| Author | Message | ||
     Dalurker |
Hello, I am having electrical issues with my Uly. I took it to the HD dealer and long story short they determined it to be a short somewhere in my main harness that goes through the inside of the frame. They wanted around $700 to take it out and check it over. So, here I am trying to do it myself. Has anyone removed the full harness? Or give me tips to search for this short without removing the harness? Any help would be appreciated | ||
| Pontlee77 |
Would be of help if you point out the problems so We can guide you. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
You shouldn't need to remove the whole damn harness. Sounds like you did the right thing in ditching the dealership. Concentrate your search on places where bending and rubbing would occur. (steering neck, around vibrating engine) | ||
| Dalurker |
Hopefully I don't need to remove it. The bike started to just quit on me while I was riding, then I would start it back up and it would be fine. Only did it while it was cold. Then it was quitting more often and not starting back up. Not long after that it was throwing codes for the TPS, exhaust module, tip sensor, and crankshaft sensor(?). This all escalated within 2 weeks. When I took it to the dealer, the battery was dead right after I had it running for a bit. While the bike was there the fan going on and off so they had to pull a fuse to get it to stop. That's pretty much the most of it. So I will be picking the bike up today and searching for a short. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
A shakey ground connection can do all manners of odd things too. I would start there. Other things to be aware of is that some of the sensors of the bike run off of 5V that comes out of the ECU. Go after the simple stuff first like bad ground, rubbed wires. Follow the wires carefully from one of the afflicted sensors to the computer. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Don't remove the harness, just work your way down it, starting under the flyscreen (including that ground). Run the wires through your fingers, feeling for ones that have the internal metal broken (but insulation intact). They are easy to feel. Solder or crimp the in an extension where they were broken, bundle them back up carefully, put some split loom cable armor on them secured by cable ties, and finish chasing it down. You can do a lot of it without rotating the engine, and see if that "fixes" it. Also look for cracked ECM symptoms, which can look very similar. And don't dismiss the possibility that there can be more than one simultaneous issue (mine had two cracked wires right under the frame where it came in from the flyscreen). | ||
| Etennuly |
You can check the charging system also, a weak battery or bad connections can cause a low voltage situation that will make a lot of things unhappy. If you grab the battery connections with your fingers can you force them to move? Terminals coming loose is a common problem. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
When the fan was doing its thing, had you just ridden the bike in? What I am getting at is, would the fan have normally been running at that point? If yes, the problem could easily be at the ECU connector. The fan runs when it is grounded by the ECU, If the fan should be running, and it is running intermittently, the ECU may not be making a good ground. Of course, this could be the root of a lot of other issues as well. | ||
| Dalurker |
Thanks for the responses. Harley swapped out the ECU with a with a new one and tested the charging system and both checked out. I took apart all grounds I could I find, sanded them down, put electric grease on them, and tightened them back down. The fan was definitely coming on when it shouldn't have. The bike was ridden from cold for about 2 blocks before it quit and threw codes with the fan on full blast. I will start checking out wiring and go from there, I guess. | ||
| Dalurker |
I got the bike back. The fan comes on when I put the fuse in with the ignition OFF. So the fan is getting power somewhere in the bike. | ||
| Danair |
The fan is straight off the battery so it is always *hot*. The ecm provides the ground. If its running as you say, its getting a ground elsewhere. The connector is a bitch to get to, but will give a good starting point. Do a continuity check to ground on both pins of both connector halves. There should be none. Post findings. | ||
| Etennuly |
Yep, it sounds like the wire from the ECM side to the fan has grounded out. Chase and trace time. | ||
| Hughlysses |
...or cut the wire at both ends and run a new one outside of the harness. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
If the fan runs at maximum speed, there is likely a short to ground. Except for idling in traffic and when it first switches on, most of the fan's running time is at partial speed and it is action by the ECU that sets this lower speed. A direct ground however, bypasses the ECU's control. | ||
| Dalurker |
Alright, I removed the fan and disconnected the connector. I have continuity from the black/orange wire(wire harness side) to ground when the ECM is plugged in. I unplug the grey connector and I no longer have continuity to ground. So is there a ground in the grey connector on the ECM? The wires showing look fine, unless there is something in the harness that I can't see. | ||
| Dalurker |
Also, I noticed the bottom of the ECM on the grey connector side gets really warm to the touch when its plugged in. Anyone else notice that? Maybe something creating a lot of resistance inside of it. As of right now, when I turn the key to ON the fan goes full bore and it starts flashing codes. It will turn over but not start. | ||
| Dalurker |
Sorry for the multiple posts, my thoughts are all over the place. I've been dealing with this problem for the past month. A month of no riding and good weather can take its toll on a man. My understanding is that there is only three ways for the fan to kick on right now. A short, faulty ECM, or bad engine temp sensor. Am I correct? I checked the Engine Temp Sensor and the resistance was a little high, but that would have been in my favor because it would have told the ECM that the motor was cold so the fan shouldn't have kicked on. Any thoughts? | ||
| Etennuly |
Can you test the ECM? It does not seem that is should get hot with no known load being turned on. May be an internal short. The fan has power to it at all times from the fuse panel. It's control is done by grounding through the ECM. With the fan connector unplugged will the engine start and run? | ||
| Etennuly |
Sorry, I re-read the entire post seeing that they tried a different ECM. I would think the dealer should have had a 'break out box' that tests continuity from harness plugs to each individual part. I see you have an SX, not a Ulysses. Is that correct? Some things are different on them. I have repaired a couple of niner XBs wiring issues that had the main power leads from the voltage regulator short out on a sharp edge of the muffler brackets under the engine. It caused all kinds of stupid stuff to happen kind of like what you are experiencing. The Uly wires are run differently under there. Shit, now I re-read my re-read WITH my glasses on and see you are working on a Uly. Sorry again.  But what the heck, it is worth a look in that area or of the 77 connector under the cover of the front drive sprocket.That plug can melt causing your positive to get negative. A main power lead short can certainly heat up your ECM. I repaired a XB9 Firebolt, and a City-X, both with the same/very similar symptoms by finding the VR leads shorted to the muffler mount on the bottom of the engine. (Message edited by etennuly on June 27, 2014) | ||
| Dalurker |
Update: I took Etennuly's advice and checked the plugs down by the exhaust and unplugged and cleaned the connectors. The connector for the Cam Position Sensor was kind of stuck and some crap fell out of it. After that the codes went away and it will actually run now. It runs pretty rough, like it has a vacuum leak or it's missing. One code is left and I put a jumper wire across the two terminals on the diagnostics port and it blinked 54. Which, according to the book, means there is an internal error in the ECM. I am thinking it got fried when it got hot from the cam position sensor connector screwed up. Harley has a race ECM for my Drummer pipe for $380 or I can order from EBR for $305. Is there a difference between the HD ECM and the EBR ECM? Thanks for the advice so far, everyone (Message edited by dalurker on June 27, 2014) | ||
| Etennuly |
The battery being of less than 12.2+ volts will make everything fail tests. The book says 12.6V is the minimum supply voltage for testing any of the electrical system problems. Real world voltage is between 12.2 to 12.6 that I have seen. I don't even know how you got it to start being in the range of 11 volts without jumping or pushing it off. | ||
| Dalurker |
I replaced the ECM and battery. It runs now. When I first start it up it will start up great but putter out and die. After it is warm it will idle at about 700rpm. Do I need to get my TPS reset? | ||
| Hughlysses |
If you installed a new/different ECM in a pre-08 Buell, yes, you need to have the TPS reset. | ||
| Dalurker |
Alright, thanks. Is there any way I can still get the software to do the TPS reset myself? It is getting really old bringing it to the dealer, especially since they want to charge me $85 to reset it. | ||
| Tpehak |
Hey, I believe you don't need to rotate the engine to remove whole wire harness? Just remove airbox, tail section, rear shock absorber and cooling fan, right? Anyone knows part number for plastic clips for main harness plastic guide to reattach it to the flame? | ||
| Tpehak |
OK, I found the clips. PN C0033.02A8 https://st-paul-harley-davidson-buell.myshopify.co m/products/c0033-02a8-genuine-buell-fastener-tree- 2003-2010-xb-models-b3q 1.5$ for a piece! That's pricey. Anyone knows replacement part from Autozone maybe or on eBay? | ||
| Tpehak |
I found replacement for OEM clip PN TM12388 on twinmotorcycles. But I can not find this part anywhere else. Anyone knows who is the manufacturer for part TM12388 ? https://www.twinmotorcycles.nl/webshop/artikel.asp ?mc=1&aid=13839 | ||
| Froggy |
That TM number is a Twin Motorcycles number, not an OEM part. C0033.02A8 is the OE part. |
