| Author | Message | ||
     Nemster |
Is it worth it? If so who, if anybody makes a kit? What are the advantages/disadvantages to it?? Thanks guys!!  | ||
| Firemanjim |
Depends on your application,racing ,yes.street,don't think so.Check with Al at American Sportbike,he can get the stuff.My S-2 has 75,000 on the belt.I even ran a belt on the Bonneville bike for 2 years.No problems and 177 hp.Chained it to juggle gearing. | ||
| Crusty |
I've done it. I've had several belts break, and I got sick of it. Baker (the 6 speed tranny people) makes a kit, but it's expensive, and the chain they give you is junk. If you go that route, buy a good quality O-ring chain. The advantages are that you never have to worry about picking up a stone and having your belt snap on I-71 on a Sunday afternoon, or having the teeth peel off while crossing Pennsylvania, etc. The disadvantages are that you'll have to lube and adjust the chain. And you'll have to clean the wheel and swingarm a little more. I'd post more, but I have to go to work. | ||
| Gentleman_jon |
Both belts and Chains have their place. For normal street riding the belt has a lot of advantages: 1. Faster: less power absorption due to it's lighter weight than chain, and less unsprung weight. 2. Smoother, quieter, no chain snatch 3. Cleaner, no lubrication required. 4. No adjustment required. Disadvantages are: 1. Can break more easily than chain, but rarely happens with new improved belts. 2. Wheel removal is a bit more complicated due to need to remove belt guards and idler wheel, esp. on '03 models. 3. Continued use on unpaved roads can lead to early belt failure. Chain is preferred by many for racing as it allows simple gearing changes, and faster tire changes. Adrenalin Motors has just introduced a new chain kit that does not require a new swing arm, and looks very well designed. Previous chain conversions required a modified swing arm. | ||
| Newfie_buell |
Nemster, I dropped my first belt at 19,000km and my second belt 4,000km later. Due to the fact that you have to remove the engine/swingarm assembly from the frame assembly on the 98 S1 I went to a chain. I have been running a 530 O-ring Chain since July 2003 and have had no problems, I usually lube and clean it once a week. I have also had very little adjustment on it. At first I was using regular chain lube which was very messy but have since found chain wax and that stuff when applied correctly don't fly off at all. If the S1 had a removable plate like the X1 I think I would have put on another belt. As for parts, I picked up a 91 Sportster front sprocket and spacer, the rear sprocket I had trouble as I did not know which harley model to buy. After I had it all done I found out that the big twin rear sprocket would work from around the year 81 or so. The one I bought I had to have the center hole cut bigger but it was no problem. Apparently Sprocket Specialities sells the correct one now so next time I will contact those people. My belts failed because of rocks/stones and I was running the belt a bit on the loose side. Proper adjustment also keeps it from chewing into the aluminum swingarm block. | ||
| Ray_maines |
FWIW: The rear sprocket of a belt set-up weighs a ton and an aluminum chain drive part is more than light enough to make up for the heavier weight of the chain. My current bike has chain and I haven't found it to be much of a hassle. At 25,000 miles it looks to be about half way through it's life cycle. | ||
| Firebolt428 |
I have a chain conversion for racing and its way better for a race application. Bike is more snappy with the chain. It could be better for street too depending on how important it is to you. Innovative motorcycle research has them. www.racingmotorcycles.com | ||
| Fullpower |
look here.http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/3842/104701.jpg a chain drive is both more efficient and more durable than any belt drive. sprockets are very much cheaper, lighter in weight, and last longer than belt pulleys. yes lubrication is required, and some of it will foul the rear wheel. i bought my rear sprocket for $54 from vortex at (800) 440-3559, the front sprocket is stock sportster part from around 1991 or so, and a good quality Tsubaki or RK nickle plated oring chain is worth around a buck and a quarter or so. | ||
| Steve_a |
>> a chain drive is both more efficient and more durable than any belt drive<< Generally, the published efficiency numbers indicate that a belt is the more efficient, and by a factor of two or more. Harley belts routinely go 50,000 miles on Big Twins, which is longer lived than any non-enclosed chain. Most of the Buell belt troubles seem to have been related to the 2003 11mm-pitch Gates belt, which can lose roughly 90 percent of its strength if its mishandled (bent too severely or twisted) during a tire change. The Goodyear belts are far superior in this regard, and I understand the 25,000 mile change recommendation has more to do with the lack of extended testing than a true life limit. There's no reason that a belt can't be a life of the bike item, even if Buell isn't quite there this year. | ||
| Bob_thompson |
Agree with all thats been said with one more item of interest. My chain conversion EATS rocks for lunch anytime, anywhere. My last belt secumed to a rather small (1/4 inch pebble)and I have NEVER been off the highways. Its your choice. Bob | ||
| Djkaplan |
As much as I love the belt, I've been thinking about a chain conversion too. I've never had any trouble with the belt in 24,000 miles, but it's always in the back of my mind that the belt could snap and leave me stranded. Worse, it may happen far from home where I'd have to pay someone to fix it. It's not the money that bugs me, it's the fact that someone else would be working on my bike (ugh). In all my years of riding (since 1976), I've never once managed to break a chain on any kind of motorcycle. | ||
| Ray_maines |
Nemster: I think my bottom line would be whether or not your '97 S-1 has a removable side plate like a '99 and newer X-1. That would make changing a broken belt a fairly simple do it yourself project. Belts are good overall but changing them can be more trouble than it's worth. If it's a solid frame and you have to drop the swing arm, or spread the frame to change the belt, then it would already have a chain drive. Of course you know what free advice is worth, but my free advice would be to totally disregard any and all BS about how dropping the swing arm is easy only takes an hour, blah blah, blah. Lies I tell you. Lies! | ||
| Newfie_buell |
I'd never try to spread the frame. I think serious damage would result. Dropping the swingarm is not the way either. You have to secure the engine/swingarm assembly to something solid then let go the heim joints, isolator bolts, oil lines, electrical connectors and then lift the frame assembly letting it pivot on the front isolator on the front cylinder head. The first time I did it took me about 6hrs and no help, the second time when I had to change the isolators, myself and OZZ666 did it in about 3.5 hrs. Its a real pain in the rear without the removable side plate, a chain is nice and simple. | ||
| Rick_a |
If you're an aggressive rider the main advantage is that a chain will stretch to all hell before it breaks, letting you know it's time to replace it. My belt broke at 12000 miles on a first-to-second full throttle upshift. I've been using a chain ever since. It's a bit of a hassle, cost is actually more overall, but I have no worries of being stranded over it again. I've used the frame spreader technique. Just don't spread it beyond what is recommended. Takes only about 20 min. vs the alternatives. | ||
| Anonymous |
XB belts weigh 75% less than chains. This is both unsprung and rotational mass (about 4 pounds, depending on the chain). XB belt sprockets are made of aluminum and weigh about the same as steel chain sprockets. Racing aluminum chain sprockets don't last on the street. XB Belts require no maintenance, no lube, no adjustments. They are clean and quiet with zero drive lash. Why, oh why, would you want to replace your belt drive with a chain?? Racers are different. They need to change gear ratios. They meticulously service and adjust the chain. And they don't mind replacing chain and sprockets annually. | ||
| Newfie_buell |
Why, Two belt failures within 4000km due to rocks. Anonymous, if you can guarantee me a belt that won't break with a small stone then I will go back to one. What are your thoughts on spreading the frame to replace the belt!!!!!! | ||
| Rageonthedl |
What are your thoughts on spreading the frame to replace the belt!!!!!! Well thats how i do it, just use the Special tool and have no problems. | ||
| Nemster |
So there isn't a "kit" available anywhere?? What do I need to look for to do this conversion?? thanks again!! | ||
| Firemanjim |
Nemster,see my first post--call Al Lighton at American Sportbike. | ||
| Nemster |
What about the rear sprocket?? They got them also?? I love the racing promo on that site BTW!! | ||
| Crusty |
Why, oh why, would you want to replace your belt drive with a chain?? 1) A stone from the parking lot at Hagerstown Speedway. 2) It just broke without warning while I was traveling along I-71 in Ohio on a Sunday afternoon. 3)Most of the teeth ripped off while cruising down the Pennsylvania Turnpike. 4) It snapped on the way to work one morning. Like the belt on I-71, it flew off and I don't know why it broke. 5) I backed out of my garage, put the bike in gear, and the belt snapped. The hole in the center was obviously caused by a stone. I've never had a chain break on a road bike. | ||
| Trojan |
We have a chain conversion for the XB models that doesn't require a new swingarm.  If it is pre-XB model you can use the chain components from a pre-belt Sportster (86?). You may have to make up a spacer to go behind the front sprocket. Drag Specialties offer a complete chain conversion kit for pre-XB Buells as well. (Message edited by trojan on May 21, 2005) | ||
| Jlnance |
Anonymous, if you can guarantee me a belt that won't break with a small stone then I will go back to one. I wonder if 2 side by side belts would solve this problem. If one broke, you could get back home on the remaining one. | ||
| Ray_maines |
JLNance: Watch out, Anonie will offer you a four year old belt and challenge you you to put your money where your mouth is. The New M2 Challenge, Part I The New M2 Challenge, Part II | ||
| Reepicheep |
It would be interesting to correlate how many of these broken belts involve people that putzed with the belt guards, or had a mishandled belt. My Cyclone went like 30k miles on an original belt, the 9sx is up to 4k without any sign of problems. Someday one will break, but so far it's been far less work and far less expense then any of the chains I have used. They were always needing lubing, cleaning, or adjustment. Factor in the pulley "never adjust" setup, and I save 20 minutes every time I pull the rear wheel. Over the life of the bike, that is a lot of hours, even if I do have to replace a belt (at about the same milage I would probably be replacing a chain and sprockets, were I doing maintenance right). | ||
| Outrider |
Reep...That is way too logical. Are you sure you're not related to Spock from Star Trek? To tell the truth, I really like my belt for all the reasons you say, yet I fear the day it might let me down in the middle of nowhere. FYI, I left the belt guards on for this very reason. Have 12.5k miles on the X1, ridden in lots of sand and gravel and the belt still appears to be in new condition. Based on owning many bikes with chain drive, I would be replacing the chain and sprockets about now. So it looks like I am going to get a lot of "free miles" out of the belt. Additionally, you can rest assured I don't miss the chain maintenance routine much less cleaning up the mess on the bike especially with PM wheels. Am anxious to read the follow up mileage reports from the folks that are testing the new XB belts on their Tubers as I am looking forward to reducing or eliminating the possibility of getting stranded. Sure would be nice to get an Official Statement from Buell concerning the compatibility and performance expectation of the new belt on the Tubers. Then, I have a lot of suspicions as to why they don't make a statement. In the interim, I will just keep inspecting the belt and plan on replacing it when needed. | ||
| Rageonthedl |
Trojan....ur chain drive is a 520 correct?? any way to get a bigger chain on it? | ||
| Reepicheep |
I would not blame somebody on a tuber without the sideplates for going to a chain. Not messing with the isolators sounds appealing. Though my experience with tuber belts has been that when they are toast, the isolators are as well. On an XB though, where belt replacement is likely easier then an oil change, I don't know why anyone would go to a chain, unless they wanted to change gearing to get the last 10% out of lots of different tracks. | ||
| Chainsaw |
...where belt replacement is likely easier then an oil change... LOL! Spoken like a man who has yet to take the rear tire off an XB!  Let's see, remove rear brake, rider footpeg mount, belt guards, sprocket cover, swingarm brace, idler pulley, loosen axle. Wrestle with new (tight) belt, install without flexing, rinse and repeat if desired. Oil change is just 5 chin fairing bolts, oil drain plug and filter. | ||
| Al_lighton |
Patrick, the 04 and later belt system is WAY easier to change than all that. You're right about the 03 system, though. Al |
