| Author | Message | ||
     Aka_dark_lord |
Well said Metalstorm. One other note.... Last time I checked Toyota and Honda had factories right here in the good old USA. I pass a Toyota plant every now and then. When talking vehicles it was probably made right here, by Americans. The only difference is your money is supporting companies in other countries. I say each to their own... | ||
| M1combat |
"M1,I didn't say the 600's weren't modified,I said they were no where near as modified as the Buells,disagree?" Yes, as a matter of fact. I'll let you do your own research (although I doubt you will). As I recall, it's less expensive to set up a Buell for FX as well. "A stock Japanese 600 isn't bored out" Duh, it's stock. Anyway, an FX 600 is bored out. They're also de-stroked. "How many races have the XB's won in FX?" You're not seeing the forest for the trees again. We're talking about Buell Dealership vs the Big Four. "Buell doesn't retain the stock 5 speed." They don't? They made a modification to the case to allow for easier removal of the gears for gear changes. That's all. The IL4's have this functionality as well... "Funny how everyone on here talks about how different Buells are then complains when someone points it out." LOL  . Really... I laughed out loud on that one . You couldn't point "it" out if it smacked you in the face . "if the XB's are so great why haven't they won a race where they compete against bikes of the same displacement." Holy cow... That's not the point. Displacement is only a characteristic. Why can't the damn IL4's compete with 600cc's and only two cylinders? Why can't they compete just as they are but with push rods? Dangit... Why do they let those dang IL4's run with FOUR valves per cylinder? That's not fair... What matters in racing is an engine's power output. Not how it gets there. Look at most other forms of racing (except NASCAR and Drag) here is the US and you'll find that engine displacement is not much of a factor. Look at European GT racing... Everything from a 2.6L Twin torbo'd Boxer six to a 7.0L Dodge V-10 to a 6L Ferrari V12... And a bunch more in between. | ||
| Vonsliek |
& ••••••• hey - & i am a british, australian, canadian - doesn't the dodge srt4 kick most all the imports asses??!! buells are NOT engineered to race, as are 600's .. & contrary to what every jap bike & other moron thinks .. ALL race bikes are modified HEAVILY to run in prizemoney races .. it NEVER is run what u brung .. stop putting acid in yer Koolaid ... i LIKE the fact u can get a buell to go that damn fast & still have essentially a buell stock heart .. a pushrod is a pushrod .. oh.. buells wheels are made in china (for jap tuner wheels firm) most of the rest of the bike - frame & swingarm are italian, brakes are jap (nissin).. NOTHING is made in just one place anymore .. the PR may tell us oterwise, but manufacturing processes tell us otehr wise. be cool ppl & ride them all, only experiance allows one a - at best - subjective opinion .. i like ALL bikes .. they are all bikes & as such are the pinnacle of transportation for man. paul. | ||
| CJXB |
Well said Metalstorm Yep !! Disagreeing is fine, but do it without the name calling and insults please !! CJ | ||
| Olinxb12r |
This thread turned into a monster since yesterday. I just thought it was funny that the guy didn't know what he was talking about. Chill out guys. | ||
| Got1nut |
Puppy, Let me ask you this, how many countries have you been to? Or are u just talking out of your brown eye? I have been to at least 12 countries all over the world and lived in japan for 5 years. And let me say that there is a reason why everyone wants to come here. Did u know that in Japan, its a big deal to own an american car, its a status thing. Why would the oh so hard working japanese want to drive a Mustang instead of a Well made Skyline? Why would kids pay 150 bucks for a pair of Levi's instead of Japanese Jeans, or why is it that they all want to be like us? Man, thats crazy why would anyone in there right mind want anything American if the quality is ••••.  Heck they even kept my Right Nut over there.  (Message edited by got1nut on May 17, 2005) | ||
| 99buellx1 |
I did my own service 99buellX1,why do you ask? Because you said that the dealer was the last one to adjust the primary. The primary is to be inspected and adjusted if needed at every service. This is right from the service manual. One idea that was brought up was that the primary was incorrectly adjusted (too tight), therefore all this could possibly have been avoided if the services were performed properly. | ||
| Brucelee |
I thought this was relevant regarding quality, location and what constitues a US product: From the WSJ today. Junk Cars By PAUL INGRASSIA May 17, 2005; Page A12 The headlines from Detroit are dire. S&P has cut General Motors and Ford bonds to junk status -- below the ratings now enjoyed by Poland, Russia and Mexico. Both companies are losing market share, and billionaire Kirk Kerkorian is offering to buy enough GM shares to give him 9% of the company. It was his similar investment in Chrysler 15 years ago that ultimately produced the company's sale to Daimler-Benz. But perspective is important. The U.S. auto industry isn't dying. In fact, it is being reborn. This is because the U.S. auto industry is more than just GM, Ford and the Chrysler division of DaimlerChrysler. It includes Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Hyundai, BMW and all the "foreign" car companies that are expanding in the U.S. And expanding they are. Toyota is about to open its sixth U.S. assembly plant (in Texas), and has plans to build a seventh in a place to be determined. South Korea's Hyundai opens its first U.S. assembly plant, in Alabama, this month. Twenty years ago there were just two U.S. assembly plants that weren't owned by Detroit's Big Three. Now there are 23 in the U.S. and Canada (mostly the U.S.). These 23 account for a third of the vehicles built in the two countries, which long have had a free-trade pact for autos. And assembly plants are just part of this buildup. "Foreign" car companies have engine and transmission factories in America's heartland, engineering centers near Detroit and design centers in Southern California. Nearly 25% of U.S. and Canadian automotive employees now work for companies other than GM, Ford and Chrysler, Automotive News calculates, up from less than 7% in 1990. Expect that percentage to grow. All this makes for interesting ironies. When John Kerry railed against outsourcing last fall, he certainly didn't do it in front of the massive Honda assembly complex in Marysville, Ohio. It's hard to condemn outsourcing when a Japanese company has outsourced jobs to your country. Then there's the matter of trying to define a foreign car these days. Is it a Honda Accord built in Ohio or a Chrysler minivan built in Canada? A BMW built in South Carolina, or a Ford built in Mexico? It's easier to identify a foreign car company than a foreign car. But who cares where headquarters happen to be? Far from dying, the U.S. auto industry is changing hands -- passing increasingly into the control of owners more effective than GM and Ford. Which doesn't mean GM and Ford are doomed. Far from it. Despite their current woes, both companies remain in far better shape than some of their now-thriving foreign competitors were just a few years ago. In the late 1990s, for example, Nissan was a basket case. It was saddled with deep debt and dull cars, not to mention tons of excess capacity and thousands of unneeded employees. But in 1999, Nissan did the unthinkable: bringing in a non-Japanese CEO. Carlos Ghosn, a Brazilian-born Renault executive of Lebanese ancestry, closed plants and cut jobs -- scrapping Japan's sacred seniority system in favor of a meritocracy. He also unleashed engineers and designers to build exciting cars, such as the 350Z and the Murano. By 2002, Nissan was earning record profits. Today the company is virtually free of debt and has profit margins at or near the industry's top. Or take Hyundai. After initial success in America, its sales plunged in the late 1990s thanks to shoddy quality. But the company focused on the problem and now stands near the top of the J.D. Power quality rankings -- ahead of such nameplates as Mercedes-Benz, Audi, BMW and even Toyota. Sales have surged. These and other automotive turnarounds have key elements in common. One is a clear crisis to spur bold action. Another is new leadership committed to aggressive cost-cutting and also to enunciating a clear recovery plan around which employees can rally. Finally, products that are exciting as well as reliable. * * * There is no reason those things cannot happen at GM and Ford. And in fact, similar things have happened at Detroit's companies, which have closed the quality chasm that separated them from the Japanese a generation ago. When Journal colleague Joseph White and I began writing a book about Detroit in 1992, the working title was, indeed, "Changing Hands." But a year later, dramatic turnarounds had begun at GM, Ford and Chrysler. As the story changed, so did the title -- to "Comeback: the Fall and Rise of the American Automobile Industry," published in 1994. Now the original working title looks more prescient. But the point is that the fortunes of car companies can change rapidly. To stage another comeback, GM, Ford and Chrysler must get a grip on the issue of legacy costs -- pensions and health-care benefits for employees and retirees. This means not just reducing those costs, but ending management's fixation with the subject -- legacy costs indeed are a problem, but not the only problem. Pension and health-care cost Detroit $1,500 per vehicle more than foreign-based competitors. If you doubt President Bush's warnings about Social Security just look at GM -- with 2.5 retirees for every active employee. But lest we forget, Detroit has also squandered some huge legacy advantages. Among them: once-venerable brand names and entrenched consumer loyalty. Consider the Ford Taurus: America's best-selling car for much of the late '80s and early '90s is dying a sad death. Ford let the Taurus go stale instead of investing in more-powerful engines, more-efficient transmissions and added features, as Toyota has done with the Camry and Honda with the Accord. Legacy costs shouldn't be an excuse for bringing inferior products to market. Why does the new Pontiac G6 have a standard four-speed automatic transmission, when the competition is moving to five-speed and even six-speed automatics? More speeds mean better performance and fuel economy. And why does the new Ford 500 have a V6 engine that generates just 203 hp, when the new Toyota Avalon's V6 cranks out 280? The terrific new Mustang shouldn't be the only exciting new car in Ford's stable. Nor are legacy costs unsolvable. If Mr. Ghosn can vanquish lifetime employment and the seniority system in tradition-bound Japan, GM's Rick Wagoner and Ford's Bill Ford Jr. should be able to at least reduce legacy costs in America. They have examples right across town. Several major auto-parts makers have reduced health-care benefits to retirees. And the auto makers themselves have revamped health-care and pension plans for some newly hired managers. The United Auto Workers union stands in the way of changes, suggesting it's time for an ultimatum: co-pays, closings, or Kerkorian, take your choice. Mr. Kerkorian's intentions toward GM are the subject of much speculation. But it's clear that his offer to spend nearly $900 million to buy GM shares is a vote of confidence in the company's future. This isn't necessarily a vote of confidence in current management or its strategy. But a savvy investor such as Mr. Kerkorian wouldn't put his money on the line unless he saw untapped value instead of a Chapter 11 filing in GM. One of GM's biggest problems is that eight different brands -- Chevy, Pontiac, Buick, Cadillac, Saturn, Saab, GMC and Hummer -- don't make sense with just 25% of the market. Having eight brands forces GM to squander costs and creativity filling out each brand's model lineup. The result: too many bland products such as the Buick LaCrosse and the Pontiac G6. It would be easier to develop more truly exciting vehicles if the company wasn't tending to so many divisions. But killing brands is costly and painful, as GM's recent experience in axing Oldsmobile attests. Indeed, more pain lies ahead, probably much more. Such pain, sadly, is part of rebirth. Today's global auto industry is brutally competitive, which is why GM and Ford aren't the only companies in the sick bay these days. Italy's Fiat is struggling to right itself -- helped ironically by a recent $2 billion cash payment from GM. The payment got GM out of a potential obligation to purchase Fiat Auto, part of an unwise deal that backfired on GM. Meanwhile, Mitsubishi Motors remains alive thanks only to the multibillion-dollar bailout largesse of Japan Inc. A couple of years ago, the company tried to boost sales with its unfortunately named "zero-zero-zero" promotion. Customers could get a car with no money down, no interest charges and no payments at all for a year. So a hefty number used this promotion to drive a new car without paying anything for a year, after which they let the car get repossessed. Mitsubishi's losses ran into the hundreds of millions of dollars. Fortunately, Detroit has never done anything quite this boneheaded -- at least not yet. Mr. Ingrassia, a former Detroit correspondent for The Wall Street Journal, is president of Dow Jones Newswires. | ||
| Signguyxb12 |
Amen Tiny and i have the scars on my chest to prove it!! | ||
| Johncr250 |
I ride a Buell and a GSXR K1. I think the new XB`s are the best looking bikes you can buy, they handle great, and have great breaks but thats where it ends. The XB`s need a real motor! With the XB9 putting out 83hp and the XB12 with 95hp plus a 5 speed gearbox that has the bikes reving at like 4000 plus rpm`s at 85mph, they are just not that much fun to ride. Plus in stock form any new 600 rice rocket putting out 105 to 110 hp will smoke a buell given equal riders. Don`t even start thinking about taking on a new literbike with 160plus rwhp. While the buell is reaching its top speed of 135, a new R1 is still in second gear with its front wheel in the air! Mr Buell please give us a real motor for our beloved Buells, with 125-130 rwhp and a six speed trans! | ||
| Nevar |
Mr Buell please give us a real motor for our beloved Buells, with 125-130 rwhp and a six speed trans! =============================================== A different motor and the "bike" would not be Buell. Some of us don't care if we can't keep up with other sport bikes (in the straights). Some of us don't want to do 170 mph. The look of the V-twin with the exhaust pipe routing is what attracted me to the Buell in the first place. Without these characteristics, it would look like every other sport(y) bike on the market. Tim | ||
| Fat_tony |
"Buells do get their asses kicked by 600 sportbikes" My friend has a GSXR 600 and I ride a XB12R. I can beat him by at least 10 bike lengths on the straight under 100 mph. Suzuki can beat the Firebolt at speeds in the high triple digits only. By the way, The XB12 has a third more torque than his bike has with roughly the same hp. Buell XB12R hp: 92.2 @ 6750 torque: 71.9 @ 5750 Suzuki GSX-R600 hp: 103.6 @ 1400 torque: 48.9 @ 11,000 AND MY BIKE SOUNDS A S**T LOAD MEANER!!!  | ||
| Firebolt428 |
Well I like to think people buy a Buell because its different and we don't need that type of power to ride around on the street... I too would like a motor that gives that much horsepower on a Buell.. My Buell has the big bore 1169 kit and it does pretty good.. Its comparable in lap times to a Duc 748RS that I race against. We both have won this year and its pretty much a 2 way battle right now between his Ducati 748RS with 120hp and my Buell Firebolt 108hp (81lbs torque). Just think how much Big Red has put into there Factory FX bikes? I don't recall anyone winning last year other than the Factory honda bikes? So the statement of "why hasn't Buell won yet" Who has besides Honda? I know Rich at Kosco and they don't have a budget like Big Red has and who does in FX? But I bet if they did they would be running up front with the factory bikes... I ride a Buell because its different, its sounds different, looks different, handles different, and its alot of fun.. (Message edited by firebolt428 on May 17, 2005) | ||
| Spatten1 |
John, I can't imagine anyone who has ridden a modern Japanese liter bike hard would not feel the same. Equal riders will not go as fast on a Buell as a Japanese liter bike, and the stock 600's are lighter and more powerful than the XBs. And if you are knocking the handling of a Japanese 600 or liter bike you are just hiding your head in the sand. The modern Japanese bikes work very well. I do disagree about needing a new motor. I want a bike with less power and more soul, but can't give up all handling and ride a HD. The old push rod engine just "feels" good, I don't even mind getting stuck behind cars anymore. And it does have sufficient power for me in my current stage of life. However, if I was 20 with no family depending on me......I'd take the 75 mph power wheelies. | ||
| Slaughter |
If you read the Roadracing World articles in the series on Jeremy Toye's R1 - they were almost $60K into the bike in mods by the time it was sorted out. If you think you can run a generic inline four even at the club level and be competitive... Put a wish in one hand, a turd in the other - and I bet I can tell you which hand is fuller. I aint no xpurt (even though that's what the license says) - but seems everybody is racing their spec sheets at the coffee shops. | ||
| Cataract2 |
who cares what others think. or what beats what. I just ride the damn thing. A big +1 to that!!! Anyways, I've battled enough on my local groups riding board that I gave up. Funny thing though, we gained another local Buell rider (XB9SX) and one of the people on the board just bought an (XB12S). This happened right after I bought my XB9SX. Funny no? | ||
| Uncle_bob |
I've often wondered why people bother posting threads on websites about bikes they don't like. Why waste the time? I believe this one started about Buell bashing on some Japanese sportbike site. I could care less if somebody has a bike that will do 135 mph in second gear with the front wheel up in the air. Why does any body need a motorcycle that will do 180MPH for the street? Just remember people, there's always somebody out there that's a better rider than you and has a faster bike. I'm quite content with my bikes performance. I bought my Buell because it looked and sounded like no other motorcycle knowing that it wasn't the baddest thing out there. I still love my bike and I'll ride with anybody, regardless of their brand or type of bike. These arguments remind me of the Ford, Chevy and Mopar guys that get into it all the time over who has the faster car. Different strokes for different folks I say.  | ||
| Doughnut |
Buells are not rockets. The aren't meant to be. You can't be "different in every sense" and be the same as the in-line 4, 180 hp monsters. If you wanted a missile on two wheels that can do 200 mph why did you get a Buell? | ||
| T9r |
I started with an Yamaha XJ550 Maxim like the one picture in the middle above. I loves my Buells (S3t & XB9R).... loves em' I tell ya'. | ||
| Thepup |
99BuellX1,the Trans was fixed at 13k then it was taken back to the dealer at 18k for a noise in the primary,thats 5k miles,thats when the regular service on the tranny is due,so you are not making any sense here.It was tight when i left the dealer it would have been tight when I did the service 5k miles later,wether I or the dealer did it. | ||
| Thepup |
M1 the buells and Guzzi's are allowed more mods than the 600's.You say the trap door on the Buells are the only difference than stock,according to the cycleworld article on the Buell FX bike mast the time they only use a 4 speed,thats quite a bit different than stock.this argument can go on and on.When you compare a bike from the showroom floor,we know what happens there too | ||
| Cataract2 |
I'm quite content with my bikes performance. I bought my Buell because it looked and sounded like no other motorcycle knowing that it wasn't the baddest thing out there. I still love my bike and I'll ride with anybody, regardless of their brand or type of bike. These arguments remind me of the Ford, Chevy and Mopar guys that get into it all the time over who has the faster car. Different strokes for different folks I say. I think this says a lot right here about my feelings and many others as well. | ||
| Tucsonxb9s |
Yawn...these arguments get tiring after a while. But, I need to get my $.02 in anyways!  Buell has built a motorcycle to fit a niche that seems to be ignored by a lot of mainstream manufacturers. A bike that can be enjoyed on your favorite twisty and can be taken to the track. It is a STREET bike that happens to be racing, not the other way around. If an inanimate object can have a personality, it is a Buell, and it has it in spades. I will not knock any other make or model for its performance. They ALL are good at what they are designed to do and some of them are damn sexy (all blacked out R-1 for example...yummy) They're just not my cup-o-tea... | ||
| BadS1 |
Pup you still don't know what your talking about. | ||
| Doughnut |
It is a STREET bike that happens to be racing, not the other way around.  | ||
| Nevar |
TucsonXB9S, I can't respect the opinion of someone from Tucson... LOL | ||
| Thepup |
What have I said that is wrong Bads?Doughnut is absolutely right,I know many here can't except that.Please Bads,enlighten me on the error of my ways. | ||
| Daves |
I never liked those CB750 bikes.  Real men rode 900Z1s | ||
| BadS1 |
You have no idea what your talking about when you say ... per say Honda's FX bikes are not as nearly modified as the BUELLS.You are entirely wrong.Every piece of those inlines are Extremely built.You can't get 145 hp out easily.It takes a huge amount of modifications to get there.Heck Duhamel calls them and these are his own words during a interview "Much like a miniature Super bike.The bikes you are most likely thinking of without all the MOD's is SuperSport which is basically a stock 600 except minor mods like Pipe,breaks,suspension.And mind you Buell does not compete in that class,only FX where they are with inline 600's. | ||
| BadS1 |
Dave I know where to get a first year 73 Z1 900.All original parts are there. |
