a locomotive. It was a very limited ride, but i got to yank on the throttle a few times, and the pull was impressive, fairly smooth and linear with little hiccup or hesitation. The bike revs up to 9000rpm, I got it up to about 7000rpm, and it was an impressive pull. While I did not really dig the v-rod, I don't like the sitting position or the bulkiness, but i think that engine in a buell would be interesting. Like some Harley traditionalist, I think they are a lot of people that would not like the engine in a Buell because of what it takes away. It didn't have the rip roaring snort of the current engine, it didn't have the shakes that makes the buell feel like you are riding an angry bull, and that engine won't make the small fairings on my m2 flap like they are ready to fly while it is idling. One of the reasons I loved the m2 from the first time i test drove it is the feel of power when you twist the throttle, the bike feels alive. All that being said, would a new buell with an engine like that of the v-rod be a bad thing? I don't know, i think it is what a lot of people on this board have been asking for. High horsepower, smooth, and modern. As for myself, I couldn't answer that question unless I tried it out. I can say this, if the new engine doesn't make me feel like I am riding something alive, if it is smooth and effortless to the point where it is mundane, well then it could have all the hp in the world, it wouldn't be my choice.

The Setta
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Rocketman
Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 06:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Da Setta has spoken

..................have the shakes that makes the Buell feel like you are riding an angry bull



Rocket in England
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Lsr_Bbs
Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 09:46 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
To say the VR1000 was a failure is completly wrong. The only bikes to place ahead of them were the factory race bikes. The HD VR team was always ahead of the privateers, and some of those guys had some powerful built engines.

Bbbbbbwwwwwwhhhhhaaaaa!!! That's fucking hillarious! Don't worry Buellstrodomus, he's not going to replace you.

There is so much wrong with that statement, I don't even know where to begin....

Neil Garretson
X0.5
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Jssport
Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 11:24 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Such as ??
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Jim_M
Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 11:40 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
maybe that the HD team was a factory team, and was last, as far as that goes?

and that privateers did indeed finish ahead of them?


As a super bike platform, the VR1000 was a failure.
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Rick_A
Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 12:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
Well, for a first effort it was noble...no one with a completely new machine...wait, nevermind.
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José_Quiñones
Posted on Monday, April 01, 2002 - 12:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only)
The VR1000 was successful.....

As a Trojan Horse, i.e. it got people used to the idea of a Watercooled, overhead cam Harley Davidson motorcycle. (some people still won't accept it!)

I'm sure that it helped HD engineers with the Revo engine, with assistance from Porsche, of course.

So once the VROD was released, there was no reason to keep the charade up. So they quit.
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