| Author | Message | ||
     Shea |
Got my bike back today. They changed the plugs, reset the TPS, chagned the fluids and whatever else is done for a 1k mile service. No other problems they told me. I gear up and start the bike. WTF is that sound? I don't remember my bike rattleing around like it's doing now. The engine was a little noisy before, but now it's really making a racket. Normally, at idle, my exhaust helps to cover up the sound, but now the engine is almost louder than the exhaust. So, I went back in and asked a tech to come out and he said it sounds fine. I don't understand how I wouldn't remember it being this loud. Also, When my feet are on the pegs, I can now feel the rattleing in my pegs, which I have never felt before. Any ideas? Is this normal to do after the first oil change? I haven't really ridden it hard yet, but I do notice perhaps a little less low end, but that could just be my imagination since I am looking for a problem. (Message edited by shea on May 03, 2006) | ||
| Buellisti |
Idle may be set too low. | ||
| Shea |
They checked the idle and reset the TPS. Idle looks to be atleast 1k RPMs. | ||
| Rafartist |
No its not normal, but one day I came out and the primary chain noise seemed to jump out at me. I thought the damn motor was gonna come apart. They should have checked this too though, I believe it is one of the things on the checklist. Where is the noise coming from the front back which side. If it is concentrated toward the front left, there is a good chance its the primary. Make sure the fluids are where they are supposed to be too. I wouldn't stand for the "its normal" line, if it only does it after they messed with it, it seems to me that they should find the cause. | ||
| Buellfirebolt31 |
Primary chain, Clutch cover gasket, Inspection cover gasket, lines lubed, motor fluids dumped, cables lubricated, clutch adjusted, but NO PLUGS UNTIL 10K Service, these are all done in the 1K service. | ||
| Shea |
It's coming from the right front. I tried looking up the part in the manual, but it's not in there. It's the part of the engine with the decaled plate it in for looks, with XB12 Lightning written in it. | ||
| Shea |
The plugs were my idea. I wanted to pro series plugs in it. | ||
| Shea |
http://www.ironmachine.com/product_info.php?products_id=399 That's where it's coming from the most. (Message edited by shea on May 03, 2006) | ||
| G234146 |
Take the bike back. same thing happened to me after the first 1000 mile service. noise just got louder and louder. sort of like a knocking, clanking thing that was NOT there before. They replaced something on the thing under warranty. now its fine. (But I'm no mechanic, can u tell?) http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/32777/155801.jpg | ||
| Diablobrian |
only thing directly under that cover is an inductive timing rotor and pick-up. behind that you have your cams and below them your oil pump. | ||
| Shea |
Thanks "G". The service woman told me that there were no recalls of any sort for the bike, so I just took her word for it. I will be calling first thing tomorrow. I am sooooo pissed right now, considering I had to get my step father to take me out there today, and now I won't have another chance to get it out there until next week. I should tell them to come and get it since the place is so far and they are making me come back out there when I shouldn't have to. | ||
| G234146 |
Shea, I'll call my dealer tomorrow and find out exactly what they did. I'll post it here, that should give you a lead for your questions. Im on PST time. | ||
| Stretchman |
TPS RESET. The reason that it is capitalized is that the bike needs to relearn after it has been reset. Riding 10 minutes or so at about 3500 RPMS should make a difference, or so I have heard. I imagine the tech may have done this, or may not have. I do not know. If not, then there is a tech bulletin on the compensator sprocket nut. Sometimes that loosens up, and needs to be retorqued. | ||
| Sgthigg |
Sounds possibly since the noise wasnt there before. And the only thing they do at a 1k service that could cause it to sound like this. Is the primary chain adjustment/check they do. They might of set it too loose if the noise is coming form the left side. On the right side?????I dunno. Sorry | ||
| Pcmodeler |
I feel for you. Same thing happens every time I take my bike in for service. Took it in for bearing replacement......front brake is spongy when I get it back; take it in for right front fork seal replacement........pulsing when I use the front brake now; take it in for TPS reset, oil change, fix oil leak........bike starts badly, bike hesitates and near stalls (I had to replace engine temp sensor), etc.........seriously, I quit taking it there. I honestly feel they were destroying my bike on purpose. | ||
| Dmextreme |
What's it cost to reset the TPS? | ||
| Mikej |
Anywhere from free to an hour of the local shop time charge, depending on your local shop and your relationship with them. | ||
| Shea |
They reset mine for free, since it was off in the first 1k miles. I called today and talked to the Buell tech that worked on it. He mentioned that one possibility would be that the new synthetic is a slight bit thinner and could just not be damping the sound as much as the old oil. His solution was to keep riding the bike and to just listen and make sure it doesn't get louder. Also, I talked to him about that service bulletin and he told me that service bulletins Harley doesn't pay for. The nut would actually have to come loose in order for it to be paid for under warranty. | ||
| Anonymous |
It's impossible to say over the internet what the issue is. However, if the crankshaft primary sprocket nut is making noise (and a number of early 2006 bikes seem to have this), then it has come loose. So the risk is that they look at the nut and it isn't loose, then it wouldn't be warrantied, but then there would be one item out of the way in the search for the noise. One VERY important item: To actually know whether the torque was right, the mechanic needs to put a mark (paint ot marker) on the nut and adjoining part, then break the bolt loose and retorque. If the marks no longer align when the right torque is put on, then the torque was wrong. The reason for this is that there is a breakaway friction torque on a tightened bolt that is higher than the actual torque that the bolt was tightened to. Static friction is always higher than dynamic friction is the reason behind this. So, if the mechanic looks at the torque required to loosen the bolt and it is at the recommended torque, that does not tell the right story. It will take a much higher torque to break the bolt loose than what was required to tighten it. | ||
| Shea |
So, what do you suggest Anon.? I think the tech was suggesting I ride it and wait for something to happen, which I can understand on his part, but on my part, I don't want to be stranded with a broken down bike. | ||
| Anonymous |
I suggest you really do make sure you are paying attention to if the sound gets worse, or better yet, listen to another similar bike to see if there is a difference. | ||
| Midknyte |
No one has pointed out, but I do not believe that primary chain slack is an item checked at the 1000 mile mark. If it turns out to be that, it was probably not checked. It is on the service list to be checked and adjusted at the 5000 mile checkup. A loose primary chain sounds like someone snuck a wooden marble into your transmission... | ||
| Bodyshot1 |
Primary socket nut was my problem after the 1k service..unreal! the first reaction from the (buell)shop guys was to deny ever working on the bike!! One of the ol'time Harley wrenches fixed it right up..knew exactly what it was... not a comforting experience..  | ||
| Shea |
Ok, so I have some good news. I went to the local Harley shop, I know, I know. Well, I found a guy who works on Buells on the side. He came out and I talked to him about it and the first thing he asked after listening was "Did you get the Syn3 oil?" I had. He told me that it's normal for that side of the engine to get noisier after getting Syn3 oil due to a different chemical make up. The Syn3 lacks, I think it was carbon, and that helps deaden the noise. He said that noise is always there, but normal oil covers it up well. After that, he told me that him and another tech there love working on Buells and they do in privately too. They charge $30 an hour for the services. They will do basic maintanance, changing tires, fluids, and adjustments, tune ups etc. They even come out to your house if you ask them to. Is that service or what!!?? | ||
| Pcmodeler |
Man, what a freaky coincidence. I just got back from the Honda shop. Turns out two of the techs there own Buells. One of them told me that he could work on some of my stuff as well (anything but the computer stuff). Nice to find someone in town that finally knows enough about Buells and is knowledgeable. Not like my local Buell dealership. | ||
| G234146 |
Shea, I just called the dealer. They said I had a loose primary chain tensioner. For me, this was the issue that was making the funky noise on the right side, where the decaled plate is at. Hope this helps! | ||
| Jon_s |
Anonymous, if the nut is loose (to the extent that it is making noise) there won't be any breakaway torque to speak off. We recently checked the nuts on three 05 bikes. In hindsight, I wish we had marked the nuts to verify the torque, but we didn't. In my opinion, all the nuts were correctly tightened at the factory. The amount of torque need to break them loose was considerable. I used a 33 inch breaker bar and even with that it took everything I had to get the nuts loosened. I don't think this is as widespread a problem as is believed. Shea, I'd be looking for another tech. A change of oil will not account for increased rattling in the motor nor vibration in the foot rests. Given that statement, I'd check the oil tank to ensure that there's even oil in there. | ||
| Shea |
Jon, I checked the oil when I got home and the level was perfect. Funny thing is, I had both the Buell tech at Gettysburg and the tech at the local shop (Laugerman's) tell me the same thing; going to syn3 will cause more noise and that it sounded ok. | ||
| Jon_s |
Shea, if anything, I'd check the primary tensioner as G234146 indicated. Sounds more reasonable to me than an oil change. I run synthetic oils (Klotz) in all the bikes that I service and have never noted any change in increased noise and vibration. For that matter no customer has ever mentioned it either. | ||
| Shea |
If I check the primary, this means I need to drain the oil, correct? | ||
| Anonymous |
Jon_S I agree that by the time the sprocket is clanking around there is little torque left. BUT, the check still needs to be done right because the problem could surface later, and while you are in there it's so easy to make sure it is not a future problem. I know of a number of instances where the nut has been checked at dealerships using the breakaway torque, and then the nut has come off later. No kidding. And the problem is prevalent enough to be definitely on the radar Buell this year. Now our warranty problems are low, so it makes it easy for problems to stand out. But quite frankly, someday we all want to be at virtually zero in warranty issues and customer disappointment, so we take every problem seriously. | ||
| Jon_s |
No. To check the primary tension you need only remove the top cover on the primary case. Put the bike up on a rear stand, place it in gear and rotate the rear wheel. The chain wheels run a little eccentric so the chain will be tighter in spots. If the primary chain is loose enough to be making noise, it'll be apparent. Free play (at the tightest spot) should be in the 1/2" range and no more on a cold engine. | ||
| Jon_s |
Anonymous, as I said I should have marked the nuts for future reference. It's a good tip and I'll use it in future. Is it possible that only bikes built in a certain period were affected? Seems to be more prevalent with the 06 Uly's.... | ||
| Wsplrll |
" I had both the Buell tech at Gettysburg and the tech at the local shop (Laugerman's) tell me the same thing; going to syn3 will cause more noise and that it sounded ok." Shea - I just had the 1000K service done on my XB9SX and the idle was lowered to where is should be and added synth 3 and it is a little more "rattlely" but I closed my visor and it really doesn't bother me. I figure it is under warranty and I pay attention to anything that changes. It runs fine. | ||
| Bodyshot1 |
Jon_s ..mine is an 06 Ss... | ||
| Anonymous |
Jon_s, Although it can appear on earlier bikes, it is most likely to appear on 2006 XBs built prior to September of 2005. Why the 2006 models were hit more no one can confirm, but it must have been that some of the nuts were lower on the torque range than prior years. The reason it is seen mostly on Ulysses is that is by far the majority of what was being built at that time. After the change to the higher torque range was implemented in September, there have been no other occurrences. Now the lowest torque in the range is higher than the prior highest torque, so since it already wasn't a lot of bikes, we have a big margin now. | ||
| Shea |
Wspl, that makes me feel a little better. I just put about 50 miles on the bike, running through gears, RPMs etc and it seemed to run ok. When I got it home, I was at the bottom of th driveway and suddenly it sounded louder, but then quickly went back to the normal "loud" rattleing. I hope to be getting my torque wrenches soon, so I can check the damn thing myself. If it's loose, I will be notifying Gettysburg. I should send Harley a bill too. lol I guess I need that link part in order to do it too. So, lemme get this straight. I have to loosen it first, clean it, put locktite on it, then tighten to appopriate torque? | ||
| Shea |
Sound is def getting worse today. I don't have a torque wrench yet, so I am going to try and get this guy to torque it for me ASAP. |
