| Author | Message | ||
     Rellim51 |
I want to start off saying that I am new to motorcycles. With that said....... I have a 2000 X1 that is mechanically stock other than a K&N air filter. I just bought a Force Streetfighter exhaust. Does anyone have any input on this exhaust? What modifications will I have to make to the bike to install this exhaust? I talked to a friend that works at the local HD/Buell dealer and he said they are not that familiar with Buells. He said I will either have to buy a down load from HD (149.00) or buy some sort of programmer (power commander) to make the exhaust work on my bike. Does this sound right? Can I just buy the Race ECM instead? | ||
| Chasespeed |
Yeah you can.... The Race ECM is the way to go.... I think you may find that the Force is a bit loud... and not the best pipe for a stock motor... BUT.... Chase | ||
| Rellim51 |
So if I buy the race ECM it will not have to be mapped or reprogramed? I know it will be loud but I only ride 20-30 mins at a time. Maybe I will start riding with ear plugs. | ||
| Tattoodnscrewd |
I think you may find that the Force is a bit loud... and not the best pipe for a stock motor... I'd have to agree -- the pipe is obnoxiously loud .. (I happen to like it) And on a stock motor, you will find that you lose a bit of low-end grunt .. The Force Pipe's claimed purpose is a race exhaust - which means it's best suited to a race/built motor ... It does however open the bike up a bit higher in the revs .. Depends on what your preferences are. | ||
| Rellim51 |
Would you say that it is the loudest of the pipes available? | ||
| Tattoodnscrewd |
I believe other than straight pipes (which a Force pipe really is - even with the street baffle they make for it) there was only one other exhaust made for a Buell that was as loud/ or louder .. can't remember the name of it though. | ||
| Bad_karma |
Anthony I'm not sure about the force, but I put a CF race breather and two brothers can and the fuel injection handled that nicely. But the ECM helped. Joe | ||
| Rellim51 |
Thanks for the input...I expected the pipe to be loud but I have never heard one so one persons loud may not be that loud to others.....if that makes since. I just hope it's not unbearably loud. I had rather go with the race ECM if I don't have to have it remapped. My next choice would be a Power Commander. Are there any other options regarding the remappnig of the ECM? | ||
| Chasespeed |
Ok.... Honoestly, the D&D slip-on is about as loud as the force... but has a better sound too... The same with my Full D&D ssytem... Think of it like this... Ever heard a stock motor, like chevy, ford, mopar etc, on JUST headers? Then, that same car gets a good header back system, and its a little mellower, but SOUNDS and runs a bit better.... . I have been trying to avoid the force pipe, until I needed it... But, now with the engine mods, its time to get a bigger pipe... And, JUST get the race ECM, it will be fine, you will need a TPS reset after wards though... I have a Power Commander sitting around the house, that I have not even touched.. Chase | ||
| Rellim51 |
I think I had rather use the Race ECM but I don't want to buy it and STILL have to have it remapped or have to buy the Power Commander. Does anyone know if the baffle for the Force makes it quieter or is it a waste of money. I heard it would get some of my low end power back. Is this true? | ||
| Bluzm2 |
The Force is LOUD! Neat sound but loud. The baffle doe little if anything to tone it down. I could never tell the difference. With the race ECM, you will get rid of the midrange stumble of the stocker. It will also run better with a pipe AND intake mods. Most folks run with the race ECM only. At minimum, you should also replace the stock air filter with a K&N for improved air flow. Remember, an engine is just a self powered air pump. You have to get the air IN and OUT. Doing one or the other does little and can make things worse. Also, the Force pipes are a bit fragile. The are known to crak at the front and rear mount. If you get one, keep an eye on it. Brad | ||
| Rellim51 |
I already have a K&N on it. I think I will come up with some sort of catch can to keep oil out of the intake when I put the exhaust on though. Even if the baffle does not make the exhaust any quieter, would it be worth buying it for added low end power? | ||
| Tattoodnscrewd |
I really don't think the street baffle does anything .. I ran it on and off - and didn't notice a difference in loudness or power ... In regards to loudness ... the Force pipe is actually a little louder than the D&D .. but only in that it has more bark and not a deep throaty loud - this is where the D&D sounds better .. the Force truly sounds like drag pipes .. higher pitched bark.. the headers are actually pretty small in diameter on the Force compared to other systems (gradually gets bigger - stepped header) which is what causes the higher bark .. note the sound of a bike with a Buell race exhaust - larger diameter header provides the nice deep rumble that comes with it. As far as the front mount on the Force - it is known to crack - but depending on whether you bought a newer style or older style will determine if it will be an issue for you .. see my post from yesterday on my 97 S1 - I had to cut off the front mount, weld it up - then I wrapped it to hide the welds ... used the updated hardware that their pipes all come with now - they don't have a welded on front tab for mounting any longer - this is to hopefully prevent cracking .. | ||
| Tattoodnscrewd |
On a side note --- speaking on exhaust sounds .. I noticed that although I only ran my bike briefly after fixing the cracks in the Force pipe and wrapping it (to cure the silicone coating) that the exhaust sounds a little better - didn't think wrap would affect it much, it may be though that the cracks were worse than I thought causing a bad sound ... but the tone deepened a bit. | ||
| Italialaw |
Tattoodnscrewd, A pipe louder than the force is KT Header/Exhaust. I ran a Kooks and now run a KT (just to mix things up) and the KT is the loudest pipe I've heard on a buell (good performer above 4000 RPM too) | ||
| Tattoodnscrewd |
That's the one ! Al at American Sport Bike has one on one of his bikes ... I couldn't remember the name of it though ... that's the one I was referring to in my first response. Thanks ! | ||
| Rellim51 |
How much power increase should I expect from just adding the Force pipe and Power Commander? I read somewhere that the Force is supposed to add 19 HP but that sounds WAY too high. | ||
| Rock |
Tony, A race ECM WILL make your scooter run much better! Regarding the (less than adequate) engine breathing system the bike has, changing to the (far superior) XB rocker covers along with the PCV valves will eliminate the oil (invariably) getting into the airbox and dripping onto the header... Check the knowledge vault for more details--} | ||
| Djkaplan |
You don't absolutely need XB rocker covers to run external breather lines. I have them though, and they sure do make it easier. | ||
| Crux |
I agree...also, theres some great info on this website, http://www.saintjohn.nbcc.nb.ca/marriott/x1/, regarding how to make the most out of your tuber rocker covers. I was able to breathe mine to a catch can with no problems at all. | ||
| Ratbuell |
The Race ECM is the way to go for starters - it's programmed for a free-flow exhaust and intake airbox and should do you just fine on the street. Al at American Sport Bike has been tinkering with the DirectLink programmer on tubers and last I spoke with him, he seems pretty sure it'll work with first generation DDFI in addition to the XBs it was designed for, as they share a lot of code. Drop him an email, he's a great guy to deal with and has put up with a lot of my (admittedly dumb) questions as I was re-entering the Buell world last year with my S1W.  | ||
| Rellim51 |
This may be a dumb question but why is the race ECM better than the PC? If I have the PC, can't I make my stock ECM do the same thing the race ECM does and more? | ||
| Oldog |
Rellim: I had the PC its ok, the race ecm a low restriction intake and exhaust make it nice. The PC will require a dyno tune for a map as would a re map the easyest to put on and live with is intake of your choice race ECM and supertrap you can adjust the exhaust restriction by adding or removing rings its strudy ( later ones ) and looks good. I have posted dyno curves in the KV to prove it, 19 hp power gain by exhaust alone is BS I got 3~5 hp on top vs stock what was great was that the "hole" in the midrange was "filled" and I picked up torque and HP in the middle where the bike runs the most see the KV my numbers for the dyno run are there, I will do a run soon with the Race ECM and post it some time, the big thing is the bike runs MUCH BETTER all across the range with the factory RACE ECM it is a bolt in Chase has my PC now for the planned motor from hell that he will one day build IHTH, oldog. | ||
| Kyrocket |
Rellim, I have had no dealings what-so-ever with the PC, BUT, I have had a Buell race ecm for several (six probably) years without the first bit of trouble. I have a K&N up top, a Vance & Hines on the bottom and a race ecm in the middle makes it all good. I mean how much you really need or want is totally up to you but when I'm feeling froggy and turn onto the on ramp I can be doing in excess of 100 mph by the time I merge into traffic, traffic permitting. What I'm saying is that this basic setup may not be the slickest or most powerful but other than the initial cost it has cost me squat. You do have to get the ecm zeroed out but that's a one time deal. Anyway that's my two cents worth. Good luck on the decision. | ||
| Chasespeed |
Chase has my PC now for the planned motor from hell that he will one day build Yep, still sitting in a box on the top shelf of my workbench... FWIW, Right now, I am running a 1250, D&D Full race exhuast, and a American Sport Bike carbon air cleaner... In a running ok... not as rich as I was before, BUT, thats a larger motor now... But, still witing comfort levels... SO, I promise, you will be fine with a Race ECM... Chase} | ||
| Captainkirk |
Well, these guys said it all. But to recap... 1) The Force is LOUD. No, make that L-O-U-D!}} 2) Run the race ECM. You'll be happy. 3) Remap it. One time shot. Everybody's happy. (Except the neighbors.) | ||
| Firemanjim |
PC does not have the same amount of inputs as the race or stock ECM and has been known to skew the AFR on the bikes in the wrong spots. Ask Terry P. or Al Lighton. If you notice there are no longer PC's available for Buells. | ||
| Rellim51 |
Are you saying I will have to remap the race ECM or I will have to remap my stock ECM if I decide to use it. | ||
| Crux |
I think what he's trying to say is you'll need to reset the TPS (Throttle Position Sensor) when you install the race ECM. You'll have to reset the TPS every time you switch out the ECMs...I can't imagine why you'd need to go back to stock after having the race in though...it's more fun | ||
| Rellim51 |
Well, I had decided to just order the Race ECM then I found a new PC on ebay for cheap. I got to checking the PC web site and it looks like they no longer offer maps for any Buell. I guess I will just stick with the Race ECM....anyone got one they want to sell? | ||
| Kyrocket |
I have the whole setup (race ecm, K&N, Vance & Hines) I'll let go for $5700 and I'll throw the bike in for free (1999 X1 Carbon Fiber Extreme #205)  | ||
| Rellim51 |
Even though that sounds like a smokin deal, I don't have quiet that much left in my budget. I got the Force in this afternoon and it looks pretty good. I can see why everyone says it is loud, It's a straight pipe! The collector area looks smaller than my stock pipe. I guess bigger isn't always better. I was a little disappointed in the quality of the coating. I think it is Jet Hot. We use a company called Thermal Tech Coatings at work and their stuff looks MUCH better. I may have it recoated later. I'm still looking for a good deal on a Race ECM. I'll keep everyone posted. Thanks for all the information. | ||
| Xb9er |
I have a supertrapp on my x1 and it sounds great. jmo |
