| Author | Message | ||
     3boyz |
I have built and raced Buells for about six years now and I am very interested in building a bike to run at various land speed venues. I sold my 1998 S3 and my 1995 S2 that were both modified for drag racing and I am currently building a 99" Sporty for all types of racing. The chassie is a 1989 XL frame with a lightweight widened swingarm adjustable from 62"-68". PMFR wheels and frontend. No fairing (as of now). The motor is going to be a maxed out set of Buell cases, S&S stroked rods and wheels, Red Shift cams 585 or 643's (have both), 1.94 T-storm heads(maybe XB), 12:1, T-jetted D or a HSR 48, nothing exotic for a motor just a good reliable runner, expecting around 140-150h.p. Bike and rider under 600lbs. My first question would be about gearing, second would be about the benefit of lightening the flywheels, third would be cam choice and last carb. I feel I have a very good understanding about what works on the strip but not the salt. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Rob | ||
| Moxnix |
That White & Blue S2 with the 10" extended swing arm you sold would have made a fine LSR bike. The NRHS bike is an S2 with 1987 bodywork. There are a number of threads in the archives that have dealt with setting things up for LSR. Sorry I can't pinpoint any. Try your question in the Old School Buell section . . . | ||
| Firemanjim |
Rob,you should look at the SCTA website for an idea of current records in classes you might run in.Quick primer--M class is modified,basically anything that is not stock from factory will put you there,A class is more exotic,frames change,wheelbase gets longer,etc.The engine sizes listed are the max for that class--i.e.if you run in the 1000cc class you cannot be 1010cc or you are in next class up.Also,you will be in the P engine class for pushrod engines. So your naked bike with a 1350 motor will run in the M-1350 PG or PF (G is gas,F is Fuel) SCTA provides an event gasoline and to run the gas class means you fill up there and get tank sealed.The fuel class is any fuel not from event supplier--so alcohol,nitro,nitrous,or just Shell gasoline will be Fuel class.Look here for SCTA stuff http://www.scta-bni.org/ Look here for a copy of SCTA rulebook adopted by DLRA,not newest one though so buy latest from SCTA.http://www.dlra.org.au/rulebook.htm You are running flat out for 3 miles so cam choice and carb are important.Flywheel lightening not so much.Gearing is dependant on what hp you have and top speed attainable with it.Trial and error,bring a stack of sprockets.Bonneville is at 4400' of elevation so take that into account.Come on out,tons of fun. | ||
| 3boyz |
Thanks, I really enjoy building something and seeing results firsthand (riding it). I enjoy all kinds of racing but with three boys at home I can't travel like I used to. LS racing is something that won't consume my family life but still give me what I am looking for as a racer. Look for me and thanks for the help. | ||
| Firemanjim |
Hey,Rob.You did not say where you are based? How old are the boys? LSR pretty family oriented,lots of families there,dogs,etc.My teen son has come several times and actually did some record runs.Lots of fun.We bring the small pit bikes and go play on the miles of salt practicing our dirt tracking slides. | ||
| 3boyz |
I am 31 years old and I have a beautiful wife and three very cool boys. They are 8,5 and 4 years old. They all learned to ride at the age of three on a Suzuki JR50. They always say, " Dad taught us to ride before he taught us how to tie our shoes!" For Christmas the boys received a jet black pup they named "Vader". And we live along the Mississippi river In Dubuque,IA. I race with Clay Wilwert of Wilwert's H-D/Buell and we have a BLAST! I sold my S2 to Blake sometime ago and wish I had it back now! I listed a pic of it on S2 only pictures. I am leaning more toward XL based stuff because I do my own heads and it is soooo much easier to work on. I am not trying to dig up anyones set-up but I will be buying sprockets soon and need to know where to start. Also, I'm interested to know how fast everyone thinks my bike will go, and what H.P. gets you what speed ( in theory). Thanks | ||
| Firemanjim |
Go back through some of Aaron Wilsons stuff on gearing and what was needed HP wise at Bonneville.Other good info sources are www.landracing.com and www.suzukihayabusa.org on the landspeed section. If you have realistic idea of what your motors are capable of you can guess at speed. Buell is XL based and with bodywork you can get faster with less hp.Aaron's M-2 with 121 HP and change went 151+ with Pete Moltmann on it and he's no small package.1350 pushrod naked records are all in the 160-170 mph range.1650 records range from 168-180.Both of the M class records are held by S&S cycles bike,might be tough ones. The 2000cc records are all slower than the 1650 ones at 157-171,so a motor bigger than 100"(1650cc) would get in those classes. You are not competing against me as I am all turbo classes now.I have a 22/23/24 front and rears all the way down to 36 IIRC.Have run both 5 and 6 speed set-ups. | ||
| 3boyz |
Thanks Jim I'll check out those sites and do a little more reading. I am so used to building bikes according to someone else's rules and it's been a little frustrating. Make a bike super fast, only to add weight and slow it down to comply with the rules. I have some new ideas and I'm going to build the bike I've wanted to build for some time. I'll call it "My Way". I'm just looking to have some fun with it not light the world on fire. Thanks again, Rob | ||
| Madduck |
Rob, Download the motorcycle rules changes for 2006 from www.landracing.com site. A lot of bikes that ran last year are now illegal. Aaron can't run his M class bikes cuzz only HD motors are allowed now. There is also a whellbase requirement which will probably put all of the existing records out of reach. Gonna be hard to beat any of the existing records the way rules are set up now. My suggestion would be to build an A class bike from the ground up. Best of luck and racing is more fun than record setting anyway. Paperwork is a pain and making that backup run at 7 am is a pisser. The real fun is blasting off down the salt in the company of like minded individuals. You will meet some of the best people in the world out on that salt flat. Paul | ||
| Madduck |
Rob, We run an extremely light flywheel to reduce the mass that needs to be spun up by the motor and decrease torque load to the primary chain. You will need at least two row primary chain, one row will cause issues. Rear wheel hp is critical but you need wide torque band to keep the rear tire from spinning at high rpm shift points. Speed comes from experience, just like in drag racing. Bring lots of sprockets, everyone else does and you do want to fit in. Hope to see you out there. | ||
| Blake |
"decrease torque load to the primary chain" That seems opposite to what I am thinking. Less flywheel => higher peak chain loading. | ||
| 3boyz |
I'll download the rules and weigh my options. Is it possible to build a dual purpose drag/lsr bike with only sprocket changes? We have a great local strip and I'd be stupid not to take full advantage of it. I'm a no bar guy so the transition wouldn't be a big deal. But the age old fly wheel lightening concerns me. I'll be building a stroked XL and many tell me to leave the weight when stroking. Anyway, I am looking forward to having some fun. Half the fun is building it! Thanx, Rob | ||
| Madduck |
Rob, It should be possible to build an A class chassis to easily do both types of racing. Don't think gearing will be as big an issue as motor type. In drage racing you have traction and 1/4 mile run. At Bonneville you have a two mile run up to a one mile long timing trap. Allow for anywhere from 5% to 17% slippage at the rear tire at speed. Did I mention the dance the bike gets into at speed across the rutted surface. Some people like it, others park and walk away. Try the salt out slowly and cheaply your first time there. You will get plenty of advice, all of it useful to some degree. But it boils down to just you on the bike finding your limit. You will need at least two people to run the bike. Race vehicles cannot move under their own power when not racing. Should you set a record, tech will tear down and verify that day to certify your record. Be prepared to rebuild if you want to race some more. | ||
| Firemanjim |
Paul,we always had them seal our engine and were allowed to run another class with teardown at the end. | ||
| Prior |
Rob, If you need any help building that baby, give me a shout. I'm up for a trip across the river! Alex | ||
| Madduck |
Jim, SCTA instituted a new policy last year. All record bikes get torn down and verified when the record is set. They had a problem with several competitors in 2003 setting multiple records with illegal motors. They will seal engine after first tear down so you can race the rest of the year without further tear down tho. | ||
| 3boyz |
Is anyone getting better than 180cfm @10" /.650 with XB heads? | ||
| Firemanjim |
#boyz,get hold of Pammy and Wes at Cyclerama--look in Sponsor section. | ||
| 3boyz |
I have just about completed the swingarm which will allow me to change the wheel base fairly easy. I set it up to run without bearings but added bushings and zerk fittings in the case the terrain is too rough I could run shocks. I will be starting on the rear fender/seat combo this weekend. The next step is cutting down the fork tubes (about 6"). I'll post some pics soon. Rob | ||
| Madduck |
3boys, Download the latest rule changes from www.landracing.com before you get too much farther along. The official rule book is shipping now, get one asap. Most of the changes affect the modified class. Wheelbase can now only be 10% over stock and you will need documentation etc. General stuff is in car sections so you need to be familiar with both car and bike rules. be safe and have fun | ||
| 3boyz |
I'll check into it asap. Thanks for the heads up. Rob | ||
| Gregr |
Rob, I just found this surfing around tonight. Greg Reddick |
