| Author | Message | ||
     Firebolt428 |
Trojan. Great idea and I have had the same thought. They have the Suzuki cup why not the Buell cup. There are plenty of us here racing Buell's. I think we should email Henry about it and try and see what we can put together. Have like a National BRAG meeting the same weekend to bring in more of a crowd. Just some ideas.. | ||
| Trojan |
Hi Blake, I agree that Laguna has made great strides in recent years. I remember the crash a few years ago involving Akira Yanagawa on the WSB Kawasaki at the top of the corkscrew that made me cringe. Remember the large tree that used to be there? That thankfully couldn't happen now. However it still needs to go a bit further yet. The tarmac issue this year may have been caused by the extremely hot weather, but it was laid far too late in the first place and in haste. I don't think Laguna would be the venue of choice if there was a good alternative available. Barber looks to be a superb facility and I may have maligned it unfairly. Some of the other courses though still lag behind the current standard. I'm sure that Anonymous is right about the money issue too, and that is why it is the AMA and the manufacturers that must put the pressure on the circuit owners and not just the individual riders. Beleive me, I am not being smug, thinking that UK circuits are that great. Cadwell Park and Oulton Park can be pretty scary places and are now getting to be pretty marginal for Superbikes. They keep installing more and more chicanes in order to slow bikes down, but that spoils the circuit unfortunately. We also need some new circuits over here  (Message edited by trojan on October 03, 2006) | ||
| Jlnance |
It's really a Catch 22 situation that will take something big to change. To some extent we bring that problem on ourselves. Motorcyclists tend to be somewhat elitist (gasp) and then we wonder why the races we want to see aren't televised. | ||
| Whodom |
Press release from Buell.com: BUELL XBRR TEAMS CLOSE OUT LEARNING SEASON AT MID-OHIO McWilliams and Crevier Out Early in AMA Formula Xtreme Race LEXINGTON, Ohio -- (Sunday, October 01, 2006) Deeley Harley-Davidson/Buell Canada’s Steve Crevier and Warr’s of London Harley-Davidson/Buell rider Jeremy McWilliams qualified aboard Buell XBRR motorcycles for the Formula Xtreme national during the final round of the 2006 AMA Superbike Championship held at the Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course. But both Buell riders suffered disappointing results during the 16-lap race. McWilliams qualified 11th for the event, while Crevier qualified 17th in the field of 30 bikes. Yamaha USA rider Eric Bostrom led all qualifiers and took the point for pole position. McWilliams, who was 6th quickest in the morning warm-up, was forced to switch to his back-up XBRR after a small oil leak was discovered on his primary bike just before the start of the race. With no time on his backup bike, he was forced to retire after the first lap with an electrical problem. Crevier was racing in 14th place when he experienced a mechanical problem on lap five. The race and the 2006 AMA FX Championship was won by American Honda factory rider Josh Hayes. “The AMA’s FX class is really getting fast and exciting and was a battle for the championship until this last race. It's been quite a learning year for the Buell teams, and when Jeremy's team finally got the set up right for him on Sunday morning, it was looking like we would close out the season with our best finish yet. But that's racing, and that's why we'll be back next year; it's the challenge,” said Buell Motorcycle Company Chairman and Chief Technical Officer Erik Buell. Both Buell dealer teams received support from Pirelli Tires, Sentry Insurance, Harley-Davidson Financial Services, Screamin' Eagle SYN3 Synthetic Motorcycle Lubricant, and Harley-Davidson Visa. The Buell XBRR is a limited-edition production racing motorcycle based on the Firebolt XB12R, which is reworked at the factory into the XBRR for use in closed-course competition. It offers private racers a professional-level, race-ready, production-based platform. To learn more about Buell motorcycles, visit your local Buell dealer today and experience the pure streetfighter attitude, style and performance only found on board a Buell. For the Buell dealer nearest you, pull into www.buell.com. | ||
| Jimidan |
At Mid-Ohio, the AMA event is the largest in terms of fan attendance (there usually is only one bike race a year), so there is an economic incentive for tracks to modernize. This one would have probably have been nearly as well attended if it hadn't been for the unusual weather. Sunday still had a large crowd though. The main reason (circulating at the track) that the factory riders boycotted the heat races had to do with them missing a good portion of a practice session because of a mandatory riders meeting. This may have not been the case, but it appeared that the boycott was a 'sperm' of the moment affair, which caught everybody unaware. They were showing on the jumbotron screen at the track the riders dressed out in full leathers right before the start of the first heat, with Miguel ranting & raving, waving his arms like a rooster. It appeared that Miguel was pleading his case to the Ducati riders, who reluctantly went along. It didn't look like it had much premeditation to me...more of a last minute decision. The TV folks even recorded the first heat, but pulled the plug on the second after realizing what was going on. It was the type of chaos which is indicative of a spontaneous event. In hindsight, the AMA probably should have pulled the plug on the heats and had a mandatory meeting of the factory riders and negotiated a settlement before the heats, but I realize time was of the essence. It was the strangest thing I have ever seen at a racetrack. What was really cool was that the fans responded so positively to the heat races...wildly cheering the riders who raced and finished. We all had been sitting around in the cold and rain for so long that any racing was great. In all fairness, the racing that followed that day was some of the best I have ever seen, with two championships up for grabs and the competition intense. Trojan, I think it is no secret that motorcycle racing in the USA is not on the level with the Euro on a popularity basis...NASCAR is. I cannot understand this personally, since racing motorcycles makes NASCAR seem like a kiddy-car ride at Disney Snat, but there are many things about popular American culture that totally mystify me...like reality TV where contestants eat slugs! However, keeping that in mind, I think that motorcycle racing is growing in popularity here and the number of bike-friendly tracks coming on-line have been increasing at a much faster rate than in the Euro. We are on the same road here, but just a little behind since the automobile is still very much king, primarily because we have been paying much less at the pump for much longer than anywhere in the Euro. Civilization in the Euro is many centuries older than the US, and it is much more densely populated, so motorcycles play a much greater role in basic transportation there. Bubba still hasn't gotten it here, but he will come around, or not. Frankly, I like the fact that AMA racing does not have the popularity of NASCAR (or World Superbike), as we have much more access to the racers themselves. We walk among them in the pits and talk casually with them about their fascinating world. Once at Mid-Ohio, I took a leak at the same time in the same urinal trough with Nicky Hayden while we were talking about these chicks back home in Owensboro, KY, who had corn-roll braided his hair. Try doing that at your fancy-smancy tracks in the Euro. Neil wants to stay here badly for a reason...bad tracks and all. How do you 'splain that? I also do not understand the allure with racing bikes in the rain...maybe it is a demented residual from the days of the gladiators or something. It is dangerous enough without putting a couple more lions in there with the christians. I think it is akin to how readily we send our youth off to war...we'd be much more reticent if all of us had to go fight. The ability to support racing in the rain has nothing to do with whether a track is any good, IMHO. Mid-Ohio is a dynamite track except in the rain. It is green and when the ground is saturated, capillary action makes drying it difficult. I am glad they chose NOT to race on it when wet...the wait was worth it in the quality racing that followed. Frankly, I hate watching bike races in the rain anywhere, and wish they would not do it. They races are always boring, unreasonably dangerous, and always take a much higher percentage of casualties...regardless of what track they are on. I don't like watching racers being hurt, and would prefer that they race the whole season without having to recover from needless injuries from a fall in the wet. What is the purpose in this? It is madness, I say, madness! Let F1 cars race if they want to, they have huge tires and can negotiate much more readily on wet pavement than bikes, plus they have a cage around the driver. But skating around in the wet on contact patches the size of a match box is crazy. And finally, I tire from hearing the elitist tenet from Euro fans about how superior WSB racing is to AMA...it just ain't so. jimidan | ||
| Jimidan |
Ceejay sez: "I do find the number of DNF's for Buell disturbing. If you look at the first and last race-the ones that stick in people's heads, 6 bikes-6 DNF's-100%(or 0% depending on how you look at it) Racing in general, that will happen, but were getting to the point is it better to run well-6th qual is damn good, and maybe not finish, or run mid to late pack and finish for a full season. Development plan?-or is just that hindsight is 20/20." I think we all are disturbed to an extent, whether we are willing to admit it or not. It was apparent to me that the majors arrived at the track with their development done and tested, while the Buell guys were developing at the track, and testing during the race. They made the determination to change out the exhaust system at the track and had to fabricate parts and test them on-site, then re-map the bikes Saturday night. I understand that funding is a major issue, and that testing with McWilliams is hard to come by. He is an excellent development rider, amongst his many other talents, but he lives in Scotland. He wants to ride the Buell and pleads his case for more funding from deep-pockets at HD...are we listening? jimidan | ||
| Jscott |
"But that's racing, and that's why we'll be back next year; it's the challenge,” said Buell Motorcycle Company Chairman and Chief Technical Officer Erik Buell." That's very refreshing. When do you think we can we expect to hear specifics on teams and riders? Excellent rant Jimidan! However I must confess that I do enjoy watching wet races. Rain truly is the greatest equalizer. | ||
| Zac |
Heat Races: I thought it was a cool idea. It would help showcase the Superbike class as the true "premier" class, which we don't have now - a premier class defined as one that has all the best riders. It would also help reduce the lapper "problem", by limiting the number of riders in the main. Currently, there is a reason for all those lappers - the purse for 20th in SB is larger than the purse for 10th in Supersport. I can see all the factory guys not wanting to run another race, and needing a setup for both a short heat and a long main, but that is the price to pay. At Ohio it didn't work out, but I'd like to see it carry into the future. Rain races: Rain races are a fact of life, unless you live someplace it just doesn't rain. For those of us that make large time and money comitments to attend a race, to have it cancelled is a waste. For an AMA national, it's an even bigger waste (TV crews, spectators, etc). I have only been in one race that was cancelled because of rain (at Firebird East), we had a microburst and there was a river of thick mud running across the track. Personnaly, I still would have run, I could have cleaned up on my supermoto bike. I don't think that the increase in crashes in the wet is due so much to the rain as much as we (at least most US riders) just don't have enough experience in the rain. It's easy to crash in either the wet or dry, but most riders know the limit in the dry much better than in the wet because they ridden orders of magnitude more laps in the dry. How many AMA teams test in the rain? They all pack up and leave the test. Granted, there are some tracks that are more dangerous in the wet because you can slide further on wet grass and pavement, but ask Jimmy Moore about sliding 200 yards through the woods at Brainerd on wet grass - that was off a dry track. Rain isn't the problem so much as the tracks... -z. | ||
| Jens |
Erik said how it is, its racing! Not so much to comment. "If you work on the road, you meet a lot of masterroadbuilders" is what we say here in Germany. That means when you stand in the focus, a lot of people know how you can do it better.... (-: But a Team follow its own plans and strategys and its "from outside" often not to understand why a decission is made this or that way. Its coming now the time for the big talkers who know everything before and better. Dont waste your time friends, follow your plans! I know the Team worked very hard to set on this last race a sign, a mark, to build up from, beginning of next season. They missed -and I am sure that for all who are involved its a time of deep dissapointment and depression. So its the moment for you all there outside, the real friends of the brand, to "show the flag" and sent your adresses to the factorys, the teams and the riders with a "heads up guys!" supportnote. We all want to see the RR´s racing and company and mothership need to have a clear "give us more!" statement. Steve, Henry, Martin, John, Erik, and all of your staff dont let them get you down! You give us a great bike and a great thrill of this first season! You brought us great entertainment with first class riders and a Jeremy McWilliams in front! Thanks for that, Jens | ||
| Jlnance |
NASCAR is. I cannot understand this personally, since racing motorcycles makes NASCAR seem like a kiddy-car ride at Disney Snat I think you answered the question later in your post. There are more cars than motorcycles. I watch the FX races because there is a Buell in them and I own a Buell. If I didn't own a bike, I don't think they would be very interesting. On the other hand, everyone owns a car, and it even looks somewhat like the ones raced in NASCAR. So right their NASCAR has an advantage. The NASCAR folks have also done a great job of promoting themselves. Least anyone doubt the popularity of NASCAR around here, when there is a race at Lowes Motor Speedway, it becomes the 3rd largest city in North Carolina. | ||
| Elvis |
I think we all are disturbed to an extent, whether we are willing to admit it or not. It was apparent to me that the majors arrived at the track with their development done and tested, while the Buell guys were developing at the track, and testing during the race. They made the determination to change out the exhaust system at the track and had to fabricate parts and test them on-site, then re-map the bikes Saturday night. I understand that funding is a major issue, and that testing with McWilliams is hard to come by. He is an excellent development rider, amongst his many other talents, but he lives in Scotland. He wants to ride the Buell and pleads his case for more funding from deep-pockets at HD...are we listening? jimidan Not disturbed at all. I love that they're out there scratching and scraping - trying to put something together with guts, determination and ingenuity rather than a boatload of money. If a caravan of Harley trucks had pulled into each race with rows of spare bikes and racks of tires and they won every race, would that have been satisfying? Not to me. Nothing wrong with working toward a goal and fighting every step of the way rather than having it handed to you . . . in my opinion. Should I buy my son a Corvette when he graduates college? If I let him make his own way and someday he's able to buy his own Corvette, won't it mean that much more to him? Won't he have learned more along the way and have a better appreciation of what it means to have a car like that? The rumors I've been hearing indicate that Buell is becoming more independant from Harley rather than more dependant on them. Disturbed? Not at all. Thrilled is more like it. | ||
| Anonymous |
Thanks, Jens, for your comments. Mid-Ohio was very frustrating. The bike was working better in the Sunday practice session than ever before, the culmination of a few detail enhancements and set-up changes. We tested the bike back-to-back with the Road Atlanta configuration, and were a full second a lap faster. Fifth place looked a reasonable ambition. That possiblity ended with a primary fluid leak discovered on the start grid after the siting lap, We're still tracking down the cause, but it may come down to one O-ring on a component we inspected immediately before the final in the insane 30-minute rush between the final practice session and gridding for the final. Immensely frustrating, of course, but the speed increase was very promising. The FX leaders were faster than many Superbikes at Mid-Ohio, so to say the class is tough is an understatement. We know what we have to do to produce better results next season, and have already begun to work toward that goal. To win FX, we'll have to lap a circuit like Mid-Ohio almost as quickly as the work's Ducati Superbikes. | ||
| Bigdaddy |
Anony, Excellent post -- thank you. We'll see ya'll in Daytona. G2 | ||
| Ceejay |
Jens-Nice post. I believe that you and Elvis are right, it is very cool to see Buell out there fight, kicking, scratching it out, wish I could have been there, to watch, cheer, or help in anyway a shade tree mechanic like me can...I guess I am just stating the obvious, I didn't expect Buell to win it all, or even any of it-even though it would have been cool, I just want to see them compete and have fun doing it, which is very hard to do or see when they walk away from the grid...Disturbing, prolly not the right word but it's bothersome...Best of luck in the offseason, me and my family will be rooting for ya... | ||
| Whodom |
Anony, Thanks for the post. Hopefully we'll see 8 or 10 XBRR's (hell, why not 35?) at Daytona 2007 in which case a DNF or 2 won't seem like such a big deal. Any info on Crevier's DNF? | ||
| Jscott |
"Hopefully we'll see 8 or 10 XBRR's (hell, why not 35?) at Daytona 2007 in which case a DNF or 2 won't seem like such a big deal. " That would be great! Although I would much prefer to have 1 or 2 show up at Daytona and the same 1 or 2 show up for every race thereafter. Results will follow. | ||
| Jscott |
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2006/Oct/061003a3.htm Aaron Yates is available for 2007 and is being represented by Tripp Nobles' brother. Could Buell be one of those interesting offers? He's riding in his prime and can dropkick like a mutha!  (Message edited by JScott on October 03, 2006) | ||
| Jscott |
Or maybe this is one of Aaron's interesting offers... http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?article=27257 2007 has the makings of an exciting season. Too bad Ducati left. | ||
| M2nc |
Anony - Thanks for the post. Great job getting the bike up to speed and looking forward to '08. Go Buell!!! | ||
| Jimidan |
Elvis sez: "Disturbed? Not at all. Thrilled is more like it." Isn't it a bit odd that you would be so thrilled at Anony and the team's immense frustration. You obviously were not there. You may have shared more of the general sentiment if you had ridden 330 miles in the cold rain with me, slept on the cold ground and shivered through Saturday to watch the Buells run on Sunday. That was the main reason I went. I enjoy the fact that Buell is the definitive underdog in the FX class as much as the next guy. Watching them dig and claw their way to a 6th fastest time in the siting laps was thrilling. Watching them push the bike off right before the race was not. I cannot imagine what the team felt like...but I know I was bummed for them. It was a good effort, but it is going to take a boatload of money to compete with the factory boys. Guts, determination and ingenuity only go so far, except in Hollywood films. I hope that money is forthcoming and I will bet that the team does too. Anony is right that the speed was very encouraging...and I will be there in Daytona to watch the fruits of their labors. Go Buell | ||
| Jimidan |
Jscott sez: ""Hopefully we'll see 8 or 10 XBRR's (hell, why not 35?) at Daytona 2007 in which case a DNF or 2 won't seem like such a big deal. " That would be great! Although I would much prefer to have 1 or 2 show up at Daytona and the same 1 or 2 show up for every race thereafter. Results will follow." Jscott is correct, as the level of competition in FX is such that it will take a concerted effort by one or two teams to be successful. I don't think that spreading the scarce resources over 8 to 10 bikes to bring them up to par would get it. This season has shown that an out-of-the-box XBRR ridden by a privateer for a dealership is not going to be competitive in this series. It is apparent that the competition was underestimated at the first of the year and there is no use in keeping that myth alive. The dealership teams are competitive in ASRA and CCS, but FX is a whole other ballgame...the big leagues, as it were. Just look how Eric Wood who dominated in ASRA/CCS and struggles to finish in the top 10 in FX. We need a couple of bikes with full-on factory support, supplemented with major sponsors...just like the competition has. Jimidan | ||
| Jimidan |
Zac sez: "I don't think that the increase in crashes in the wet is due so much to the rain as much as we (at least most US riders) just don't have enough experience in the rain. It's easy to crash in either the wet or dry, but most riders know the limit in the dry much better than in the wet because they ridden orders of magnitude more laps in the dry. How many AMA teams test in the rain? They all pack up and leave the test. Granted, there are some tracks that are more dangerous in the wet because you can slide further on wet grass and pavement, but ask Jimmy Moore about sliding 200 yards through the woods at Brainerd on wet grass - that was off a dry track. Rain isn't the problem so much as the tracks..." I am not talking about just AMA riders. How 'bout them MotoGP racers, they seem to wreck much more readily in the rain. I can recall races where nearly all of the top riders were out by the end, some with injuries. Sure, rain is an equalizer where the guys who are not in contention for the season championship have the advantage, because they have little to lose. But racing has become more than just individual races strung together...it is all about the championship (although, I guess Buell fits in this category in FX). Jeremy said he did NOT want to race in the rain at Mid-Ohio. It hurts like hell to fall off of a speeding motorcycle in the wet too, even though you may slide better on wet grass. I don't think many riders prefer to race in the rain...at least not the sane ones. There is a reason AMA teams do not test in the rain, and it has to do with relative risks. Who can blame them? Riders have to finish the season to win. More of them should boycott races in the rain. NASCAR never races in the rain, and there is a pretty good investment in time and money at those races...and that is big time wrestling on 4-wheels. jimidan | ||
| Elvis |
Jimidan, If you rode 330 miles in the cold rain just to see Buell race, then you must be interested in seeing Buell race, right? If you want to see Buell race, then how can you not be thrilled with the most organized Buell racing we have ever seen? Were you happy with what Harley did the last time they raced? Would you like them to invest money, prop Buell up, have a few hollow victories and then have them pull the rug out? Or would you rather see Buell work and learn and make better bikes and find ways to win with what they have? My interests aren't quite the same as Anony's. Just like my son would like to have the Corvette at graduation, I'm sure Anony would like to have as much money as possible for the racing effort. The more Buell has to work and earn that, the better the bikes that you and I buy will be. Anony would probably like to have me pay $25,000 for my next Buell. I'd rather pay $4000, so while I'm a Buell fan, my interests and Anony's interests aren't one and the same. The bottom line is that you said: "I think we are all disturbed to an extent. . . " and I was pointing out that I wasn't disturbed. I've enjoyed this racing season more than any previous one. I've seen Buells performing at levels they've never performed before (though that's difficult to see because the competition is also performing at extremely high levels). You're welcome to be disturbed if you like, but please recognize those are your feelings and you don't speak for all of us. | ||
| Trojan |
Jimidan said: I also do not understand the allure with racing bikes in the rain...maybe it is a demented residual from the days of the gladiators or something. It is dangerous enough without putting a couple more lions in there with the christians. I think it is akin to how readily we send our youth off to war...we'd be much more reticent if all of us had to go fight. Frankly, I hate watching bike races in the rain anywhere, and wish they would not do it. They races are always boring, unreasonably dangerous, and always take a much higher percentage of casualties...regardless of what track they are on. I don't like watching racers being hurt, and would prefer that they race the whole season without having to recover from needless injuries from a fall in the wet. What is the purpose in this? It is madness, I say, madness! Like it or not, racing is all about the gladitorial instinct in all of us. Speed, power and danger are what makes us do it in the first place. However un-PC it may be, a lot of people watch racing just for the crashes. Why do you think we are shown repeated slow motion replays of every accident? I know lots of racers who not only enjoy racing in the rain but actually relish and look forward to it. Wet weather racing is a great leveller in terms of machinery and a great showcase for skilful riders. Have you ever noticed that the people who complain about riding in the wet are most often the same riders who enjoy a power/machine advantage in the dry? Riders are statistically more likely to be injured in a dry weather crash than in the wet. This has been proven and is due to a number of different factors, just a couple of which are: 1. Overall speeds (and corner speeds in particular) are slower in the wet. Riders will slide further on wet grass, but run off areas edged by fencing/walls should not be grass anyway. 2. Wet weather accidents are usually a result of loss of grip either under braking or mid corner, resulting in a 'lowside' accident where the rider slides into the gravel trap. Most dry weather accidents are caused by the classic highside (the rear slides then grips suddenly, launching the rider into the air and crashing down onto the track), or at high speed due to rider error or overtaking mishaps. Injuries from dry weather accidents are nearly always more severe than their wet weather counterparts. 3. Riders take more care in the wet, are more aware of the possibility of crashing and are more circumspect when it comes to overtaking other riders. As far as saying that wet weather racing is boring, which races have you been watching? Some of the greatest and most exciting races ever have been in the rain. If you have not seen Leon Haslam's BSB race win at Croft this year, when he made up 9 seconds in 2 laps to win at the last corner, was boring then maybe you should take up a different sport! The fundamental thing about circuit safety for motorcycle racing is this: If the circuit is dangerous in the rain then it is a fundamentally dangerous circuit and should not be used- period. Until someone builds an indoor track then racing in the rain will always be a part of the sport, and a part that offers it's own challenges and rewards. I for one would hate to see it stop. | ||
| Ceejay |
I don't think an outpouring of some money to keep Jeremy racing the bike, or to allow for more developing time is going to lessen the accomplishment of what is happing in anyone's eyes, especially the folks doing the work. Buell doesn't owe us as fans much if anything but it is very hard to cheer on a team participating in any sport if that team only shows up for practice, regardless if you own a similar bike(AMA), drink the same beer(Nascar), or your boy is playing on the field(football)...which is where I was going with my post, I completely understand what Buell is up against and I think I know what they are trying to accomplish, and if they are going to need money, they need fans, to need fans you need to put something on the track-thus I think it would have been better to run a fast race but not go for broke, the whole season, where it seems they are trying, and often times succeeding at competing with the high dollar boys, but at the cost of longevity/reliability...I can understand it as most of us think the same way-screw tomorrow I want to win...plus you have to take into account how quickly the class is progressing...OMO... | ||
| Whodom |
I think it would have been better to run a fast race but not go for broke, the whole season, where it seems they are trying, and often times succeeding at competing with the high dollar boys, but at the cost of longevity/reliability I agree with the first part of your statement, but it really doesn't look like the DNF's can be attributed to pushing the limits as you said in the second part. Someone said Crevier's engine let go at mid-Ohio, but have there been any other catastrophic engine failures this season? Practically all the failures I've seen mentioned are (relatively) trivial items that failed- clutch castings and ignition trigger plates (at Daytona), electrical gremlins, minor oil leaks, etc. Not to belittle anyone's effort in the least, but it seems they've been struggling just to get bikes put together in time for the races, and the types of failures they've had are a direct result, which must be unbelievably frustrating to the Buell guys. Judging from Jeremy's 6th place time during Sunday morning practice, he had the fastest XBRR ever, but it was taken out before the race even started by a minor primary oil leak. Then his backup bike dies on the first lap of the race due to an electrical problem. ARGH!!! I believe they need more practice and prep time, maybe more hands to help, and more hours/miles of racing, and all that's probably gonna take $$$. Hopefully it'll be forthcoming. At any rate, having the next few months to digest what they've learned this year and apply it to the XBRR's will have to be a huge help come next year. | ||
| Glitch |
But isn't racing all about going all out? | ||
| Jimidan |
Elvis sez: "Jimidan, If you rode 330 miles in the cold rain just to see Buell race, then you must be interested in seeing Buell race, right?" JD: Dee dee dee. Right! Elvis sez: "If you want to see Buell race, then how can you not be thrilled with the most organized Buell racing we have ever seen?" JD: Mike Ciccotto and Barney may argue that point...but, I regress. Elvis: "Were you happy with what Harley did the last time they raced? Would you like them to invest money, prop Buell up, have a few hollow victories and then have them pull the rug out? Or would you rather see Buell work and learn and make better bikes and find ways to win with what they have?" JD: These are false choices used to prop up your own argument (kind of like Osama bin Laden...great leader or greatest leader?). I would love for HD to step up to the plate with $$$ and I assure you that a few victories would be viewed by everyone (but you?) as anything but "hollow". If the Buell race program were successful, HD would certainly not pull the rug out. They pulled the plug on the VR1000 program because they perceived (correctly) that it had no chance of success. I suspect that mentality at the MoCo was responsible for at least some of the lackluster funding problems of the XBRR team this season...but I could be wrong. I am not an insider, but I have experience reading tea leaves. Elvis: "My interests aren't quite the same as Anony's. Just like my son would like to have the Corvette at graduation, I'm sure Anony would like to have as much money as possible for the racing effort. The more Buell has to work and earn that, the better the bikes that you and I buy will be. Anony would probably like to have me pay $25,000 for my next Buell. I'd rather pay $4000, so while I'm a Buell fan, my interests and Anony's interests aren't one and the same." JD: I am glad I am not your son! Lessee, "the more Buell has to work and earn that, the better the bikes that you and I buy will be." I bought the bit about your son appreciating things he earned but this sounds a bit more dubious...and I just don't see the connection. Would somebody smarter than me please explain it to me? Elvis: "The bottom line is that you said: "I think we are all disturbed to an extent. . . " and I was pointing out that I wasn't disturbed. I've enjoyed this racing season more than any previous one. I've seen Buells performing at levels they've never performed before (though that's difficult to see because the competition is also performing at extremely high levels)." JD: I have enjoyed seeing the Buells run faster than ever before, but ask Mike and Barney about competing successfully in FX...they had regular top 10 finishes with Ciccotto a 4th place at VIR. Sure the competition might be better now, but does the fact that if you plucked Fran Tarkington out of time during his prime, that he couldn't start now on an NFL team lessen his accomplishments? Elvis: "You're welcome to be disturbed if you like, but please recognize those are your feelings and you don't speak for all of us." JD: OK, everybody but Elvis is bummed about what happened at Mid-Ohio. He was elated  . But I see where you are coming from. jimidan | ||
| Jimidan |
Trojan man, I think it is a lot easier to love racing in the rain if you are watching it rather than doing it. If one watches the sport, one is not in the sport...one is a spectator. When a non-racer says that they are really into racing, they mean that they enjoy watching it as an activity. Racing is a sport...watching it is an activity. I am really into watching others race...and I like an occasional track day to act out my fantasies. I acknowledge that there are masochists walking amongst us, and that some folks like to live right on the edge, and then move over even closer. I guess if it is the only way a racer would ever get on the podium that he may like racing in the rain...but I don't think the best racers like it much. What on Earth do they have to gain? But that is just one man's stupid opinion. jimidan Likes Watching Racing (Message edited by jimidan on October 04, 2006) | ||
| Jimidan |
CeeJay sez: "Buell doesn't owe us as fans much if anything but it is very hard to cheer on a team participating in any sport if that team only shows up for practice, regardless if you own a similar bike(AMA), drink the same beer(Nascar), or your boy is playing on the field(football)...which is where I was going with my post, I completely understand what Buell is up against and I think I know what they are trying to accomplish, and if they are going to need money, they need fans, to need fans you need to put something on the track-thus I think it would have been better to run a fast race but not go for broke, the whole season, where it seems they are trying, and often times succeeding at competing with the high dollar boys, but at the cost of longevity/reliability...I can understand it as most of us think the same way-screw tomorrow I want to win...plus you have to take into account how quickly the class is progressing...OMO..." CeeJay, congratulations! That is the longest sentence ever recorded on Badweb . But I like where you are coming from. But like Hugh said, the things that have been taking Buell out lately have been leaking O-rings, blown sensors, ignition problems...minor stuff that probably isn't related to "go for broke" modifications. It is kind of like when my Uncle Benny died from an inflamed bunion (he was diabetic), my Aunt Mildred kept telling everybody, "Well, at least he didn't die from something serious!" jimidan (Message edited by jimidan on October 04, 2006) |
