| Author |
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Coolice
| | Posted on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 03:38 pm: | 
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Yep and its good to be able to see the potential that Eric and Co. are bringing out of the Buell engine. So I can't wait til Daytona! |
BadS1
| | Posted on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 03:46 pm: |
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Man I can't wait.Every year I sit in front of the tube and don't like interuptions.Now I FINALLY get a chance to go but the kicker is that the FX class is the featured class and I get to see BUELLS first time out at Daytona.Its gonna rock. |
Court
| | Posted on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 04:39 pm: |
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>>>I get to see BUELLS first time out at Daytona.Its gonna rock.
That is an accurate statement. |
Kbbeckius
| | Posted on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 07:57 pm: |
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"its good to be able to see the potential that Eric and Co. are bringing out of the Buell engine."
Yes, Mr. Buell never ceases to amaze me, how much more "potential" can he wring out of that air-cooled pushrod packin' dinosaur design?? Amazing...
I love the man for doing things the wrong way 
Thx Brad |
Johnnyxb9
| | Posted on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 09:07 pm: |
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ANYONE SEE TWO WHEELED TUESDAY? MIKE WAS SAYING THAT HIS XB RACE BIKE IS PUSHING 140HP AND 110 FT/LBS TQ. HE ALSO MENTIONED THAT IT WAS A 1340CC.PRETTY SICK #S FOR A BIKE WITH A 52 INCH WHEELBASE. |
BadS1
| | Posted on Friday, October 15, 2004 - 09:22 pm: |
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Umm it doesn't have a 52 inch wheelbase,Its longer. |
Zx9rmal
| | Posted on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 10:57 am: |
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<<The need to re sync throttle bodies on the BMW Boxer twins is an issue that reoccurs with enough frequency that I took notice, even though I'm not entirely certain of what it entails. Any time the engine starts running poorly, the first recommended course is to re sync them.>>
I've had several Boxer twins and synching is a no brainer.
I'd love to see the Buells have their OWN proprietary motor, e.e., 1000cc, DOHC, 4 valves per cylinder, 110-120hp to the tire. Or, if reliable, an "M" version (like the BMW cars) of the current motor.
Erik, if you build it they WILL come! |
Gschuette
| | Posted on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 08:48 pm: |
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The VROD has been out on the market know for over two years and has twin throttle valves. I haven't heard any negative comments about the VROD as of yet.
Lightning didn't Porsche design the V-rod engine? If so that might explain the reliability but because of that I wonder if V-rods drink a lot of oil. |
Lightning_strikes_now
| | Posted on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 08:59 pm: |
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Gschuette: Porsche did help in the design of the VROD engine. However, I'm not sure who makes the throttle bodies. I hope it don't use any oil! Since it's water cooled, it shouldn't - as long as the piston rings are seated properly and it has good valve seals. |
Bigdaddy
| | Posted on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 09:44 pm: |
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Porsche was instrumental in making the Revo motor streetable, but they had an very good head start with the VR1000 superbike unit as a template. It doesn't use oil.
Highlights: fast, eats up hwy miles, very comfy for the 500 mile days (I like wind blast!)
Lowlights: gas tank size, gas tank size, and the gas tank size, stock exhaust, pig in the twisties, one-up bike (unless you're sub 6 footer?) and the number one lowlight,,,,,mine has no soul. It just doesn't 'speak' to me. |
Kbbeckius
| | Posted on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 10:18 pm: |
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I'd really like to see Buell come up with their own engine too...
I was thinking something to fit in the existing XB chassis, I came up with the design for this narrow degree V3 (ever see VW's VR6?), scribbled it all out on paper onetime...
Actually, how about these???
http://www.maxtengines.com/pages/437698/index.htm
It'd be good if we could get some more RPM out of the engine... It's not an airflow problem really, 'cause the torque never really drops off at redline. It's probably because of valve float, but the above would help less valvetrain mass per spring. It's also because of piston speed and the heavy rotating mass of the engine as well, we need flyweight pistons and titanium rods....$$ cha-ching
Thx Brad
(Message edited by kbbeckius on October 17, 2004) |
M1combat
| | Posted on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 11:23 pm: |
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It's mostly piston speed I think... these engines need to be VERY oversquare. |
Odie
| | Posted on Saturday, October 16, 2004 - 11:45 pm: |
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More power would be nice but.........one of the many reasons I bought a Buell is because of the Harley motor. I'm a Harley guy from a ways back and this just gives me the best of both worlds. NOTHING beats the sound of a Harley motor (except for them calling out my lottery numbers for bajillions of $$$$)....Odie |
Xbolt12
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 02:24 am: |
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I for one think the current xb engine has plenty of potential. Think about it. The stroke could be shortened (but not too much please). The crank could be lightened. The heads could be four valve even with overhead valves. The single throttle body could be replaced with duals. The transmission could be six-speed. The transmission parts could be lightened for better shifting. The gap between 1st and 2nd gears could be reduced for better shifts (I am talking clearances not ratios). The heads and barrels could be water-cooled. It could be modified to be overhead cam. ......etc, etc.
The point is the engine fits the frame and harley has the tooling. It can always be incrementally upgraded and my guess is that is what Buell will do.
Just my $.02
xbolt12 |
Kbbeckius
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 06:43 am: |
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Yeah, check out my link above about the four valve heads  it's available now, if the factory will pick up on it... we'll see
Thx Brad |
Court
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 06:47 am: |
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xbolt12:
You get bonus points for having reference to S22 in your profile, remind me to share some OLD pics when the S-1 was being sorted out there.
Note to newbies: There is a wide range of references to who did and did not design and contribute to the VROD engine and the VR1000. Read these thing while being mindful that this is the internet. In some cases the "idea" is right, the details a bit embellished. In other cases the discussion heads toward fantasy world.
My bet is that any Buell engine developments may enjoy outside engineering support but . . that support will be executing specific directions from Buell. Just a guess. |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 10:16 am: |
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How about a larger displacement V twin with lighter materials, alloys etc.
How about a new six speed trans with lighter materials etc.
How about a touring version to compliment the great street bike?
I have seen engines in cars get progressively lighter as have they entire drivetrains. Keep the air cooled V and give us more cubes and lighter weight? |
Hootowl
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 12:51 pm: |
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My understanding re the VROD engine is that it was developed in Germany by both HD and Porche because the US HD engineers were neck deep in the twin cam project and HD didn't have the in-house resources to begin another development project. |
Gschuette
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 02:43 pm: |
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I was joking about the oil issue. Old Porsche cars seemed to be notorious for sipping oil. |
Kowpow225
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 03:55 pm: |
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Hoot Owl,
I understood it the same way with porsche in the mix.
I haven't ridden a V-rod yet, although I'm waiting patiently. Anybody ridden one? What did ya think? Do they accelerate similar to an XB? Power surges or anything else of note? I think buell could do a lot of development around the V-rod motor and not mimick it. |
Bigbird
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 07:10 pm: |
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The heads could be four valve even with overhead valves.
Let's hope so...I'd hate to buy a new Buell only to find the engine came from a Servi-Car  |
Brucelee
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 08:01 pm: |
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You know, the guys at Corvette have had a pushrod 2 valve engine for ever (well at least since 1955 or so). In the years since 1984 they have increased horsepower from 205 to 450 (next year's z06). In the process, they have lightened the motor, increased gas mileage about 33% and created one hell of an engine. Still no overhead cams etc.
I just wonder if Buell has torn one of these babies down to see what they might "borrow" from the technology.
Having said that, the existing Buell engine is a massive improvement over the previous stock shorty engine.
Just a thought! |
Trenchtractor
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 08:43 pm: |
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"Old Porsche cars seemed to be notorious for sipping oil"
That's 'cos they were VW motors!! Or is it the other way around??
From a VROD add:
"Black frmae around the silver and black V-twin that Porsche worked on with Harley-Davidson."
That Porsche "worked on"??? What did the Porsche guys really contribute?? If Porsche had a hand in the engineering of the motor, you'd think the add would read "engineered with the assistance of porsche"...
BTW, in a straight line drag the VROD and xb12 are pretty well matched... The VROD is heavier, though... I still say give us a VROD powered XB, I still say if Buell got to tune the VROD motor it would fly.
But then, the XB's can have super aggressive geometry to compensate for the contankerous nature of the motor. There are a lot of reciprocating forces trying to prevent turn in in that air cooled V Twin. If you made them too much lighter, the bike would be very unstable, requiring a new chassis anyway. Equals all new motorcycle. |
Bigdaddy
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 10:39 pm: |
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There's very little doubt about the Revo heritage:
"The V-Rod is the first member of a new family of Harley-Davidson motorcycles," said Vice President of Engineering, Earl Werner. "This all-American custom was inspired by Harley-Davidson’s drag racing heritage and the VR 1000 Superbike race engine. It’s really a stunning styling and engineering accomplishment."
It's not as clear when it comes to the 'exact' development team that made it a real world product. Harley-Davidson’s Powertrain Engineering team get's the official credit, but who's that?
Porsche did have a VR1000 motor to work with:
"Harley's long and winding road to production included shipping a rowdy and not altogether reliable VR1000 race bike engine to Germany for etiquette lessons from Porsche."
I've lost the source of the above quotation. I would've put it in wrong anyway. My MLA skills are more than a bit rusty.
Greg |
Anonymous
| | Posted on Sunday, October 17, 2004 - 11:30 pm: |
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back when all the VR1000's were built in York, there was this early VR1000 motor (I think it was used for mock up tooling) It had a rear shock mount on the bottom............ |
Dale
| | Posted on Monday, October 18, 2004 - 12:28 am: |
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The V-Rod has a great motor. 81000 Miles, makes it Dale proof. |
Trenchtractor
| | Posted on Monday, October 18, 2004 - 03:39 am: |
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Annon, by "a rear shock mount on the bottom", do you mean for underslung rear shock?? |
Firebolt020283
| | Posted on Monday, October 18, 2004 - 10:46 am: |
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hadnt harley been putting underslung rear shocks on there bikes for a while now (soft tails)? |
Court
| | Posted on Monday, October 18, 2004 - 11:56 am: |
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Softtail shocks work in compression, Buells in extension. Different patents. |
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