| Author | Message | ||
     Musqaush |
I realize this might be a little unorthodox,, maybe there might be some old schoolers present My buddy had his 67 shovelhead cylinders bored slightly as to compensate for rear cylinder oil consumption ,,ironically do to lack of compression and the bikes tune at the time was compensated for the lower compression ,,long story short ,,naturally its harder to kick over and will start more reluctantly when cold ,,but after the many stage break in process repair ,,it is contrary to start again timing appears to be set at least enough to start ,,and carb will allow to run ,,but as it is kick only and we both damn near threw our legs out trying to start it im reaching out for insight of others with more knowledge ,,,i appreciate your time and insight and patience to reading my long winded post ! | ||
| Road_thing |
If it's got (1) air, (2) gas, and (3)spark, it oughta go. 1) Air is likely not the problem. I'd pull the air cleaner just to be sure. 2) It does have gas in the tank, and the petcock turned on, right? I know, it sounds stupid, but I've made that mistake myself... Can you smell gas after trying to start it? If so, it's probably flooded. Clear it by holding the throttle wide open and kicking it through several times. DO NOT open & close the throttle, open it and hold it wide open so you don't work the accelerator pump! 3) If that doesn't work, pull the plugs after you catch your breath and the sweat dries and see if they're wet with gas. They should be... If the plugs are wet after the last step, leave them out and ground the threaded portion against the heads (use some kind of clip or a piece of wire, not your bare hands) then, with the ignition turned on, kick it through and make sure you're getting a nice fat blue spark. If there's no spark, troubleshoot the ignition. If you've got spark, re-check your timing. That ought to at least get you a pop or a sputter. Love them old shovels...  rt | ||
| Kevyn |
What type of carb? Strong spark? Old shovelheads can be very cantankerous until you get the starting sequence just right. Could be fuel starved, could be flooded...plugs clean? Sooted? Oily? Smelly? Gapped properly? Points clean? Battery? Magneto? ...when I was 'commuting' on the ironhead Sporty...ignition off, petcock closed...kick through a few times until engine was moving freely--oil circulated a bit...motor at TDC, magneto at full timing retard, one notch on the choke...ignition on, petcock open, three full throttle squirts through the Bendix...a mighty heave ho and kaboom, fired up, loping along. Always had to give it a minute or two from dead cold to catch its breath and be running smooth and then it was...full magneto advance and hit the road...just my limited experience. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
My friend's routine for his shovel: (cold) Ignition off, choke closed, rotate engine twice. Ignition on, get it to nearly to TDC and kick with your knee straightened out. Hopefully, lots of smoke and noise will now be coming out  Now when it was warm? just kick it until you're dead. then later, it will be cold again and you can start over! I think his had a S&S B. Bear in mind, most of this is from 8 year old memory so it might be BS. | ||
| Kevyn |
RT...very nice skoot! Quite a contrast to the new stuff. Clean and simple. Still parked in the garage? | ||
| Road_thing |
Kevyn, thanks. Garage? Only when I'm not riding it! This thing is fun--it pulls like a train, and it'll set off car alarms from 50 paces. Now, understand, I'm not much of a "look at me!" kind of guy, but I think it's pretty cool that when I ride this bike to any kind of motorcycle function, people always tell me something like "that's what a motorcycle is supposed to look like." Two wheels, a motor, and just enough stuff to make it safe and legal. rt | ||
| Bomber |
just enough stuff to make it safe and legal yeah, and then you go and put Thang on it, and ask, is this still safe and legal? | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
oooh.... I just noticed the dual plug heads. What kind of cam + compression is it running? It must go nice. | ||
| Bob_thompson |
Colby, I can't see them myself, but if in fact the engine does have duel plug heads, I understand S&S makes an automatic compression release in the form of a spark plug that you open manually, then when motor fires they close automatically. I hear many of the top fuel bikes are using them to make firing them easier. Maybe worth a check to save the knees. I've been there with big inch motors. Anybody else heard of these. Bob | ||
| Road_thing |
Nate: It does indeed "go nice." It's an S&S 93" stroker with 9:1 and S&S 514 cams. It makes me giggle every time I ride it. Bomber: Legal? Mostly. Safe? Well, let's just say I haven't crashed it yet! rt | ||
| Musqaush |
Well she has spark checked both plugs whilst kicking thru ,,so got ignition,,appears to have fuel ,,it does run when cold ,,a carb rebuild wouldnt hurt ,,,and he did previously have his kickin down ,but as of now with correct compression shes a little more high maintenance ! But after warm up the only thing reliable is a sore leg ! but well keep workin ,I thank all for current input! (Message edited by musqaush on October 03, 2005) (Message edited by musqaush on October 03, 2005) | ||
| Road_thing |
Hmm.. starts and runs when cold, won't re-start when hot? Is that the deal? If so, I'm assuming your timing is pretty close to right. Obviously it's getting fuel & air, or it wouldn't start at all, so carburetion sounds like a good place to dig deeper. What kind of carb does it have? If it's old, a re-build wouldn't hurt, but I'd want to be sure that's the problem before you spend the time & money to re-build it. How long has it been since the motor ran before you pulled it apart for the top-end job? If it sat for months with gas in the float bowl, you probably have some varnish in the carb. You could take the carb apart and hit it with some carb cleaner and blow the jets and passages out with compressed air. If that doesn't work, you could have a vacuum leak somewhere that gets worse when things heat up and expand, causing the mixture to lean out. While the motor's running, you might try squirting a little ether around the intake manifold seals and other spots on the vacuum side of the carb that might leak. If the engine speeds up, you've got a vacuum leak. Depending on where the leak is, a carb re-build may or may not fix it. rt | ||
| Silas_clone |
Starting my Sporty goes like so: full choke, full open throttle, ignition off 4 full kicks [make sure you engage kicker teeth!] 1/2 choke, partial [less is more] ignition on first kick and she goes... starting after stopping for gas: [3 mile ride] needs partial choke. hot start: open throttle, no choke By far, warm starts are the trickiest. I try to get the bike so that it is more upright. I think that when on the sidestand, carb is tilting and [Bendix]accelerator pump circuit dumps lotsa raw fuel. I will put the sidestand upside of any small incline before I try to start it. | ||
| Leftcoastal |
I had a 68 FLH as my main ride for 17 years. It had the stock elec. starter still on it and it even worked! occasionally. I found that it was usually timing problems causing hard starts when kicking. Usually the early shovels still have the factory distributer unit the bike came with, and they are all for the most part, worn and sloppy and allowing the point cam to spin erratically and that throws out the gap and dwell settings. That would be one of the first things to check - does the point cam have excess sideways motion? If so it's time to source new parts or re-bush if possible. To time it - Set point gap at the high point of the cam to .022 - pull timing plug and get front cyl up on compression stroke. Line up the timing mark in the middle of the hole. Cut a strip of celophane from a pack of smokes and place it between the points (they'll be closed and you will need to open them manually to slip in the celophane) With slight tension on the celophane with one hand, twist the point cam to advance the setting to where it stops - the celophane should JUST start to be released by the points at the point where the cam is turned to full advance. Adjust the position of the distributer so that this occurs at that exact point. Put the various plugs (timing, spark, etc) back in, (you can leave the dist cover off so that you can easily bash the internal parts with a hammer when the bike still doesn't start!) make sure you've got fuel and it's ON, commence to get that sucker fired up. What worked for me: Motor cold: Ignition off - full choke - 2 good full kicks - you'll hear gas getting sucked onto motor thru carb. Choke to 1/2, turn on ignition and with throttle just cracked (1/8 or so) kick it thru. If it doesn't start on first or 2nd kick you flooded it and you might as well go sit in the shade for awhile. Hot motor: NO choke, no throttle, kick it carefully up to compression stroke, then turn on ignition and kick it thru - don't give it any throttle till it has fired and you need to use throttle to keep it running. All this has made me realize with no uncertainty why I no longer have any 'vintage' bikes! Good luck, and may the Gods of Generator Shovelheads be with you. AL | ||
| Bomber |
warm (not hot) starts are most always toughest -- mebbe a lil choke, mebbe a lil throttle -- every bike seems to like it's own mantra and settings -- I'm with Thang, sounds like a carb issue -- | ||
| Road_thing |
Right on, Al. My son has an '04 Heritage Softail, and occasionally we trade rides. It's amazing how two bikes that look so much alike can be so far apart in the way they work! I like old stuff, but I wouldn't want that shovel to be my only ride. rt | ||
| Garrett2 |
we got a 76flh sitting in the garage, first bike i ever rode 7 years ago |
