| Author | Message | ||
     Bud  |
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,140612,00.html After reading this column, I can’t believe what I read Is this guy for real, or some religion fanatics ? who has never even been to the Netherlands ? And had some good info these topics ? Sorry to post a not buell related topic, but I’m slightly put off by this “news column” A few weeks ago I saw a news item on cnn . and I must say it was very poorly brought It was , as I like to cal it, a hit and run article for good viewer numbers Very narrow minded only kicking headline’s not under building the story I hate to think that the general American view off Holland is that we’re all drug addicts , who kill there elderly and unborn baby’s while going to the red light district with some radical Muslim friends to celebrate anarchy. Gr,b | ||
| Blake  |
Did the baby euthenization law pass or not? That's all I saw in the article. I did just watch F9/11 though and Michael Moore certainly didn't reveal the Nederland in an honest light. Hey, don't ya know that all Americans are Bible thumpin' gun totin fat asses? I sure don't have any preconceptions about Holland other than the fine folks I've met and corresponded with from there. | ||
| Cataract2 |
No we American's are not such things. Now, I'm going to go clean my gun and read the bible while eating McDonald's. | ||
| Phatkidwit1eye  |
Interesting.....Let me see here....So they are running around mercy killing people and Babies yet our troops in Iraq are being brought up on charges for the same thing....This world gives me a headache  | ||
| Mbsween  |
Now wait a minute, carrying a bible, means three less 30 round clips. Us gun toting NYers need the extra ammo Cal Thomas is well, Cal Thomas, Bud, consider the source and you'll understand how meaningless the words are, except to those that want to hear them | ||
| Tucsonxb9s  |
"There are two things I can't stand...people who are intolerant of other people's culture...and the Dutch!" - Nigel Powers | ||
| Sportyeric  |
Well,if its on Fox it must be true. They're the only unbiased media out there.  | ||
| Dino  |
Rest easy, Bud. The average American doesn't know what Holland is, much less have an opinion about it. | ||
| Hans  |
Dutch? Hey, you wake me up from my thoughts. Now you have to listen what about: Today the funeral of Prince Bernhard. Husband of our late Queen Mother. Died at the age of 94. He was a WWII hero and best friend of our veterans. As pilot he had 12000 hours in his books. All military pomp was there and the Military Music Band blew the lungs out of their bodies, as it was their last show: They have to go because it is not an core task. My goodness: Those bean counters don`t understand nothing: Fighting soldiers have to be more than brave, and sometimes it will happen that their bravery is fed by the idea that there will be military music at their funeral. However: There was the traditonal last salut of fighter pilots: The missing man manouevre: Four planes passing by when one plane turns off sideways and up. In this case they were expected at 12.30 sharp, when the coffin was carried on the shoulders towards the church. Three F16`s and one WWII Spitfire. That aeroplane was the favourite of the Prince: He surrected during the war a Dutch Esquadron Spitfires in England. Well, The F16`s have to fly almost with their nose upward to generate enough lift at the relatively low speed of the Spit. But nowadays:Temps around zero and MIST. No problem for the all weather fighters, but it would be impossible for the Spitfire. At 12.29 and 30 seconds: The high pitched sound of a Spit at full throttle and the low grunt of the F16`s And there they were: The Spit like a midget between those dangerous dark animals. A very low low pass and the Spit made his slow turn to left, then faster and upward, and it vanished into the low grey clouds, leaving us with the slowly vanishing contours of three F16`s. Even at the third rehearsel I got tears in my eyes. Don`t know why exactly. Yeah, maybe because I supposed that it were circumstances were flying on sight was impossible and even not allowed, but they took the risks, and I think they would have done that, even when it was completely impossible. Hans | ||
| Bud |
Ok guy’s thanks I got the impression that mr. Thomas was a respected political journalist Ps. Blake Yes the law passed a few years back, but it’s not as easy as it sounds Before there’s any decision made, there must be very good reason to make such a drastic step And bought parents and medical staff have to live with this decision for the rest off there lives, The law is only there to protect the doctors from legal prosecution, For a act what otherwise was called a “natural death” or some medical mobojumbo For my self I have it in writing, when ever I become a veggie or need 24/24 medical care with no prospect off healing that the will pull my plug. That’s my own decision made by full awareness and spoken though with my folks, I hope it never comes so far, but when it douse , I hope they will honor my will Phuuu.. way to heavy stuff for a Saturday night  now it's party time Gr, bud @ hans it was a great man and he got a great ceremonie (Message edited by bud on December 11, 2004) (Message edited by bud on December 11, 2004) | ||
| Ingemar  |
I'm flabbergasted by the slowness at which dutch citizens wake up (not talking about you bud). The slumber they are in is so deep and intense, they are in a state of hybernation. Some try to get out and try to get a clear view of what is going on, but they fail miserably because they lack a larger picture. They have been too focused on their garden, a bigger car and a career for too long. Too much has been neglected. Now some are trying to look over their hedge, but theire hedge is so high they need to climb on the hood of their sparkling brand new Volvo XC70. What they see is confusing and then realize there is too much going on and can't comprehend it anymore. It's been too long they last watched over that hedge. Most people that wake up from their slumber think this •••• has dropped right out of sky. Not true. The Netherlands has been going downhill for a very long time. And the slope is getting steeper. I'm almost beginning to believe it has come to the point of no return. You know, when it gets so steep you can't climb back up anymore. We're almost there, if not already. The situation is worse than most people think. It's much worse than that little FoxNews story you just read. That is just a tip of the iceberg. The Netherlands must be one of the worst governed countries of the western civilization. The worst thing that has ever happened to us is the current ruling party. And I'm guilty. I voted for them. Worse, I convinced several other people (including my parents) to vote for them too. I cheered, merry as I was I raised my bottle of beer to the winner. Damn was I wrong. The first time in my life I vote and screw up worse than I could ever dream of. The very reason I never wanted to vote in the first place. If I didn't have so many dependencies I'd be out of here in a blink of an eye. | ||
| Ingemar |
Rest easy, Bud. The average American doesn't know what Holland is, much less have an opinion about it. That doesn't put anything to rest. The average American doesn't know more than wooden shoes and wind mills. The average American thinks Holland is the capital of Amsterdam. Well, Holland is a province. Amsterdam is in fact the capital of The Netherlands. To make things more complicated, The "dutch white house" is not at that place. That would be in The Hague. But I can't blame blame the average American for his ignorance. The place is too small and insignificant. We think we are a whole lotta something, but we're not. We try to play with the big guys, but we can't. All we can do is stick one arm up America's butt and the other up Brussel's and, as we see fit, do as either one of you says. Oke, I admit, I hate this country. I never wanted to though. I'd would love to be a patriot, and love my country and possibly even die for it. But not here. Not anymore. Sorry if I bored you with my ramblings, but I do feel a little better ... for now.  | ||
| Lovematt  |
I happen to love The Netherlands having spent nearly 1 year in the Rotterdam/Amsterdam area over the course of 1 month trips for work. Yes there are windmills andthey are awesome to walk up to and look at but there is much, much, much more to this country. | ||
| Bigeasy |
Ingemar, Hating your government is one thing but your government is not the whole country. You should be proud of how you are and where you come from. I sure there are lots of people that feel the same way as you in The Netherlands. So at the risk of sounding like an (as im not sure of your voting process or time line) couldnt you vote these people out of office the next go around? Hell if everyone could see into the future we would all be rich and have all are problems solved. Makes for a boring life, huh? Im sure you voted for what you thought at the time was best for your country, and thats all anyone can do. I have a guy from the Netherlands who works for me and we have become fast friends. His work and attiude are the best, I believe you can tell alot about a person by how they work. Anyway if all else fails catch the boat and come on over! Im sure I speak for all the badweb people when I say we could always use one more bueller. Stay to the south though, riding all year around here! art  (Message edited by bigeasy on December 12, 2004) (Message edited by bigeasy on December 12, 2004) | ||
| Hans |
Ingemar: I disagree strongly with most of your statements. For instance: " The Netherlands must be one of the worst governed countries of the western civilization." "The Netherlands has been going downhill for a very long time." And about your conclusion: "If I didn't have so many dependencies I'd be out of here in a blink of an eye." What would be the country, you would live in then ? I don`t want to bore the Badwebbers with all my arguments. Only one thing to consider: When you you are screaming loud enough in our little country, the President will hear you. In a big country even your neighbors don`t.  Hans | ||
| 1313  |
I too love the Netherlands. I spent 2 weeks in Hengelo - near Enschede - around New Years 2000 with one of my fraternity brothers who worked in the Netherlands for nearly 2 years. Since he had most of the 2 weeks I was there off from work I was able to see much of the countryside and take in a lot. Sure I spent some time in the areas that make the Netherlands unique, but I know that is not all that the country is about. Maybe I can sneak out of Germany when I am there for work in my upcoming trips and go back to see more of the Netherlands. 1313 | ||
| Ingemar |
Hans, You say I don`t want to bore the Badwebbers with all my arguments. Then why did you post at all? You may have bored someone already. You say you disagree but you don't want tell me why? I'm interested. Not to pick a fight with you, but because you seem to have a solid opinion about things. Pm me if you prefer. Het is voor ons beiden gemakkelijker in ons eigen kikkertaaltje denk ik. To answer your question as to where I would go, I'm not sure. Since I can't leave anyway it's not much use drooling over a map of Australia for instance. Yeah, I'd move to there if I could, be it for the weather alone and the buelltiful country side. I don't know much about Australia, other than that I agree with their immigration laws more than our own. Kinda weird, I agree with them while they keep me from moving their. | ||
| Court |
I have never met anyone from The Netherlands I did not like. Most countries, like most people and most motorcycles, have their seamy underside that's less desirable. Just out of curiousity, because I intend to go there, tell me some of the thing you DO like about The Netherlands. And, I confess to being totally ignorant. The upside is that I intend to change that. The people I have met from The Netherlands have made me very interested in visiting. Court | ||
| Peter  |
Think I'll stay out of this discussion  Court, there's a spare room here any time you decide to come over. We're about 100 miles out of Amsterdam now though... | ||
| Ingemar |
Whenever you do Court, make absolutely sure you let me know. If you need someone to pick you up from the airport, to drive around and take you to places, let me be your cabby. I'll take a day off from work if I have to. It will be a great honor to me. There are many things here that I like. Although life is changing faster than ever before, the good things still outweight the bad. Most people you will meet will be friendly and helpful. I like the fact that I can go nearly anywhere in this country and be safe. Of course for those new to the country there are the obvious places like Madurodam and a myriad of museums (maritime, aviation, 1st & 2nd WW, Anne Frank House). I don't know much about architecture, but I know what I like when I see it. My hometown Delft is just lovely. The city center at least. Historically unique. Rotterdam and Amsterdam are known for their architecture as well. Other places of interest might be Marken, Volendam and Urk. Not to forget the zoo in Emmen. Famous for their wide open spaces and natural habitats for the animals. And if you go to Emmen to visit the zoo, you just have to see the Hunnebedden. I'll leave it to your imagination as to what those are. If you like animals there is Safari park Beekse Bergen too. Then if you like a visit to one of the world's largest and most technologically advanced harbors in the world, I might be able to pull some strings and arrange a guided tour for you. | ||
| Jmartz  |
Ingemar: You surprise me. I have never visited the Netherlands (I will not call it Holland anymore) but all those I've ever met from your country have been wonderful people. The society seems quite advanced as a whole, when one considers things like, a shorter work week, 50 days of vacation, legalized pot and euthanasia. Yes its ultrasocialist like its other European neighbors but this is a consequence of the high population density which requires people to have to share. The US has been on a slow but non-stop lean towards the left since 1933. The only thing I could say that I don't like about your country is that is has a helmet law. Just attended an exhibition of van Gough. It was wonderful! | ||
| Hans |
OK Ingemar, you got a boring message via email, written in our mothers tongue. Speaking with the friends of my sons, I am very happy to see how optimistic they are about the future, without neglecting to consider possible disasters. I simply can`t keep my mouth shut when you write that our government is a such a disaster.  Hans | ||
| Bomber  |
you can find accurate facts to support a very dark view of any society and culture -- like others have posted, though, I've never met anyone for the Netherlands that didn't strike me a someone with whom I shared a great deal, and with whom I could be friends -- coming from a curmudgeon like me, that's saying something (though goodness knows what) Hans -- there's no such thing as a government that is NOT a disaster -- while two heads may, in fact, be better than one, at some point, the increase in brain power begins to fall with added brains (5 seems to be the point at which intelligence falls in relation to the growth in brains brought together)--- Netherlands is exploring the edges of acceptance and tolerance -- this deserves a huge thank you from the rest of the planet -- they seem to have found a couple of those edges, and are attempting to adjust -- me, I'm rootin for em, as they've demonstrated huge tenacity and streght in the past, and will in the future, I'm sure | ||
| Oddbawl  |
"Yes its ultrasocialist like its other European neighbors but this is a consequence of the high population density which requires people to have to share." So population density is the only reason to take care of each other? There's only a few nations on the planet where socialism is a four letter word. | ||
| Bud |
lol... we should have kept Manhatten. ps. court i live at a brick throw from schiphol, my house ain't big or fancy, but the welcome will be i used to sleeping on the floor gr, bud | ||
| Ingemar |
You guys seem to confuse my hatred against our current government with hatred against the people that live in this land. Wrong. I never said anything bad about the people that live here. I just VERY STRONGLY disagree with happens lately with our government, even to a point that I have come to hate it. Hans, Thanks for your mail. I've read it and I will reply to you personally. I didn't think it was boring at all and I'm happy not everyone is like me in their way of thinking By the way, my parents live in Emmen. Are you anywhere near them? One more thing ... are you seriously 68 and riding a Buell?  | ||
| Court |
Stand down my Netherlandatian pals.... Turns out that one of my wife's associates is coming to The Netherlands this week. Anything taking place in Stockholm or Amsterdam that would be of special interest. If there are any events taking place please drop me a note and let me know or post it here. She's short like Vickie, so events close to the ground would be best. I'm going to see how she likes it before I party with you guys on your home turf! Seriously, I can't wait! Court P.S. - there are a few Americans who could learn much from you folks about how to hold a discussion without wringing each others necks! | ||
| Ingemar |
so events close to the ground would be best. uh ... a bowling contest  | ||
| Davegess |
OH MY GOD NOW THE BEDWEBBERS ARE ARGUING ABOUT DUTCH POLITICS. AS IF US POLITICS WASN'T BAD ENOUGH. I NEED TO START A CONTACT PATCH THREAD QUICK.  | ||
| Hans |
Bomber, you are right again. Brainpower is reciprocal with the number of added brains. Still questioning if that will be true starting from three or two. Best government would be a wise dictator or still better: A female dictator ( dictatrix ?) While too much power corrups always in the end, it can`t be an option. In the old ages there were some wise and good Kings: First selected and their inheritance became educated on the job, during many generations, but the inevitable law of nature let them produce, sooner or later, a minus variant with the most gruesome results. Next best is a democracy with this great disadvantage: The leaders with an, exceptional good, long term vision are dependent of voters with short term visions. When decisions of good leaders are grounded on an healthy long term vision you could call that disasters, when it is in conflict with their promises during voting time. ( "Read my lips." Bwoaahh) Strongly disagree with your opinion about government. Any government will be build out of straight people, stretchers of the truth, turnarounds and even plain liars: No reason to call any government a disaster. It may take 25 years before you can judge them. About tolerance: Yeah, we certainly found some edges and we are coming back from them. People are not jet accustomed to a zero tolerance of the police in some areas. A boy who gave cops his middlefinger was taken to a police station after his resistance. His birthday party had been disturbed and it became even a media topic. Good PR to get sooner a more respectful attitude to the law and their servants.  Ingemar, thanks for your reaction. My age is 65 and I will ride my Buell as long as I am able to get my bike on its wheels after a tip over. Had last years no chance to give proof, but I am very confident, because my retirement state brings me to lots of muscle work, making me stronger by the day.  Hans | ||
| Peter |
Ingemar, Not only is he 65, but I've personally seen him scrape the pegs of his Buell at Zandvoort.... There's still plenty of life in that old dog  | ||
| Turnagain  |
And I understand he’s got some cool yard-art… or maybe a figment of some imagination.  | ||
| Dscak |
Along with my wife and son, I lived in Elslo, the Netherlands, in 1974 and 75. I will not bore everyone with the stories, but suffice it to say, of all the assignments I had on active duty in the US Army (23 years), the tour in the Netherlands was certainly the most wonderful. We lived in a small village and our landlords treated us as though we were their children. I will never forget the welcome we received and the friendships made. Dan | ||
| Hans |
Turnagain, LOL. Another job to do. Those Kings of thee old days were smart. To prevent them for estimating themselves too almighty, they had a nasty little fellow around them. They paid him even to burst his own blown ego with striking remarks and some humor. Those little men were allowed to flame the king, when it seemed properly to them. Only they got the right to do that. BTW: Why should everybody have to have the same rights ? We need all in fact such a  with special rights. And Badweb needs Rocketman. He was maybe he fly in the soup, he was also the salt in the porridge. Hans |
