| Author | Message | ||
     Gearheaderiko |
PS SE 550 cams and stock XB head will bolt right on! | ||
| Ezblast |
Yeah but I'd still hand the head to wes to breath on - explaining your needs and goals - I'm sure he can do you right - the XB head would just make it easier - lol GT - JBOTDS! EZ  | ||
| Ezblast |
Note: CycleRama = Wes | ||
| Mmelvis |
Thank for all the input. All this information is of great help. Have a great day | ||
| Blake |
Erik, No, unfortunately as of February of last year, NRHS no longer sponsors BadWeB. They do still think it is a great place though, just like I still believe that they do good work. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
I was very happy with the work NRHS did for me. | ||
| Ezblast |
Ditto | ||
| Buelldyno_guy |
I have not posted here for a while as I have been very busy at H-D Buell of Vallejo Performance Services which is now Vallejo Performance Services a stand alone company. ... We use nothing but Rev Perf plated cylinders and have never seen or measured any wear, even on the race bike. The marks one sees in the cylinders are normal and are not wear, they are deposits and material transfered from the piston. A ball hone will remove them all without touching the bore. These cylinders are so hard that only a diamond hone will cut them. ... The issue was an older casting that would crack and now that Brian is there the problem has been taken care of. ... I believe the issue is with Brian no longer part of NHRS, they have no desire to use Rev Perf Cylinders manufactured by the competition. ... BTW my 600 cc blast made 53 by 40 Hp and Tq. The new 650 long stroke is on the Rev Perf Dyno as you read this and I can't wait for the results. ... Terry | ||
| Naustin |
 - Hey Terry, I talked to Jack and he thinks your bike is sweet. I just joined FSSNOC last week... Can't wait to hear about that 650! :tup: | ||
| Ezblast |
Love that torque Number! Yeah 40 lbs! You just beat the HD race team by 5 ftlbs of torque at their best! Sweet! GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Mmelvis |
Heard from CycleRama, my bike is ready for pickup. Not sure what was done to the bike basically told Wes more power he said "OK". What I really hate is I have to wait till Saturday to pickup my bike. Once again work gets in the way. Anyway will post up when I have all the details. Have a great day | ||
| Ezblast |
Sounds great - looks like good times ahead - you lucky dog - Wes is an artist! GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Naustin |
Cool! Can't wait to hear what they did and how it runs!! | ||
| Xgecko |
Since I'm on travel for about half of the rest of this year I'm gonna have money to spend on my blast come wintertime. So please post your results and what was done when you find out | ||
| Mmelvis |
Well got the bike back and all I can is I real happy. I have not had a chance to get the RPM's up over 3500 have to break in the engine for 500 to 600 miles before I can really test it out. Wes is a great guy and I spoke with him for about 20 minutes when I was picking up the bike loading it up the trailer. After I get the break in miles done I can take it back to Wes for the dyno tune and find out how much power this thing is putting out. Total price out the door including labor is 1387.79. Work that was done was a 515 kit install and head work. Lifters are stock, cams are still the pro-series, springs were replaced on the heads. I am told that I should not have any problem running up to 7k on the RPM's when break in is completed. Feels like a lot more low end grunt, Wes commented that it pulls real real good on the low end. Now I have the task of driving slow and varying the RPM's to properly break in all the new parts. Have put about 100 miles on the bike since I picked it up yesterday. Must say I am grinning ear to ear and can not wait till I get to run wide open. Will post up more information when available and when I get the dyno tune done. Have a great day | ||
| Marijane0569 |
Sweet sounds great. "MJ" | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
Looking forward to that dyno run! | ||
| Jprovo |
I'm excited to see the results! | ||
| Naustin |
Too cool. Those guys you've been racing against are in for a surprise next time you get to the track... (Message edited by naustin on May 15, 2006) | ||
| Berkshire |
This was in the the 600cc thread: The 600cc requires case disassembly for boring. You could bore the Blast out to 550cc on the stock cylinder also, and add a Wiseco piston for 10.5 to 11.5 comp... Are you sure about that? It looks like the cylinder would have to be bored out from 3.500" to 3.700" - that's a .200" overbore, which seems excessive. Based on the available pistons, the common overbores seem to be .015" (3.515" bore) and .030" (3.530" bore). There is also a 3.563" size listed but it's listed as a separate size, not as an oversized 3.500" The 3.563" size is the bore for the 515cc kit (3-9/16"). Since the kit includes an aftermarket cylinder, and since the 3.563" pistons aren't listed as oversized 3.500" parts, it seems possible that the 3.530" may be the largest practical bore for the stock cylinder. This would yield 509cc with the stock stroke. Can someone confirm (or refute) this? If the stock jug IS limited to a 3.530" bore, does anyone know of an OEM Harley or Buell cylinder that will fit the stock crankcase opening and CAN safely be bored to 3.563", or even 3.700"? ...883? ...984? ...80's EVO sportster? If there were an OEM cylinder that was about halfway in between the 515 cylinder and the 600 cylinder, could the bottom end of the cylinder be turned down to fit, instead of boring the case opening? Does anyone know the I.D of the crankcase opening, and the O.D. of the bottom end of the stock cylinder and/or some of the others? | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
My guess is all the answers are here,archived. Maybe EZ remembers where he got the 550cc stock bore from. Might be a mistake or only done with a different crank. I dont think any other stock HD/Buell cylinder can be bored more with reliable results. Whether you bore out or shave the cylinder down it still comes up as a gamble. If its a short life engine, doesnt much matter. But at the price of getting the case bored its better to go safe, costwise in the long run. You can bore a stocker out to the 515. And engines have been bored .070 over (or more) for years. Depends a lot on your money (to spend or lose) and availability of machining tools . Some of the Badweb sponsors will have the dimensions you're looking for and they can be found somewhere else but I cant remember where (at the moment). I dont think theres a reliable shortcut to a bigger bore than 515. I'm certainly not the last word on the big bore, so if you come up with contradicting info, please share. I'd love to find a shortcut! (Message edited by gearheaderiko on June 25, 2006) | ||
| Ezblast |
The 550cc was the max bore for a racing venue,its been upped to 650cc - the same limit that Terry is working with now for LSR - lol - would be a custom stroke - just a bit smaller than the XB12 - the 600cc kit which was really 583cc - so with less stroke than the 1200XBR but more than the XB9 and a 600/583cc kit - bringing it to 650cc and allowing the higher RPM than the 12 as well. If you where pure racing and money no object - you'd square bore and stroke to 800cc - the near max for drag Sporster I've seen up to 1800cc - however, I feel that would be too edgy - I've seen several 1600cc bikes survive seasons intact racing, so I figure the bore isn't that weakening - its usually lower end bearing changes schedualed for mid-season. GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Berkshire |
800cc!!!  That would be blasting on the REALLY dark side! Forget about calling it "darth" something - that bike would be the freakin death star!!! Well, okay, maybe "Sidious" would be appropriate - he seems to have been pretty powerful... I guess the death star title would have to go to a drag bike, like the bad mofo on display where I get my parts at Mancuso HD. Thanks for the info - I think I'm getting the picture now. I don't want to open the cases (for now, anyway), so all the exotic stuff is totally out of the question. Yep, I was hoping for a shortcut!  I guess I should have known - if there was an OEM Harley jug that could be had for $40 on ebay that would drop right in, and take a bigger bore, there would damn sure be a thread or two about it in here! If the stock jug will go to 515cc reliably (no temperature-related problems, etc.), then that's almost certainly the way I'll go. I MUST have more power! Any idea what it would take to go mid 12's? }  | ||
| Ezblast |
From a friend - Tell him he CANNOT Bore a stock cylinder to 515cc.. and actually it's ONLY 510cc ! But it cannot be bored that far either...as the cast iron cylinder walls of a stock jug are too thin. The max size that an OEM jug for the blast can be bore is .030" over to the final bore size of 3.530" = 501cc ! There are no Hurricane pistons made between bore size 3.530" and the 515-kits 3.563". AND you cannot use a Wiseco piston with a stock blast cylinder head, as all their hi-comp domed pistons are designed for XL Thunderstorm Heads only ! Hope that helps as well - the 1600cc sportsters where breaking 10s - so its possible I'd guess to break 12s - but really - your not talking about a long lived engine - 25,000 would be the max life - short but sweet! GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
a friend? hmmm.... Why was (non badweb sponsor ) willing to bore out MJs stock cylinder to 3.563? Or was MJ mistaken? The 510-515 remark is just splitting hairs. Its the same as the Blast being a 500 but its really a 492. Boring .070 is usually a risk. And all this assumes you're only going to be using HD/Buell spec parts. Piston swapping (between different makes) is an old trick. | ||
| Berkshire |
I don't know how I came up with 509cc - maybe a combination of wishful thinking and late-nite math! LOL Everybody knows that OEM's are full of crap when it comes to naming products, but I'm really surprised that a performance company would misrepresent the displacement of a displacement-increasing kit! Apparently OEM's aren't the only companies where marketing weasels have more clout than the people who actually develop the products that are being sold. I looked at Wiseco's online catalog under "Buell" and "Evo sporty", and the biggest oversize I saw for a 10.5:1 3.5" was .040" for regular XL heads. If the dome on those is the same as a Blast dome, then that would be something to consider. The other question is weight. Although I don't recall ever seeing any piston weights listed, various things I have read imply that piston replacement and top-end work is basically a "bolt on" job, so I assume that a piston will be the same weight as the stock piston for which it's listed as a replacement, with no re-balancing needed. If that's true, then the other question is whether an XL and/or an XB piston weigh the same as a Blast piston. 501cc would be pretty nice - the price is definitely right, there's no question about the reliability of the bore size, and it would make the bike an honest "500", with enough compression to support a more aggressive cam. A .040" over Wiseco would make it a 504 - a hair-splitting improvement over a 501, but worthwhile as long as the price, quality, weight, and dome shape are comparable to the Hurricane. In the world of '86-up small-block Fords, the question of maximum overbore has several different answers. The "standard" rebuild is a .030" overbore, but smaller sizes are available, as well as larger sizes. For a "low stress" stock rebuild or a "run it till it blows" low-budget racecar, most people consider .060" over to be okay. But for a reliable high-performance street-driven car, most people consider .060" over to be problematic. In reality, those are just guidelines - the truth is that some blocks are better than others. The difference between the wall thickness of a 3.530" bore and a 3.563" bore is only about .016" - roughly the thickness of 4 sheets of typical "office" paper! That doesn't seem like enough to make any difference, but apparently it does make SOME difference - the question is "how much?" On the other hand, the difference between a 501 and a 510 is only 1.8% - if a 501 makes 35 hp, then an identical 510 should only make 35.6 hp. That's not much of a difference, but I guess every tenth helps! | ||
| Ezblast |
Repost: LOL - I was just talking With Brian Nallin at our Sponsor Revolution Performance because something Erik Buell mentioned at the dinner last year has been nagging me - he said that if you offset (fill in the old cyl. mounting holes and bore new ones) the cylinder - keeping the same stroke - you could go to 650cc - he said that they did a factory version of this - it produced 50hp using shelf parts and was a world of fun - hmmmmm - so that would be smaller than 4" jug/cyl - Brian said you could go all the way up to 4" - sounds like fun so far - right? (- by the way Brian said this would be no problem to do on the Blast -) Then lets say you stroke it to XB12 size - hmm - wow! - There is the 809cc Blast - now in unlimited singles - this would be the ultimate stump puller - he said that with that size the 729 cam would even be a streetable cam to use - lol - by the way - he is selling the 45"kit to any interested parties, however, the 809cc kit sounds like the ticket to me! Now thats Thump! GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Berkshire |
Does that mean that the stock Blast (and presumably the twins as well) setup is such that the centerline of the cylinder does NOT intersect the centerline of the "crank"? ...so the "stroke" the piston sees is less than 2x the distance between flywheel pin centers? (Message edited by berkshire on June 29, 2006) | ||
| Ezblast |
I'll Ask! GT - JBOTDS! EZ | ||
| Blake |
Answer is no, the centerline of cylinder bore intersects centerline of crank. The extra wide cylinder stud pattern is doable on a Blast but not on the twin cylinder engines. On a twin, the innner studs would likely hit each other in the expanded bolt pattern form. Not to mention that without raising the deck height, the problems with the pistons and cylinders hitting each other. So, it works for a single, but not the 45 degree twins.  |
