| Author | Message | ||
     Davegess |
Your bike is laying there with badly bent forks, you tennis shoes are down the street, your shorts and tshirt are mostly gone to reveal yards of road rash, your strapped to a back board with a neck inmobiliser on AND your wearing handcuffs. Saw a kid trying to run from the cops down busy city streets. Needless to say he did not make it. Wearing a helmet so he is alive. Lucky he didn't kill someone. | ||
| Impulse_101 |
Was this in milwaukee Dave? | ||
| Davegess |
Shorewood, which is just north of downtown. Old city type neiborhood, the kid is blasting down a busy, main, two way street with parking and driveways on both sides. Saturday afternoon. Had to be doing 50 to 60 mph some folks say 80. Put a dent a foot across by six inches deep in the palstic fender of a moving car. Folded the forks back up into the radiator. I don't even like riding down it because it has so many people turning left, pulling out of driveways, jaywalking etc. Sure impressed the neighborhoods with the value of not running away from the cops. | ||
| Court |
I've a friend who is a police officer and the cops win nearly ALL chases. Do they win cause a Crown Vic is faster?....no. Do they win based on superior handling?....no. They win cause by maintaining gentle pressure, knowing that the odds of a collision, in a pursuit, are incredibly elevated and all they really need to do is wait to play "pick up the perp". One hint I gave him, based on experience, is whenever he pulls a bike over to announce over the PA.."toss the keys from the ignition" BEFORE he exits the car. Don't ask me how I know this.  | ||
| Wyckedflesh |
Can't outrun Motorola...nope. radio waves travel faster then your bike everytime... | ||
| Bomber |
panicked people don't ride so good also, revealing one's self to be a grey beard when removing one's helmet can settle down a jumpy officer, as well as tend to lessen any further penalties suggested by said officer ("OK, sir, try to keep it down a little, would you?" as opposed to "where the heck are YOU goping in such a hurry, kid?"  and always, move slowly, make deliberate movements toward your wallet, be respectful, and keep your mitts visable . . . .those guys have enough trouble -- no need to add to their jitters | ||
| Phatkidwit1eye |
Police chases suck. They always seem to end up killing innocent people. We lost two riders already who where killed when they where hit by a suv doing 80mph with police in tow. They where on a unlit street when the suv with no lights on hit them. Two riders and one passenger killed. I can see police chases if it's a serious threat like if the person just killed someone or robbed a bank. The city of Omaha spent a ton of money on a helicopter but all it seems to do is fly around my block and wake me up late at night. | ||
| Dasxb9s |
They don't always end up killing people. No one I chased died or was involved in an accident. "Always" is an exaggeration. Sometimes innocent people die. The innocent people are the ones who die that ARE NOT involved in the case! One the complications in figuring things out, just before you turn on all the red lights (not factoring in that a no chase policy invites people to run from tickets) is why did they run. Those that run DO NOT yell back at the police car and say "I am running because of a probation violation warrant!" It sure would be nice if they did, so when it happens and someone yells "I am running because I think I am faster than you and I want to have fun evading you!" The officer can say, OK... you win, I will be at your house tomorrow with an arrest warrant (assuming he/she saw a license plate). More often than not (it might vary in jurisdictions) the reason they ran was that they also had warrants, thought they had warrants, or had illegal stuff in the car or on their person. They weren't worried about the ticket they just earned in those cases, it was the arrest on the warrant and the tow. Yes, chases suck, having been in a few (in the car with all the red flashing lights) not what I considered fun. Any fault in accidents or innocent deaths should be placed on the one who ran, not the police (assuming they follow policy and chase responsibly, using judgment when seeing a death might result from their involvement). The police did not cause the person to run. It's all about accepting responsibility for one's actions. If I run and because of what I have done someone gets hurt or worse, the responsibility falls squarely on me. For had I not run, those actions would not have happened, it called cause and effect. The red lights on the police car behind me did not cause me to run. The key is a good chase policy, training for the officers in pursuits, the authorization to use tactics in the case of chasing cars to bump and cause a spin out, and strongly present info during training when one should break off a pursuit. Policing is not an easy profession. It is even more complex now than when I first got into it (mid 1970s). But... for those cop bashers out there, nothing I or anyone else write here will change your opinion of cops. SO for them... Yep... you are totally right! It's all a power trip, and we don't care who gets hurt, just as long as we chase down those we cause to run by turning on our lightbar! ...and in ALL cases... it is very sad that running from a ticket or an arrest makes someone endanger their own life. A ticket is not worth dieing for to avoid! ...and possibly in all cases, those persons gave NO thought of who they might endanger! At that time, it's all about them!!! I am sorry to hear that those 3 in the example above died, and how their families are also the victims of that loss, and the people in the suv that hit them, that were also impacted by the deaths cause by the collision! Running is always a lose - lose situation. Does anyone think that those who run are taking responsibility for their actions, and how those actions might endanger others? (A rhetorical question) I think not! | ||
| Bomber |
phat while I won't say, like others, that no mistakes are made duriong chanses, I gotta go with whichever of DAS' personae is posting this morning . . . . .if ya run, it's all, and I mean ALL on your head . . . . . don't run, the cahnces of your evading whatever you are running from is so lonw, and the likelyhood of greater harm coming to you (not to mention others) is so high, is just dumb . . . . . | ||
| Court |
Dennis: Thank you for a responsible, reasonable view "from inside the car with the lights". "All" and "Always" are most unfair and inaccurate terms to apply. Anecdotal examples of police errors make great copy. The fact that MOST are trained, restrained and know when to abstain, is dull. Thanks for bringing a bit of a shine to it in the light of day. Court (who by the way has perfected a "Buell Media Technique" - [see "Notes from Lap of America - July 9, 1995"] for defusing unexpected (in this case a Mustang hidden in the trees of the NYS Thruway) encounters with law enforcement. My bet is the cop is STILL smiling about it....remind me to tell you sometime) | ||
| Dasxb9s |
Alicante, Spain, apparently has a no chase policy. I have a news clip from Spanish TV of their way of dealing with the no chase policy. A fella robs a bank and takes hostages. In exchange for the hostages he gets a sport bike. Looks like a good trade for him. He takes off, not really cracking the throttle, but eventually builds up a little speed. There is not a police car chasing him. He is just on his way out of his evenings accomplishments with his new sport bike. I assume they have a no chase policy even for "bank robbers". As he is picking up speed down the boulevard, an unmarked police car quickly pulls into his path. The sport bike stops against the right side of the vehicle, parts flying like it just exploded. The up to that point happy robber does a cart wheel spin over the police car and lands rather hardly about 3 or 4 car lengths past the other front fender. He was wearing a helmet and he looked alive after the landing. The next video scene shows the man with his hands cuffed behind his back being carried face down by his handcuffed arms and legs and tossed into an ambulance. A no chase policy in this case was not a benefit to the guy on the sport bike. As "bad" as it is in the US related to vehicle chases, I am thinking you would not want to go to most countries outside the US and run from the police. Alicante, Spain apparently has a no chase policy!!! You know you are having a bad day... when you test the no chase policy in Spain. | ||
| Dasxb9s |
Court... You gotta quit teasing with the "remind me to tell you sometime" and write a frigging book!!!!! A voice from a PA coming from a police car, directly behind Court... "Sir, remove your keys and toss them on to the curb." "Now sir, just write the book and quit teasing everyone!" "Do it now!" Court... Paul Harvey called... and he wants "the rest of the story"!!! | ||
| Bomber |
page . . . . . .TWO! | ||
| Outrider |
I like the LAPD's Squad and two Helicopter approach to fleeing Perps. Have a good friend that retired from the South Central Division and the stories were phenomenal. | ||
| Glitch |
Any fault in accidents or innocent deaths should be placed on the one who ran, not the police Why is it nowa days people tend to put blame on everyone except on those who are at fault. Das, thanks for your part in helping keep the peace these days. I don't know how you do it and stay sane enough to hang out here with a bunch of hooligans like us.  | ||
| Dasxb9s |
Sane??? Most people would not use that word and me in the same sentence! Check with KC Mobbers... they will tell you I will never be the poster child for normal. I just have one or two of my multiple personalities that occasionally have lucid moments! It even surprises me when it happens!!!  edited by dasxb9s on July 09, 2004 | ||
| Henrik |
Das; great post! Thank You! Don't care which one of your personalities that posted - I like it Henrik | ||
| Court |
>>>they will tell you I will never be the poster child for normal. You are among friends. Henrik and I, I fear, have defined the Oscar Madison and Felix Unger of Buelldom. I'm fine, Henrik is odd. | ||
| Court |
Besides....we have few police chases with the NYPD. That's the "upside". The "downside" is that if they catch you, you are in a world of "s**t*...quite literally!  | ||
| Cj_xb |
I'm fine, Henrik is odd. Well, I think Henrik is "Fine" !!! Oh, but maybe I'm not using the same definition of the word !! CJ  P.S. But Court you certainly aren't odd either !! | ||
| Court |
>>>P.S. But Court you certainly aren't odd either !! May I quote you? | ||
| Bomber |
er, CJ . . . . . far be it form me to correct a southern belle in public, but I'm not sure you have access to sufficient data to make that call . . . . .. although you could choose anyone of a number of other words . . . .the options are legion, and manifold | ||
| Firemanjim |
Isn't odd,that madam is inaccurate.And I can come up with a myriad of other descriptive nouns,a veritable plethora----possibly a cornucopia--- (can you tell the crossword was not challenging enough this morning!!) | ||
| Phatkidwit1eye |
I guess I used "always" out of context. I guess what I was trying to say was "some" police chases don't end the way they should. I'm not a police basher b/c I do respect what you do. None-the-less I'm a taxpayer and I do have the right to be critical of those whom my small amount of taxes go to. Just like when I bitch about our Mayor or Nebraskas temporary wheel tax (temporary since 1970's). I do feel the same that all responsibility should fall on the criminal. I also think a Police Officer should be able to see that a chase is not worth it. I understand there are different circumstances and to discus each one would be probably longer than the war thread. I try to be harsh when it comes to these things and try to think the person running got what they deserved. I really want to feel that way but in all honesty I can't always feel that way. What would have been accomplished if this kid were killed? Not to mention his family trying to file a huge wrongful death suit. Nothing pisses me off more then knowing that tax dollars are going to some family. I understand Cops walk a tight rope of not doing enough and doing too much. | ||
| Court |
CJ for Queen of all Buells! The rest of you heathens....scat now! | ||
| Cj_xb |
CJ for Queen of all Buells! Yep, he's a Genius (sp?), and kind and good and smart and funny !! (yeah okay, flattery will get Court everywhere!) Now Bomber you and FMJ can take those big words somewhere else, geezzzz I had to get out a dictionary !! CJ | ||
| Aesquire |
One fine day, I got nearly run over by an idiot pulling out of a parking lot. So I swerved to avoid death or injury, crossing double yellow line, just in time for Monroe county Deputy to come over rise & see motorcycle "passing" car crossing...... Girlfriend on back, GS750. I pulled over at next safe place. First words out of Deputy's mouth "There is no way I could have caught you!" I pointed at passenger, told him I had a passenger, was not a jerk, and they didn't pay him enough to chase me. He admired my bike, and despite my explanation, wrote me a ticket anyway. Which I lost. Oh well, it all evens out. | ||
| Dasxb9s |
Phatkid... What the hell is a wheel tax??? Cj... I thought you would rather be a Mob member, or even a KC Mob officer (BRAG)??? We could use some adult supervision!!! You would pick NYC over KC??? | ||
| Cj_xb |
Oh yeah Dasxb, I forgot !! CJ | ||
| Court |
>>>One fine day, I got nearly run over by an idiot pulling out of a parking lot. What the .....I come out of a meeting and you are talking about me behind my back? |
