| Author | Message | ||
     Howieshotrods |
I was at the dealership the other day and was talking to my salesman about my idling issues. He told me that Buell has said that these types of issues are from not running the bike for 5-10 minutes to finish it's cycle...the plugs foul and won't run right until you change the plugs. Sounds like a load of BS to me, but anyone have any thoughts. He said you do it once and you need to change your plugs. If this is the case, what about once the bike is warmed up and restarted. | ||
| Duff24 |
i don't know about you but i let my bike idle for about half an hour after i get done riding... j/k i don't know where some of these idiot salesmen come up with this stuff. i think they have a list of excuses to make up and rattle some off when they can't answer your questions, especially when they're not edumicated on the bikes they're talking about... | ||
| Buellin_ri |
I agree with duff. If it not a dyna or some softail they don't have a clue. Anyone who reads a buell brochure knows more than 90% of HD sales man. Take the plugs out and clean em up. They should be fine. If your still having problems you may have other issues (plug wires, injector, etc) | ||
| Cluckcluckpush |
Does he mean the engine should be at operating temp and then the FI will not be adding extra fuel to warm up? Is a "cycle" cold start to full operating temp? | ||
| Howieshotrods |
Kind of my question too, because if it goes through the cycle when it is warm, it has got to be a bad design. But basically that is what he meant, I don't know enough about the FI on the XB to argue it, I do know there is at least one engine temp sensor and some sensor in the intake to help meter fuel/air. | ||
| Kds1 |
I think what he means is don't start the bike and rev it up for everytime someone comes over to look at it and just cut it off cold....fuel injection has an enrichener just like a carb with an electric choke and has to be warm before it stops adding extra fuel for warm-up.... Kevin www.kdfab.com | ||
| Howieshotrods |
That is what he was saying, but he made it sound like if it wasn't run through it's "cycle" you automatically have to change the plugs. If that is the case I will have to drive around the block a few times before I get gas (hope I have enough in the tank) because the gas station is only 3 minutes away. | ||
| Dcmortalcoil |
Not fully warming up the engine (like a taking a short run to the grocery store) can foul the plug. That's with any vehicle that uses spark plugs - that's what I've been told time after time. XBs advances (or retards - I forget) the timing during warm-up. It slowly brings to 0 degree timing when it hits around 135 degree Celsius. While it's warming up, I believe it runs rich until the timing goes to 0 degrees. So that's what the salesman could have been referring to - completing the cycle (fully warming up). | ||
| Izzinya |
Does he mean the engine should be at operating temp and then the FI will not be adding extra fuel to warm up? Is a "cycle" cold start to full operating temp? correct we have a problem with our salesmen doing that its ok with me if they do it though i get paid 1.1 hrs book time to change the plugs it doesnt happen every time though Izzinya (Message edited by izzinya on June 13, 2005) | ||
| Spatten1 |
"Not fully warming up the engine (like a taking a short run to the grocery store) can foul the plug. That's with any vehicle that uses spark plugs - that's what I've been told time after time." If my truck exhibited that problem I'd get a lemon law lawyer. Modern four strokes should not foul plugs, period. Can you imagine your family getting stranded somewhere because you started the car for 2 minutes and shut it off? | ||
| Spatten1 |
Sorry about the negativity, but I'm one of the people that had the front plug fouling problem, solved with iridium plugs. My X1 would not start without throttle. My XB fouls plugs if you touch the throttle at startup. There was no way for me to know that, after owning the previous generation Buell, also fuel injected. I just believe that there should not be so many specific procedures that need to be followed to keep from fouling plugs. | ||
| Kds1 |
Well, a rule of thumb is if you start the bike and the enrichener is on and you don't ride it to get proper lubrication to the cylinders, you are washing the oil off the rings and you know what that causes.....that would be a good time to get the 1050 or 1250 kit I would guess, works for me... Kevin www.kdfab.com | ||
| Buelluk |
In all my years of riding i have never heard that a short run to a grocery store is going to result in your plugs getting fouled. I warm my XB9 for 1-2 minutes from start and then ride it..I have had no problems at all. Ignition on, kill switch set to on, fuel pump buzz finishes, press the little yellow button, starts up .. no problem... I do not touch the throttle at all until I ride off. As far as salesman are concerned ,HD could do with employing some motorcyclists rather than ex -Amway sales people. If my salesperson doesn't ride a bike ,I would have some concerns about him/her. | ||
| Howieshotrods |
I have to say that is my biggest problem, a FI bike should never foul plugs, with an o2 sensor and numerous other sensors I don't believe it should ever overfuel. And from the way mine is acting, it seems to start the cold cycle all over again after it sits for 15 minutes. My FI Road Glide doesn't have this problem, nor does my truck, and I can drive them any way I want without a care in the world. | ||
| Reepicheep |
FWIW, I have always warmed up both the M2 and the 9sx for about as long as it takes me to put on my gloves and helmet... not long... and then I just ride it gently for the first 5 minutes or so. I have never once avoided a short trip. In 25k miles on the M2, and 5k+ miles on the 9sx, I have never fouled a plug. | ||
| Nguzzi |
We were having problems with the plugs fouling on my Demo - race kit equipped City. So we put in the Buell Pro plugs and the problem cleared up. | ||
| Deuceman |
I rev mine and kill and ride after about 30 seconds of warming up. I don't have any problems with fouling. Then again, I have never had most of the problems that are mentioned alot on the board. I have 10,000 miles. | ||
| Charlieboy6649 |
BuellUK, I don't think a lot of the younger Buellers even know what Amway is?  I could never do it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't work. On the contrary, works better than ever, just ask the diamonds... Back to your regularly scheduled program. | ||
| Ponytail |
I filled up last week using Shell 94 Oct. The bike ran great! The other night I filled up with Citgo 93 Oct, and it's running like crap again. no more Citgo for me. I went through this with my Springer too. I can't run anything but Amoco or Mobile in that. HD's twins have ALWAYS been sensative to spark plug fouling. They get MORE sensative to it when you start modding them via the airbox, exhaust, whatever. To say that YOU don't think that it SHOULD be happening is pretty messed up. Just shows that you didn't do you're homework and know what you were buying. Plugs CAN be cleaned by running the bike as built...blow the carbon out of it as they used to say about cars AND motorcycles back in the 70's. It's an aircooled american V-twin. It has it's quarks. It always has and always will, FI or not. Fuel injection is a fuel delivery system. It will not solve all of the worlds problems. It won't even solve inherent design quarks that have been in existance since the v-twins introduction. There are things that you can do to help or hinder the plug fouling issue. The climate, elevation, how you ride and what fuel you use all make a difference. HD can't control any of that with computers. Your cars and trucks aren't as sensative to it due to the shear number of cylinders, operating temperatures, compression, # of valves... next time you change your plugs in your car or truck, pay attention to them...they are NEVER all the same. When you have only two cylinders you can tell when one plug is fouling. In a car, the common man (or woman) will never know it until the plug completely quits emitting a spark. Educate yourself and learn how to keep it from happening by changing the fuel, run hotter spark plugs, pay attention to how you ride... or sell the bike and kwitcherbitchin. | ||
| Justice |
I agree with Reepicheep. Bombardier did a study years ago that showed significantly less engine wear when engines were started and immediately run under light load, compared to engines that were started and allowed to warm up while idling. | ||
| Blake |
I agree with Ponytail. If your plugs are fouling, it is due to your spark plugs not being hot enough and/or your fuel delivery being over-rich, and/or subjecting the engine to a bunch of throttle blips before it is warmed up. But contrary to what Ponytail say, I'd say that all engines have "quarks", any of a group of hypothetical elementary particles having electric charges of magnitude one-third or two-thirds that of the electron, regarded as constituents of all hadrons. Not all are querky though.  |
