| Author | Message | ||
     Eboos |
Who do you think will lead the championship chase next year? I think that it will be between Capirossi and Pedrosa. The smaller bike may be favorable to Pedrosa, plus with this years experience, he will be hard to beat. Capirossi has been pushing pretty hard this year, and from what I've read about this testing of the 08 bike, he seems pretty comfortable with it. What do you think? | ||
| Moboy516 |
I just hope it's not like when the 4 strokes were introduced. No one could touch the RC211V until Rossi helped develop the Yahama. It would be nice to see more teams on the grid next year. That said, Capirossi, Rossi, and Melandri have been extremely fast lately on the 990cc bikes. I wouldn't count KR JR out either, this entire season has been development of their chassis. | ||
| Trojan |
Jeez, what happened to 2007? Has it gone that fast? Seriously, Rossi still has to be favourite to win next year even before we see the new Yamaha. Other than him, look to the ex-250 riders to do the business on the smaller and lighter bikes, so Capirossi, Melandri, Pedrosa, Stoner, Nakano and a few others will be in the hunt for sure. Pedrosa still looks seriously flawed though, and until he can harden up, and learn to ride in the wet I can't see him taking the title from Rossi. Latest rumour is that Marco Melandri has signed a letter of intent to ride for Ducati next year alongside Capirossi. Now that would put the cat amongst the pigeons  The new BRITISH Ilmor is also apparently very quick in testing and with Gary McCoy aboard should be on the pace from day one. It will be interesting to see how it performs in the last two races of this year as a wild card entry. There may of course be some huge surprises in store too. Even the D'Antin squad could pull a few surprises if they get the same bikes as the factory Ducati squad, and depending upon who they eventually find to ride their bikes. If I had to put money a top 3 before the season starts it would be: Rossi Capirossi Melandri/Pedrosa (Message edited by trojan on September 27, 2006) | ||
| 12r |
Rossi to win, Pedrosa second. Third is anybody's guess. Pedrosa had some good battles in the 125s and 250s and next year he will be all over Rossi; he just needs to stop playing down his ability. If the 800s are going to suit anyone it'll be Pedrosa. The 800s are almost as fast as the 990s and they won't be anything like the 250s - it'll be the guys with a clean riding style who will run at the front. Of course, The Doctor is supremely adaptable and will take 2007 in his stride. Bring it on ! | ||
| Rocketman |
I thought Gibernau had a three year deal with Ducati? Given D'antin field two riders, I suppose it's possible Gibernau could move across to a Spanish outfit. Maybe Leon Haslam will join him? As for Melandri, who will get his ride at Honda? Seems like a lot of shuffling. I need to get this weeks MCN and see what Matt's reading. Next season, if that Ducati flies Capirossi's in the hunt. I predict that 2007 will be Rossi's toughest season yet, and if the Ducati is the bike to beat that is where Rossi's advantage will be over the Melandri's and Pedrosa's. Hard charging and ruthless. It's gonna be an all Italian top three this time next year. Capirossi Rossi Melandri Fourth place will be the first non Italian. Troy Freakin Frankenfurter, whoever he is. Rocket | ||
| Jimidan |
What about the current points leader, Nicky Hayden? Do you think that he is just going to go away? NOT! I think he will be in the hunt as much as any of them. He has been testing the new bike stuff all year, and I believe that has hampered his championship chances...they never would let him just ride the same bike two meets in a row. | ||
| Rocketman |
As much as I don't agree with those who've said Hayden isn't trying hard enough, I believe he's really digging his heels in, but I don't think he's got a cat in hells chance of been in the top five next season. This season has seen him gifted the lead since July. Hayden's consistency has rewarded him that much, but consistent podiums will not win a championship when the real contenders are running reliable and not falling off. That's been the case this season. Hayden is not in my book a world champion in the making. Not this season. Not ever. His luck has run out and despite his great talent which I believe he has, there is something the other guys like Melandri and Pedrosa have that he doesn't. Maybe it's the small bike 250cc syndrome, and that can only serve to better those guys again next season and not Hayden. Rocket | ||
| Daves |
My money is on Troy Frankenfurter riding the Team Rocket Ducati  I agree with you Rocket. Nicky has had a consistant, lucky year. He is a good rider but not a great rider. I like him but that doesn't change the way it is. I truly hope he wins the championship this year. It may be his best and only shot at it. It always amazes me the level of Moto GP riders. You can be AMA champion here in the US and then go to Moto GP and have your ass handed to you. Look at Colin Edwards. Great rider in the US, won the championship, has he won a GP yet? Nicky has done a better job in Moto GP than Colin has. I would love to see Maladin go to Moto GP, just so I could watch the GP guys kick his ass on the track. He will never do it. He knows and doesn't want to go play with the fast kids. I would like to see Spies go to GP. I think he could run with them after a couple seasons | ||
| Rocketman |
Yes I think Blake favours Spies too. Sadly I don't get to see the AMA stuff that often, if at all. Troy's a winner though. No one can beat Frankenfarter power  Rocket | ||
| Trojan |
I think Ben Spies would be up there with the top World Superbike riders, but I'm not so sure about MotoGP. maybe with a couple of seasons under his belt he would be good, but it would a steep learning curve. I don't think he has the comittment or hunger to do it either, as he has just signed a long term deal to stay in the AMA Superbike series with Suzuki. As with Mladin, it is sometimes more comfortable to the big fish in the small pond than to be the little fish in the big pond. Take a look at Neil Hodgson, WSB champion to also ran in MotoGP in one season. Very much the same story goes for Shakey Byrne, Nori Haga, Troy Bayliss and others. Jason DiSalvo would be my tip for the best US rider for MotoGP in the future. He has 125/250 experience in Europe and is certainly young enough to adapt. The established and well proven route to MotoGP is still to race at 250GP level, and it is a real shame that most countries have now dispensed with national 250 championships to bring on young talent ready to take on the GP regulars. Even in the UK the 250 class has been whittled away to just about nothing, with the top MRO 250 class being dropped for next year  The best supported national 125 and 250 championships are now the Spanish one, and look how many GP riders they produce every year. (Message edited by trojan on September 28, 2006) | ||
| Blake |
"Gifted the lead"? In MotoGP? That's funny! Matt, My view is that the big advantage of coming up through the 250GP class is that you learn the tracks and the surroundings. Even just knowing your way around the locales in Europe is an advantage. Note Hayden's dominance at Laguna Seca. Or were those victories of his there "gifts" as well. Good grief Rocket. Four Americans are in the top 9 with one leading the way. So why all the guys behind them if the 250GP experience is such an advantage in MotoGP? I don't think the 250 GP bike experience is much if any of an advantage in MotoGP. A Superbike is much closer, yet still a world away from a MotoGP bike than any 250GP bike. I think the advantage is knowing your way around the tracks and locales in Europe and abroad and being comfortable in your surroundings. Take one extremely fast Kentucky kid and send him to Europe to take on the world. That has got to affect performance. Home court advantage is not an imaginary thing. And again, being Rossi's team-mate for two years... who do you imagine garnered the priority from the HRC engineers? Same goes for Colin. It's too darn bad that the AMA saw fit to handicap the Ducatis the last few years in AMA SBK. Hodgeson never had much of a chance to act as an indicator of the relative talent in AMA versus WSB. DaveS, Colin was two-time WSBK champion. Who do you think the factory devotes their time priorities to, Colin or Valentino? His loss in Germany to Nicky I think has really affected him. | ||
| Trojan |
It isn't just the track knowledge, but also the MotoGP paddock politics, team setups and a host of other things that young guns learn in 250's. Probably the most important thing they get is exposure to the top factory teams and top sponsors every weekend, so that when teams come to pick their next riders the they knows just what they are getting and the rider hits the ground running. Learning tracks isn't the big deal that it once was, and a lot of riders admit that they learn circuits from Playstation games! Back in the days when 500 GP bikes were evil handling missiles the US riders had a distinct advantage over the Euro riders, simply because they had mastered the art of rear wheel steering much earlier than we had over here given their dirt track backgrounds. These days the emphasis has shifted away from the 'get it upright and squirt it' philosophy of the tyre shredding 500's and early MotoGP era to favouring a high corner speed style. This definitely favours the riders coming from 250's rather than the Superbike guys. The bikes are definitely becoming 'easier' to ride (although that is a very relative term!) than the previous GP bikes, with all the electronic aids on offer now. A few years ago it would be almost unheard of for a rider to make the sort of transition that Pedrosa and Stoner have made this year from 250-990, and be immediately and consistently in the top 5 (other than exceptions such as Rossi of course, and even he took two seasons to acclimatise). I do think the high corner speeds and lower outright power will cause a lot more crashes in the early days of the 800 era, simply because the riders will be on the edge even more than they are now. Riders like Nicky and KR Junior will be the ones who will have to change their riding style the most to get the best from the new bikes, but at their level they should adapt pretty quickly. Take a look at the top 10 MotoGP riders and the vast majority come from the 250 class. I can't see any big change in that in the next few years. | ||
| Trojan |
If you want tosee thenext generation of GP stars, here they are..  This is the Red Bull MotoGP Academy class of 2006, and they are being groomed for stardom from a VERY early age! | ||
| Blake |
Good point on the familiarity with teams and ancillary racing environs. I agree. "Take a look at the top 10 MotoGP riders and the vast majority come from the 250 class." Matt, Four of those top ten are Americans who did not come from the 250 class with the current leader stepping straight of an AMA V-Twin Superbike prior to entering MotoGP. I don't think the corner speed analogy is accurate at all, not for turns exiting to a fair bit of straight track. You hardly ever see a 250 rider sliding the bike on corner exit like the big bikes do. I don't think that it is valid to put the prior success of American riders all on their experience with dirt track. Not sure all of them were dirt trackers actually. I think they were just darn good. Things come in waves sometimes. We'll be back. Ben Spies has what it takes. Is a two-year contract really that "long-term"?  | ||
| Trojan |
The 250 riders don't slide out of turns because of a couple of reasons. Firstly they have a lot less power than a MotoGP bike, so any sliding will lose speed rather than propel the bike onto the straight like it does with a 990 4 stroke. Secondly, the actual mid corner speed of the 250 is higher than the 990 anyway, so they are probably travelling at the same or even higher speed than a bucking and sliding MotoGP bike on the corner exit as it is, so they have no need to slide the bike. The bigger bikes make up ground on the straights not in the turns. Of the 4 Americans in the top ten places, Colin Edwards has a moe 250 style and has raced 250's in the past, as has Hopkins & Roberts I beleive. Hayden is the odd man out at the moment by not progressing through the 250 class at some time. As far as Ben Spies two year contract goes, yes it is long term when you consider his age and what he can realistically hope to achieve on a world stage at the end of this contract if he wants to go there. It is pretty obvious that the money on offer at AMA is far more attractive to him than proving he can run with the best in the world in GP's. I am a big fan of Ben Spies, but can't help feeling that he doesn't have the drive to risk it all in te big time like Hopkins and Hayden have. A great shame but his loss in the end I feel. Please don't think that I have anything against US riders, because beleiev me I certainly don't. The world of Motorcycle racing would be a much poorer place without Roberts, Schwantz, Mamola, Lawson, Rainey, Kocinski, Spencer and the Hayden dynasty (forgive me if I have forgotten any). I just wish that the US sport wasn't so isolated from the rest of the world and that more promising US riders would make the switch to the world stage sooner rather than staying for too long in the domestic series. Jason DiSalvo, Jamie Hacking (British but who's counting), Josh Hayes, Jason Pridmore, Aaron Yates and in particular Josh Herrin are all riders who deserve to be in either World Superbikes or GP's and would aquit themselves very well. Josh Herrin is young enough to get into Europe and have a few seasons learning the ropes first, and and at just 16 is one of the brightest talents to emerge from the US scene in a few years in my opinion. He has both 125 and 250 exerience and a desire to compete at World Championship level. Perhaps Yamaha should replace Colin Edwards next year with this kid http://www.usgpru.net/profile.php?n=91&rl=   | ||
| 12r |
Today's riders are all namby-pambys. Take a look at this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aayk33huaT4&mode=related&search= Proper racing bikes on a proper racetrack. I remember when...yawn zzzzzzzzzzzzzz  | ||
| Davegess |
IMHO Nicky is still in the learning curve. He is definatly "too nice" inside his team where he and his tuner should be telling Honda what they need not the reverse. I suspect he is getting better at it. He has gotten tougher on the track also. He is rding very conservativly over the last 6-8 weeks but I don't think it reflects that he can't go harder. He is riding fast but not taking chances. Let the other guys risk a crash, prior to last week 4 guys had a shot at him IF they could gain enough point in last weeks race. IF any one crashes they are done BUT the guys behind have to risk that to try and catch him. Nicky is still in charge. If he falls down, and watching the end on Sunday trying to get past the Kawi was a pretty good way to get crashed out, he loses. Heck he picked up one point when the Kawi went down and almost 2 as teh Kawi rider almost took out the guy in fornt of him. I hop ehe wins the thing, what I want to see is Rossi winning the next race and getting Third or fourth, what ever spot it would need to be to set up a winner takes all showdown for the last race. I want to see Nicky and Val mano a mano. Only then will we know what Nicky is made of. BUT Nicky is smart enough to win the championship by finishing 6th if that is all it takes. | ||
| Diablobrian |
Yes, 12r that was some freakin HEROIC riding. Schwantz, Rainey, Doohan etc. are legends for a reason. There have been some pretty dramatic rides this year too though. Nicky's pre-tire change charge in Australia comes to mind. | ||
| 12r |
Yup legends for sure. The racing was technically slower then but so much more exciting. Let's face it, overtaking is the #1 reason for watching the racing and those guys were masters at seizing an opportunity and passing on the spur-of-the-moment. Today's higher speeds require much more planning and if it doesn't come off the riders are lucky to get another chance in the same spot. Meanwhile, here's another classic: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nj0UjUo5Jsw&mode=related&search= Can you imagine Vale and his M1 vs an R1 and a car ? Wow ! | ||
| Rocketman |
"Gifted the lead" If it were not for the misfortunes of others early and mid season, Hayden would not be heading up the title chase. That said, I take nothing away from his riding ability. I am not the one saying he isn't riding hard enough. In fact I said exactly the opposite. That said, the facts are the facts. Winning two races only is not going to be enough to get him the title despite his numerous visits to the podium. The math is simple, he needs to finish the next three races ahead of Rossi, or win some more, which in Hayden's case equates to the same thing. You see Rossi coming third in any of the next three races? I don't. In the 1930's my Granddad was a pretty successful professional fighter. During one of his fights his opponent was disqualified for a low blow. My Granddad, Tiger Pepper to you, argued with the referee to allow the fight to continue. My Granddad would never have allowed himself to be gifted a win. Tiger got his way and the fight continued, and he lost on points. Rocket | ||
| Diablobrian |
Your Grandad lost on points, but won in the categories of grit, determination and pride. Don't sell those values short! Modern society has become "soft" in many ways largely because people give up too easily when things become hard to accomplish. They are even rewarded for it in some cases because they have the foresight to recognize a "lost cause." I'm sure that kind of thinking appalls your grandfather. (or appalled him if He's no longer with us) Sorry to get off on a rant, but that's a sore spot for me. | ||
| Rocketman |
Absolutely Brian, and no Brian he's not. Granddad went to heaven in 1998 aged 87. Another time, Granddad had decided to travel to a fight out of town on his motorcycle. Remember this is the early 30's and not much traffic was around. I'd guess he might have been riding his Scott Squirrel, but anyway he fell off it and landed in a ditch at the side of the road. Luckily a farmer had spotted Granddad licking his wounds and struggling with the motorcycle and came over to help. Granddad arrived just in time to see a fellow fighter about to take his place in the ring. Of course Granddad was having none of this and managed quickly to get changed into his fighting attire and go on to win the fight. Rocket |
