| Author | Message | ||
     Stretchman |
I know there was talk before all of this happened about them building an adventure bike. I am wondering if there is any chance that they might be considering it? There are so many reports about the company now that it is getting kind of confusing. I can afford to wait if there is a possibility that something is in the works. BMW, KTM, Triumph, Ducati, and lots of Asian marques o choose from. But adventure bikes break when you use them accordingly, and I am seriously wondering if there is going to be a supply side issue, like there is with all of the others. Still, would like to see something from them, and would consider it over another brand if it is up to snuff. Doesn't need to be too fancy, but it does have to work. Keeping my finger crossed. | ||
| Rwven |
If I were in the market for a "real" adventure bike right now I'd be looking at Honda's new Africa Twin. | ||
| Hughlysses |
...and if I just wanted a bike to take on trips and down an occasional dirt or gravel road, I think I'd by an 1190SX and do this:  | ||
| Buellmojo |
Good luck with that! So have you bought one yet? | ||
| Stevel |
I think that the odds of a real adventure bike from EBR is very low. The current tune of the existing motor is not correct for an adventure bike. The engine's low speed tractability would be a disaster in that role. The amount of money available to redesign the head and cams is simply not there. I believe that the new company would very much like to do this, but unless an investor shows up in the near future, it probably won't happen. LAP's business intention is to maximize its financial return on the EBR auction purchase. This EBR rebirth effort has a date stamp on it. We don't know what this date is, but you can bet your ass that it is there. There is no doubt in my mind that the existence of the new company is precarious. I wish them the best success of course, but if the new EBR is not on its feet and adequately funded before that magic date is reached, EBR and all its assets will be summarily scrapped. It is what LAP does and it is good at it. | ||
| Reepicheep |
I'd agree in the abstract Steve, but remember there is a really customizable traction control setup on the new bikes. Froggy? Any other SX owners? Has anyone tried cranking the traction control up to "ultra nanny" levels and taking the bike on a more slippery surface? | ||
| Froggy |
With the TC on highest setting, I joke about how it won't let you accelerate up a hill. I usually run it on half, as that is the sweetspot for me majority of the time, and since you can't adjust it without stopping I just leave it there. One of the first days I had it, it started to rain, so between the power and brand new borderline race slicks that the bike comes with, I decided to put the TC on maximum. After about 15 minutes the rain stopped and I was back on dry pavement, I was going up a large hill at highway speeds on this back road, and even with the happy stick twisted almost all the way, the bike would respond with "Ah ah ah, you didn't say the magic word". TC is great for preventing giving it too much throttle coming out of a wet turn, I'm not sure how it would work off road. That said, the rumored upcoming "AX" bike was rumored to not be a variant of the 1190RX/SX, so it would have been something else entirely new and not a superbike with knobbies. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Good luck with that! So have you bought one yet? I haven't bought one but I'm thinking about it harder than I have since the bike came out. I'm waiting to hear back from EBR/LAP to see if there's a dealer anywhere near me. That said, the rumored upcoming "AX" bike was rumored to not be a variant of the 1190RX/SX, so it would have been something else entirely new and not a superbike with knobbies. The description of the AX was a little more than rumor:
Quote from former EBR Program Manager Dane Hoechst: http://www.cycleworld.com/2014/09/03/on-the-record -with-dane-hoechst-erik-buell-racing-program-manag er/ I imagine the odds of this bike seeing the light of day are (a) heavily dependent on how far along they were with the design process prior to closure and (b) how well EBR does in the next few months and especially if a deep-pocketed buyer comes along. It's also possible that the AX is not the next new design in the pipeline, which might push its introduction further down the road. Erik said they had some amazing, more mainstream, lower priced stuff in the works prior to closure. | ||
| Redridergr |
When I was chatting with Bill sr. (LAP) on Friday at the opening, this very subject was touched on. An adventure bike is the next logical step in the line up! Compared to an all new unit, the cost to build an adventure bike is low. Yes, some tweeking will be needed. So, if you can wait, please do so. But, contact your dealer and show them you are looking and interested in the model. The more feedback there is, the better! Maybe even call EBR and / or LAP? | ||
| Hughlysses |
^ It's always possible they scrapped the idea of an all-new model for the AX and they now ARE going to build off the existing 1190 platform. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Thanks for the first hand experience Froggy! | ||
| Buelliedan |
I heard from a very reputable source that the AX is basically ready to go if they can get the right financial backing. it IS NOT based on the 1190 engine at all. it will be a smaller engine (around 750cc) was what I heard that will weigh much less. It was designed to go head to head with the KTM. (Message edited by buelliedan on March 21, 2016) | ||
| Canario |
Thank you all the folks at EBR during the open house. I do have a very very positive feeling about this company. They have the knowledge, the tools and the enthusiasm to show the rest of the world how to make great motorcycles. Some pics:   | ||
| Court |
>>>>to show the rest of the world how to make great motorcycles. The rest of the world knows. "Making" them isn't the challenge . . . SELLING them is. Count me amongst those clicking on that dealer list . . . looking for a place to go and talk to someone . . .daily. | ||
| Cmmagnussen |
The yellow SX is interesting. Looks like an attempt to match the super duke tour. (Message edited by Cmmagnussen on March 22, 2016) (Message edited by CMMagnussen on March 22, 2016) | ||
| Stretchman |
@Buelliedan Yeah, the KTM looks pretty good. The seating position on an adventure bike is somewhat more comfy for daily riding and commuting than a naked bike. I had two Buells, first the S, then the SS model, which I bought right before the Uly came out. There was also a smaller version of the Uly, that was more street touring oriented than all road, and it was really really sweet. Right now, Adventure bikes seem to be all the rage. The price point they're coming in at rivals Harley and Indian, but the things they come stock with are amazing, like semi active suspension, cruise control, rider modes, tc and abs all integrated. Add to that they are all day rideable. The classic bike market is going soft, but any of the adventure bikes, even the older ones, are retaining their value. More older guys like me are looking at a bike that can do more for the money. There's going to be interest in that genre no matter what, and the whole segment seems to be gaining ground, and pulling riders from all segments. I have two bikes right now, and commute on one almost daily. Doing about 300 miles a week will change your perspective rather quickly about what works and what doesn't. Plus, 90% of the time, most people will be on hard surfaces anyway, and a bike that delivers there is what most people are looking for. Along those lines, bikes like the Multistrada, and the 1050 Sport from Triumph are beginning to gain some market. Functionality and storage, wet weather and wind protection, visibility and comfort all come into play. Charging ports are a big plus, both for phones/gps, and for heated gear. Engine guards and subframe for mounting bags should be sacrificial and protect the important parts of the bike as well, because things happen in parking lots as well as on the road. Being able to store armored gear and a full face helmet are also a motivating factor, since most people don't want to carry their gear around, or try to fold it into a small saddlebag. Even if there is a way to add these things to a naked bike from the catalog would be a plus, but the bike needs to be somewhat streetable at normal speeds, and easy enough to ride around town, or people will quickly begin to look elsewhere. Riding doesn't have to be a chore with the proper setup. Setting up a bike for that can easily put you into the 20K and above segment. Getting a bike already set up will put you into the mid teens price wise, albeit with some sacrifices, like engine size. Quick and nimble without being twitchy, light yet planted, cruiseable, the list just goes on. The Africa Twin does look ok, as does the Tiger. Even then, price point is up, and you still need to add a whole lot in order to make either the consummate daily rider. | ||
| Buelliedan |
why is the stunt rider on a Buell XB? I thought this was an open house for EBR? Having a guy do stunts on a Harley product makes zero business sense to me. | ||
| Mog |
Having both XB9,s and the XB12X, the V twin is tractable and handling is very good. Off road on the Uly is OK but the bike is still very heavy. I have used the Uly on our off-road MSF motorcycle course and did as well on it as any others on an array of bikes. I will probably get a lot of flak for this but a well, internally balanced, large bore, light weight 350 pound, 50hp/50lb ft motorcycle would be able to do highway and some decent off road work. There are a number of hard and fluid balance mechanisms that would quell the single's vibrations at road speed, Trying to lift an 1190 ax, Uly or 1190 KTM out of loose gravel, sand or mud is brutal (450 pounds unladen). Our course teaches how to get these units up off the floor or ground but in the wild it is massively tough to do. I just cannot see putting a twin anything on the road/off road. As soon as one would create a 750 cc single, it would occupy a market unto itself, especially if it was an adventure TYPE MC. With no direct comparisons for it and it being well mannered, it would be a whole new game. Erik would have a bike like none other and once again turn the MC world on its head. The Uly is my travel and off road bike now but I want a stump puller and smooth highway bike combined. I want the torque and hp to load on my ride gear and clothes and not lug around a damn radiator. If Erik can not do that kind of bike, I would sure as hell like to know who could? Light, affordable, basic, repairable, loadable, throaty, fuel efficient and fun. Sorry folks but I can not imagine the hold up being the technology to keep it light and simple. Erik, you build that bike and I will buy it in a heart beat.  | ||
| Buelliedan |
Mag, You have pretty much described the AX as I was told it would be. It is not about the tech, it is about the money required to build it. | ||
| Hughlysses |
I've noticed that since EBR first mentioned the AX, people that want one seem to fall in one of two distinct camps. They either want: 1- An updated Ulysses; a rugged looking bike that is still basically a street bike but with a slightly taller suspension, comfy 2-up seating, hard luggage, and some wind protection. They love the idea of a 185 HP water-cooled V-twin in this bike. 2- A true adventure bike that is as much at home off-road as it is on road. Moderate power and light weight. Still able to go long distances, have luggage, and carry two people, but be a real competitor to the hardcore adventure bikes. It seems like EBR initially intended to build #1 (there were comments made prior to the launch of the RX that it would be built off the same platform). Sometime later, they apparently decided they wanted to design and build a true ADV bike. While it's certain EBR couldn't build #2 without a major investment, I'm sort of wondering if option #1 wouldn't be a near-future possibility. It would significantly broaden their model range with minimum engineering and re-tooling effort. | ||
| Buelliedan |
I do not see the 1190 platform as being durable enough for a bike capable of going off-road. The focus of these bikes was light weight and I think it would have a lot of problems on even a rough logging road. | ||
| Anonymous |
That's not even remotely correct. | ||
| Buelliedan |
If I am not correct then it should be very easy for the factory to give the customers an 1190 AX. If the current platform is strong enough then all it should take is some taller forks and shock right? | ||
| Lake_bueller |
I find it funny to have all this talk about an "adventure bike". Let's face it, 99.9% of the current "adventure" bikes can't and don't handle anything tougher than a gravel road. The reason for their popularity is threefold... 1) Comfortable ergonomics for all day riding. 2) Good power and handling for the twisties. 3) Aggressive look. At the end of the day, all they really amount to is a sport touring bike with a raised front fender and maybe a little bit of extra travel (back to the comfort thing again). I can't see EBR building an offroad capable machine any time in the near future. The market is too small for a KLR competitor (unless you can get the price way down). In the meantime, I'll keep my S3T for distance riding and my DR650 for dirt. | ||
| Cmmagnussen |
Lake nailed it and anonymous is correct on the current machinery being strong enough. My SX handles gravel roads and Amish buggy paths with very minimal issue. EBR making a dual sport right now seems very far fetched too far outside the core business. Seems a lot more reasonable to use the 1190 platform and try to pick a fight with KTMs Super duke tour. Add the following to the SX to create an SXT and We are in business. Windscreen (looks like EBR has it) Add compass and ambient temperature to the display Tire change Hard bags Heated grips and hand guards Drop pegs Seat upgrade (maybe heated) USB port for charging phone/gps Radiator protection Led driving lamps set into the pods Tune suspension accordingly As far as the retune, doesn't seem necessary | ||
| Hughlysses |
Something may be in the works- Peter Egan just posted this article on the EBR open house: http://www.cycleworld.com/2016/03/22/erik-buell-ra cing-is-reborn-again-with-new-investors-motorcycle -news/ Here's a quote from the article; note the statement in bold, but the whole quote is pretty great:
| ||
| Ratbuell |
I love that Egan owns a Uly!! | ||
| Cyclonedon |
An 1190SX with higher handlebars, lower footpegs, a windshield, and luggage would be an AX model to me and that's what I want! But I'm still very happy with my Ulysses for my riding needs! | ||
| Xb9er |
The AX would boost sales considerably. At least on this forum it would be the top selling bike they produced. The core business model is to produce American motorcycles. If they tried to keep a business model of producing American sportbikes only...well, we know from history what might happen. Produce the AX and they will come Keep producing the SX in December and I will come. | ||
| Bartimus |
Lake is pretty close in the description of an adventure bike. To have an adventure, one does not really need an adventure bike, what really, is an adventure? Crossing the country on an S2 could be considered an adventure... My adventure bike is capable of handling the twisties following an FJR at speed for miles, then turning off and going up and over a rock strewn 12,000' pass and coming down the other side, only to head off across the country pulling a trailer. It needs to do it ALL, and be comfortable all the time it's doing it. And chain drive don't cut it! Who wants to mess with a chain when your concentrating on your adventure? Simple maintenance is a plus. I must be in that .01% because my adventure bike, a Yamaha fat pig Tenere has been up and over every major pass in Utah and Colorado in the last 4 years/ 40,000 miles. I've taken it everywhere I've taken my DR650, the bike is fully capable of everything I've pointed it at. I would have NEVER taken my Uly where I've taken the Yamaha... What Mog described above sounds like a KTM 690. Could EBR be thinking of going head to head with that? |
