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Ronlv
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 10:09 am: | 
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what percent of buell does harley own? isnt something like 98%?
i think our bikes are more harley than buell because harley owns and manufactures more of it.
does anyone know what percent of parts are american made, chinese made, italian made etc. it would be interesting to know if we have more of a american made bike or somewhere else.
you know whats funny, alot of people here talk crap about all the custom builders, but at least these guys design, manufacture and assemble their bikes.
i know they dont manufacture every part, but they do manufacture alot more than what buell does for us.
i have alot of respect for the custom builders even if i dont like their design.
what would you say about a company if it had a tv show and it was building bikes and all it did was have everyone else build parts and then they assembled it?
i wish buell would go back to the way they started and get their hands dirty. i dont believe the hype about now they can focus better, because they dont have to manufacture. thats just the easy way to do it.
there are thousands of companies that are successful and make there own parts.
on another note, since manufacturing doesnt count for anything, what would a bike be if a american company designed it and had china manufacture it and then assembled it in america? would it be a chinese bike? would you buy it? what would you think of that company trying to make people believe it was american made?
i want to remind the flamers, i love my buell.
my comments are just something to make you go hmmmm |
Spatten1
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 10:20 am: |
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Does anyone really "make" anything? I'm not sure why casting or machining metal is such a magical thing.
The manufacturer I worked for bought cylinders, cases, head castings, and many other engine parts from a captive supplier (no other customers). Many engine parts were outsourced and many produced in-house. We machined most of the parts in-house for QC reasons. We produced the frames in-house. We bought electronics from ND.
We made watercraft hulls in-house and spun ATV wheels from slugs in-house.
Each part was outsourced if expertise, QC, and/or capital expenditures dictated so. However, our company could make a decision to buy a $5MM machine if it had a 5 year payback. Buell is probably not allowed to do so yet...
Buell is the only company that I know of that actually designs their own ECM. I believe that everyone else outsources to Bosch, ND, etc. I'd rather see Buell make frames than ECMs, personally, but it's not my company and I can't know why they focus their resources as they do.
(Message edited by spatten1 on August 15, 2007) |
Buellinachinashop
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 10:23 am: |
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According to the FTC, in order for a company to claim "american made" or imply "american". A majority of the "significant" parts must be made here and not abroad. To me, a motor is pretty significant.
I for one won't buy another Buell if it doesn't have at the least, an American made motor. I don't believe I'm the only one. So yes, this motor IMO is going to effect sales.
For those who don't want to believe their Buell is a part of Harley. Can somebody please tell us what two brands get you into the Harley Owners Group (HOG)? |
Spatten1
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 10:46 am: |
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I for one won't buy another Buell if it doesn't have at the least, an American made motor.
It's sad, but I feel the opposite. I think the 98% of sport riders out there will embrace buying an "American" bike with an engine made by someone with a reputation for making good performance engines, which Harley certainly does not have.
My guess is that if the 1125 drives sale to the next level that Buell will get the resources to produce parts in-house cost effectively. It probably would not be cost effective to make many parts when you sell 10,000 units per year. |
Mikej
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 11:16 am: |
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H-D Inc.
________
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|___ Harley-Davidson motorcycle division
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|___ Harley-Davidson motorclothes division
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|___ Harley-Davidson Inc Financial division
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|___ Harley-Davidson Owner's Group (Don't know why it isn't called H-D.O.G. since "they're" so finicky about dropping the -Davidson when talking about Harley-Davidson bikes.)
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|___ Buell motorcycle division
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|___ Buell Rider's Adventure Group
That is my interpretation of the organizational structure of the incorporation.
What two brands get you into H.O.G. membership? Why, V-Rod and Harley, Buell makes it three brands since some don't think of the V-Rod as a Harley.
Back when B.R.A.G. was still in existence we were told repeatedly that B.R.A.G. and Buell were two separate entities, two separate groups, and related in name only with overlap in focus and goals.
Relative to what this thread is about, I believe the 1125R will have a positive net effect on the XB line of bikes. I also personally consider the 1125R to be an XB bike, don't know why a radiator and engine would change that. And I'm curious if we'll ever see a Blast with an XB style frameset, X-Blast.
Gotta go hide now, egg timer is about up and the T.R.O.N. monitors are picking up my presence.
 |
Spatten1
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 11:30 am: |
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Gotta go hide now, egg timer is about up and the T.R.O.N. monitors are picking up my presence.
Put on your tin-foil hat, it keeps the government satellites from being able to read your brain waves. |
Mikej
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 12:21 pm: |
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Tin foil is considered contraband here, interferes with their equipment/experiments. |
Gregtonn
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 01:02 pm: |
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If you truly believe that your XB is a Harley sportbike try this experiment.
1. Remove the engine and drive train from your XB. (Save these parts you'll need them later).
2. Get yourself as many Harley parts catalogs as you want.
3. Replace the drive train in your "Harley" sportbike with unmodified Harley parts.
4. If you decide you want to get back on the road you can always put the Buell drivetrain back into your Buell sportbike.
See why its called a Buell? |
Buellinachinashop
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 01:15 pm: |
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You mean the Buell powertrain that Harley builds at the Capital Drive Harley/Davidson plant?
Maybe I can finance new parts by going through EagleMark Credit or pick up new ones through my local Harley/Davidson/Buell dealership. |
Gregtonn
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 01:54 pm: |
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Yep, that would be the correct Buell powertrain.
(Message edited by Gregtonn on August 15, 2007) |
Buellinachinashop
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 02:05 pm: |
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Same Buell powertrain used in the Blast as well? |
Gregtonn
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 02:19 pm: |
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Buell doesn't use the XB power trains in the Blast.
Let's try to stay on subject.
Are you thinking of trying the experiment? |
Buellinachinashop
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 02:22 pm: |
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No, I was asking if it was Buell powertrain also used in the Blast. Not the XB powertrain, just general Buell powertrain. Is it? |
Davegess
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 02:27 pm: |
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This whole discussion has passed over into a bazaar parallel universe!!!! |
Bob_thompson
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 03:11 pm: |
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A thought just came to me fellows that many companies use a system for expansion called diversification to increase their market. All the Japanese manufacturers did this when they came out with all their metric cruisers and they have been a great success for them. I think Buell maybe thinking somewhat similarly to this by their new 1125R, while keeping the current line of bikes, and breaking into the "super bike" and eventually "dirt bike" market which we really never had. I think this was the reason behind the Ulysses adventure bike and HD really has the "life style" market pretty much to themselves and does not appear to want much else. This move will benefit the whole corporation and just may bring a full Buell sport tourer later. Just my take. Bob |
Buellinachinashop
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 03:39 pm: |
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There's no doubt that this bike is going to reach the "crotch rocket" younger riders. A market that HD wants and needs. What's the average age of a Buell owner? 40? |
Spatten1
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 03:44 pm: |
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Buellinachinashop is right. I don't care what the Buell engine looks like on the outside or how the engine mounts fit. Take that sum'bitch apart and it's 150% Harley inside. Just take off the clutch cover and it looks like it was made on another planet than any Japanese or Euro bike. The engines are a mixture of Harley and Buell part numbers, but the design is still all HD.
Buell has certainly hot rodded it, but not redesigned it by any means. |
Spatten1
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 03:45 pm: |
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There's no doubt that this bike is going to reach the "crotch rocket" younger riders. A market that HD wants and needs. What's the average age of a Buell owner? 40?
Yeah, I really think Buell has failed to reach the youth market thus far. The 1125 ought to do it. |
Court
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 03:52 pm: |
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Does HD market their bikes, with significant foreign sourced parts, as "American Made"? |
Buellinachinashop
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 04:33 pm: |
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Honda assembles bikes in Belgium, does that make them European? |
Spatten1
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 04:59 pm: |
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Honda assembles bikes in Belgium, does that make them European?
It's a funny point. Many Fords and GMs have less US made parts than Honda cars. Would a true patriot buy Hondas? |
Mikej
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 05:00 pm: |
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If an Italian man and a Japanese woman meet each other in England and conceive a child together while still in England then move to the United States together where the child is born, what does that make the child, Italian, Japanese, English, or American?
In a parallel universe this is a valid example.
edit: assume the child in question grows up and eventually buys an 1125R, just to keep this on topic.
(Message edited by mikej on August 15, 2007) |
Jimidan
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 05:14 pm: |
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Buell builds ideas...you know the hard part. |
Coal400
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 08:19 pm: |
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...BRAG
Probably not a new idea but:
Why doesn't Badweatherbikers pick up Brag? I'm sure there would be enough support here - I would contribute. |
Vanvideo
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 10:30 pm: |
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If the child in question buys an 1125R, then the kid is obviously intelligent- and Japanese.
Did I mention I'm a Japanese -American? |
Crusty
| | Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 06:38 am: |
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If the child in question grows up and appreciates good food and beautiful women, he's Italian. If he buys an 1125R, then he's an Italian motorcyclist with good taste. |
José_quiñones
| | Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 07:42 am: |
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You buy this bike at a BMW dealer, even though it was a joint development between Aprila and BMW, it is assembled at an Aprilia plant in Italy and uses a BMW/Rotax designed engine built by Rotax in Austria.
It's still a BMW.
The 1125 is the "Halo" bike, it gets people interested in Buells and into dealer showrooms that otherwise would not be interested in them because of the "HD Lump".
The buyer who comes into a dealer to look at a 1125 but then decides they must have an American engine in their sportbike, they can still buy an XB.
The buyer who must have a Superbike spec/"modern" American engine in their sportbike will just have to leave the Buell dealership and wait longer and get ready to pay a bunch whenever it arrives at a some motorcycle store, hopefully nearby.
For everyone else, your bike will be available at Buell dealers nationwide later this year.
(Message edited by josé_quiñones on August 16, 2007) |
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