| Author | Message | ||
     Loyal0ne |
XB12Ss here..roughly 400 miles. Was riding yesterday for about 5 minutes when i decided to go down this back road and open her up a little bit. Got on the throttle in second gear as rounding a turn and as the rpm's came up i got a backfire at about 4K rpms with some pinging. The bike idles fine, and runs fine as long as its under 4K rpms...but as soon as i hit 4K, the bike starts to back fire and i get some pinging with the tach going nuts between 3500 and 5000 or so. I had the bike running fine the day before, even had past 4K a few times, so i know its not the first time the bike has seen those rpms. i had the voltage regulator replaced about a week ago..could this have caused it? any and all comments appreciated. thank you. | ||
| Vaneo1 |
Hey, I have the same problem. Im new to Buell but on my XB12R when I go to about 4KRPM quickly, I here a pinging sound from the bottom of the engine. I have about 800 miles on it but have noticed this. | ||
| Typeone |
oh, man. i feel for you guys. this is depressing to read, and you both have BRAND NEW 12s! I hope Buell wakes up to this issue. I'm fighting ping on my '05. (btw, Vaneo, I agree on the CBR brakes comment in your profile) I think I'm going to troll all the back posts and build a list of members who have mentioned this issue. Buell (and dealers) say they don't know about this. I bet my list just from this board alone will be 10 people deep. I see a pattern forming here, not random rare occurrences. And these are stock bikes. (Message edited by typeone on September 14, 2005) | ||
| Eurotwins |
Me too.....John | ||
| Eurotwins |
But, I will have to add, the people at the factory have done great things for me to make sure that I,m happy. That said, I would still like to get closure on what that noise is if it is not pinging. I've run 100 octane and still is noisey. Please keep me in the loop...John | ||
| Glitch |
Hard acceleration without downshifting will cause your bike to lug, ping, raise hell. Try downshifting then accelerate. These aren't I4s they're Harleys at heart. These bikes ride best when over 4000 rpms. | ||
| Sparky |
4K rpms is around where the ECM goes from closed loop (reading the O2 sensor) to open loop (using fuel mapping and AVF parameters). There is a procedure that resets the AFV to current operating conditions that you can do just by running the bike at or over 4K rpms on the highway for a few minutes. Try that and see if it helps. Wait, you've only got 400 miles total? Maybe you should hold off on going over 4K rpms until it's all broken in. | ||
| Fullpower |
after reading the service manual, i would like to bring up a few points: After BREAKing in your NEW MOTOR, one checks static timing, adjusting as necessary, and then RESETS the TPS zero. this procedure is normally carried out at the 1000 mile service, but if you are going with the ACCELERATED BREAK-IN procedure, you may have to have this maintenance schedule moved up to accomodate. | ||
| Vaneo1 |
Ill wait until the 1,000 mile service since its just around the corner for me. Im still getting used to the whole V-twin thing so there is a lot of uncertainity in my mind as to how to treat the engine when Im riding. Heres an ex. the salesman told me V-Twins are nice because you dont have to keep the rpms up like an inline-4. I find the opposite to be true. I have had to pull clutch and rev the engine more on the 12r than on my old 95 CBRF3. does anyone know of a nice post on this site that has some tips as to how to ride you new buell? | ||
| Chadhargis |
Twins are a different monster for sure. I've never had a Buell, but I've got an FJR and a Ducati, and I can tell you that the FJR can lug down to 1500 rpm with little fuss where my Ducati will protest if you let it fall much below 3000 rpm. Think of it this way...an I4 engine is getting more power pulses per revolution than a twin so it will "lug" a lot smoother than a big twin that has two big pistons getting two power pulses per revolution. Twins tend to "shudder" when you lug them. What your salesman was talking about is that the power of a twin is usually very linear. A traditional liter I4 makes its power at 9,000-12,000 rpm. Unless you wind the engine up, you don't get full power. Power comes on in a big spike (the point where your arms are ripped from their sockets). A twin usually spreads power over an RPM range and comes on more gradually. It makes twins feel weaker because you don't get the "rush" out of them. Just tractable power from 2500-3000rpm on up to redline. It takes some getting used to, but once you do, you'll find that a twin is the best engine for the street. Don't fall into that old habit of "lugging" a twin. It's bad for the engine and you don't get any power down there. Just because the Buell motor is a big twin doesn't mean it likes to be ridden at parade speeds. Wind that sucker up and let it breathe. I used to run my old BMW boxers between 4000 and 6500 rpm consistantly. I tried to keep the needle above 4000 at all times. That's the meat of the powerband. My Ducati doesn't have a tach, but with the desmo valvetrain, I simply shift when it stops revving any higher (probably about 8000rpm). No rev limiter either!  | ||
| Typeone |
Well, if this 'ping' is normal then the motor is horrible for the street. What are you guys saying 'lugging it' is then? What RPM? I'm rarely below ~2800 RPM, the bike will ping or diesel no matter where i am in the rev range lately. As soon as you put load on the thing it pings. Whats the point of all the 'smooth, tractable torque' if the motor knocks when you apply the power? And yes, I've been through it all... static timing, different gas brands, TPS, AFV, stock pipe, aftermarket pipes, stock ecm, race ecm, TFI, blah, blah. it always does it. You can't downshift from 1st leaving a light, my 12 will ping when taking off, and i'm getting the revs up to normal before releasing clutch. I know how to listen to a motor. If what your saying ends up being the 'norm' for this engine I simply do not understand it then and will never be happy with it. But i know its not normal, theres no way you could call this thing a 'sport bike' with serious torque and have the ping that i have. My last resort at this point is to have the dealer check for intake leaks. I've already done it myself but again i'll let a professional look at it. I really ,really love this bike and will be heartbroken if there is no remedy for the ping. Its making every ride annoying and not fun. | ||
| Buellshyter |
I've had some pinging issues with my 12 that started after I put the race kit on and dumped a tank full of regular gas into it. I noticed on humid days it was worse. Lately, with the cooler weather and 93 octane I haven't noticed any pinging. Weird stuff. I have heard complaints from the Aussie riders about similar problems on the 12's. I can't believe Buell has never heard of this issue. I must agree that it is annoying to listen to the pinging. | ||
| Typeone |
yeah, way worse on hot days, today it was probably mid-80s and it sounded awful. run much better on a cool day last week. but i need to ride this thing in the summer too! getting depressed. | ||
| Plsdks |
going back to the beginning of this thread.........400 miles/4,000rpms......his is a no no, buell breaking procedure calls for not more than 2,500 rpms fro the first 500 miles. while i don't know why, i religiously followed this procedure (i think its more for the rider than the bike). Anyway after 500 miles, the tac showed up to 5-6K rpms. No pinging...no problem... run 93 octane. So, maybe you have poor fuel, since everything else should be electronically controlled? | ||
| Indy_bueller |
I followed the breakin procedure as closely as I could as well, and I've never had a problem with pinging. Although I do have an 03 XB9R, but I'm not sure how much difference that would make. | ||
| Typeone |
yeah, sorry to sorta hijack the thread. i'm just always looking for clues to try and figure out whats up. hmm, i definitely didn't follow the break-in. i bought my bike during the Buy, Fly & Ride deal with DaveS and Appleton, we just shot right down to the factory then next day. I didn't kill it and tried to vary the RPMs a little while we were on that ride. Not sure if Dale reads this board but when we pulled in for one of the gas stops he mentioned hearing a ping when he would roll-on power. no body was riding nutso or anything. just mellow. i was hearing the same thing that day but thought i didn't know the bike yet, i told him i had the same 'diesel' sound during roll-ons. His bike had more miles than mine, picked it up the week earlier i think. He seemed like the type of guy that would follow the book, long time BMW touring guy. (hey Dale if you ever read this!  ) | ||
| Dana P. |
Why is that an Anony post???? | ||
| Typeone |
I agree, Dana. Whats up with that, Anony? "I have had some experience with these bike and have found that they dont like being under 3k rpm's" i have a hard time believing that. why on Earth would Erik talk so much about building a STREET bike when you have to ride it like a bat outta hell to perform well. Doesn't add up to me. BTW, my bike runs FABULOUS above ~4200RPM with a fairly constant load at speed. But I need to get through town at normal speeds, up hills in hot weather and juice it to get on the highway. Once again I need to take out my plugs to inspect for metal bits on 'em. Fingers x'd. None so far but today was hot and Mr. Ping came for quite a few visits. I want this bike to last a long, long time. If I'm doing damage now, my luck will be that the warranty will end the day before it blows up. Sigh. (Message edited by typeone on September 15, 2005) | ||
| Norcalbuell |
I to suffer the all annoying ping-itus. Im in the same boat as typeone with regards to severity of pinging. This is how i fixed or maybe just bandaided the pinging. I live in Northern California and we have some of the worst gas known to mankind and i think is the biggest factor causing my pinging. I cannot even put shell gas in or my ping is awfull. My 12r would ping at any roll on speed, gear it didnt matter. I could shift and give more throttle to reduce the noise but damm i was always breaking the speed limits, and if was 80+ degrees my pinging was off the hook. Drove me crazy..I put some 98 octane fuel from the Sears point Race track and really noticed the ping to almost disappear...So i finally resorted to off the shelf octane booster and this is what i found....I used 108+ Outlaw brand booster race only version about 9.99 a bottle and get 3 tanks to a bottle of this stuff and im here to report that since then i get absoulutely NO PINGING... Yea you heard me NO PINGING using this product. I will still get a little pinging when if i dont put in booster at least 2 refuels. I will be honest that i dont know the harm of this stuff will do to the engine but what i do know is the pinging felt much worse on the motor... Please Chime in on the effects that this stuff can do....I am going to get the exact brand of this stuff just to make sure and het back to ya... Oh, by the way i can only run chevron 91 octane with all the rest of the brands to make my 12r ping It seams to be working but there has to be another solution for this huge population of buells that suffer. Thanks Chuck | ||
| Loyal0ne |
I called the dealership yesterday and told them of my problem. The salesman, who races his buell and i believe has some tech experience, said that this problem might have been caused by my voltage regulator crapping out the week before. he believes it might be a computer related issue. He did tell me to bring it in right away, or if i prefered, he would have someone pick up the bike for me as the dealership is about 15 miles away. The bike is new and still under warranty, so as soon as this northeast weather cleans up, the bike is going in and ill let everyone know how things work out. thank you for all the advice. much appreciated. | ||
| Vaneo1 |
That sounds like an idea. I used to put octane booster in my CBR's tank just for the hell of it but I have noticed V-Twins are more picky, and the revs do have to be kept up more than a jap bike or thats what it seems to me. My pinging problem is extremely intermittent compared to others in this thread, in fact I havent heard it in a few days. I scheduled a 1,000 Mi initial service, maybe Ill let the Tech know Ive heard it. |
