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Charlieboy6649
| | Posted on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 09:18 am: | 
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Here's my logic on your last comment. I'm no engineer but if anything at the front of the belt needed lube, the bike-tow systems wouldn't be on the market. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 03:44 pm: |
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There is something on the front of the belt that does need oil, the 5th gear drive assembly. There are two internal needle bearings in there.
It it true, they don't get oil when the engine is not running, but based on my first hand experience pounding those rotted and rusted SOB's out of there, they don't get oil when the engine *is* running either 
(Don't worry, it is a completely separate system, with no oil circulation system besides the transmission slopping stuff everywhere) |
Sportyeric
| | Posted on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 06:12 pm: |
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If you plan to bang it back into gear when its time to continue, you want to be sure your road speed isn't any faster than second gear speed. (Like, don't think you can just keep the clutch in and shift through to third or fourth gear.) I can post some pics of my old tranny gear if you like. |
Charlieboy6649
| | Posted on Sunday, February 29, 2004 - 06:22 pm: |
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Makes sense Sportyeric. Thanks.
Charles |
Opto
| | Posted on Monday, March 01, 2004 - 05:39 am: |
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Tim, I used to do same thing on Sportster, about 4 miles of favourite hill, no probs to report. Anyone who's rebuilt a Buell/Sportster gearbox would know if it's getting enough lube in neutral. I also get off on going downhill with no motor running (it gives a new meaning to the word corner speed) - have yet to pass another bike doing this, but with the Buell (vs Sporty) this becomes a possibility must be a spinoff from the billycart days. |
Doitindark
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 07:31 pm: |
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I'm looking for synth. oil for my bolt and Mobil One 15w50 seems what everyone is useing. And in the tranny there using 75w90 mobil one gear oil. Is this the same oil I can get at Wal-mart for my truck or is it special motorcycle oil.? |
Shotgun
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 03, 2004 - 08:13 pm: |
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It's the same oil Doit. In fact lots of us just use the 15w50 in both the crankcase and the primary. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 08:45 am: |
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Mobil 1 gear oil, I get it at Autozone, not special bike stuff. It is similar to mobil 1 15w50, but includes lots of good additives that are good for trannies but will ruin a combustion chamber. It makes a huge difference in shifting. |
Djkaplan
| | Posted on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 12:49 pm: |
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What? Am I understanding what being said here - the Mobil 1 15w50 is the same as their 75w90 gear oil except for additives? That just doesn't make sense at all.
Is anyone using 15w50 oil in their primaries? |
Xb9er
| | Posted on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 02:30 pm: |
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In my 'bolt I use Mobil 1 20W-50 V-Twin oil because it works as advertised by keeping the engine cooler (compared to HD360). Have not tried Syn3, probably not going to.
I have used Mobil 1 10W-40 MX4T oil in the primary/trans and it was a huge improvement over SportTrans in shift smoothness and feel.
Currently the primary is filled with Mobil 1 75W-90 gear oil which seems to work as well as or better than MX4T (definitely better than SportTrans).
Next oil change I plan to put Mobil 1 20W-50 V-Twin oil in both crankcase and primary/trans and don't anticipate any problems.
Mike. |
Grndskpr
| | Posted on Saturday, March 13, 2004 - 04:37 pm: |
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Question reguarding oil seals, i guess this is as good a place as any to start:
Has the oil seal on the crank, primary side been changed since 98, the reason for the question is due toa leak that has developed, alowing engine oil in the trans case, and while replacing the seal, the old one is the standard metal to rubber seal, the new one is all rubber, seems wider, and i have a concern about it rubbing on the roller bearing, and while i am at it, can the roller bearing be replaced without removing the crank, or is that a case splitting ordeal
thanks
Roger |
Henrik
| | Posted on Saturday, March 13, 2004 - 10:00 pm: |
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Roger, it was indeed changed - new and improved seal is a double lip deal IIRC. Takes a special tool to install - some have fabricated one from split copper tubing.
There was a thread about that issue sometime last year. Unfortunately the page I made with pictures and such is down - we changed ISP and I can't sneak stuff in there anymore 
Henrik |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Sunday, March 14, 2004 - 10:02 am: |
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Here is some good back and forth about the matter...
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=3842&post=182763#POST 182763
And the last picture in the following post is my special "tool". Don't let the rest of the thread here scare you, I had to rebuild my tranny (geesh. Did I really do all that?), and just replaced the seal you are talking about while I was in there. That last split copper pipe tool is all you need.
http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=3842&post=198002#POST 198002
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Bbd
| | Posted on Sunday, April 11, 2004 - 09:44 am: |
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about 2 years ago my 99 m2 started kicking oil from the gearbox vent.taking it to the dealer,iwas told that i had overfilled it.knowing i had not i rode it for a short while.it still blew out oil but i kept checking the level,it was always spot on.researching this fault on badweb,i came to the conclusion thet it was the crank seal.replacing it myself cured it.when syn3 came out-this got me thinking-syn3 can go in both engine & gearbox.why not route the gearbox vent into the oil tank.i have also been thinking of putting oil drains into the cylinder heads.if i routed these into the primary with none return valves inline,and with the gearbox seemingley having a self oil leveling ability,this would increase total engine oil capacity & run cooler engine oil.the drawback being contaminated oil from primary,clutch & gearbox entering the engine.an inline magnetic free flowing oil filter from gearbox to oil tank-the oil tank has a breather line from its top so no preasure build up-and 2500 mile oil changes could? negate the down side i would have thought???anyone got comments tech info on how possible-inpossible this is? |
Shotgun
| | Posted on Sunday, April 11, 2004 - 10:40 am: |
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Bbd. Do it. Post photo's. I've thought about it too. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Monday, April 12, 2004 - 08:00 am: |
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I wouldn't. I can think of only one problem with the non-shared primary (gearbox) oil, and that is that a well meaning but uneducated user could pull the drain plug at the bottom of the engine (primary) and drain all the oil, then put more oil in the top of the engine (swingarm or oil bag) thinking they filled it back up.
In this case, the transmission lasts exactly two laps. Believe it or not, this has happened at least twice that I know of, probably more.
But anyway, why run dirty engine oil through your transmission, clutch, and alternator, if you can avoid it? And why not use better transmission lubricant (mobil 1 Gear Oil) in your transmission? It has better additives (that would be in engine oil also if they did leave all sorts of terrible residues if they get into a combustion chamber).
If you want more oil capacity, use the big FL1A filter, or add an oil cooler, or even just plumb in another tank. |
Bomber
| | Posted on Monday, April 12, 2004 - 08:44 am: |
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what reep said -- the crud for the gearbox is very different than the crud from the engine . . . I'd keep em separate altogether -- HD's lub may be great from both applications (tey wouldn't use it in their sccots, with all the attendant possible warranty issues if they weren't confident), but what they DIDN"T do was give the gearbox and engine a common lube supply (even in the new sporeties and XB series, and they certainly could have, and likely saved some dough in the process) |
Grndskpr
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 03:40 pm: |
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Since i am installing a new engine/trans seal, the new double seal type, does anybody know how deep this seal is suppose to go???Or could you at least point me in the right direction
thanks
Roger |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 04:56 pm: |
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Deep enough. I did mine by eye, and it is working fine so far. Make sure you put the spacer in there first, it is hard to put it in after the seal (but not impossible).
I think the service manual gives the dimensions of the tool used to press it in.
I had a harder time getting the old one out without chewing up that surface. Take your time and have a nice variety of tools around (forceps, needle nose, non marring pry tools, etc). |
Shotgun
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 14, 2004 - 08:32 pm: |
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What Reep said. But the seal does not have to go flush. Push it in with whatever tool you make or buy, but don't over do it. |
Grndskpr
| | Posted on Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 11:31 am: |
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I am using the cooper tool(as shown in the pics) and what does by eye mean????i guess i will just have to wing it
later
Roger |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Thursday, April 15, 2004 - 01:12 pm: |
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Just put it in far enough that it is obviously sealing and snug. Even if it *lightly* bottoms, it is probably not a big deal.
Alternately, just put the new one in about as far as the old one was before you took it out. |
Stevew
| | Posted on Sunday, April 18, 2004 - 09:49 pm: |
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All,
Apologies in advance for this repeat question, but I can't find a definitive answer in the vault.
My 2000 M2 oil tank is under pressure and the cap will pop off without the seat on it. The bike has about 6K miles.
In the process of replacing leaky valve cover gaskets, I have replaced the "umbrella valves". (The umbrella valves seemed to me to be the most likely culprit.)
The bike does not use oil excessively.
Does anybody have a theory; or can anyone direct me to the "definitive" answer hiding in the vault?
Thanks,
SteveW
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Pilk
| | Posted on Monday, April 19, 2004 - 12:10 am: |
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Yep, you got too much oil in there.....
my X-1 will do the same thing when too much oil is added.....
your oil level needs to be checked when HOT. When cold my oil just barely touches the dipstick.
Pilk |
Captainkirk
| | Posted on Monday, April 19, 2004 - 01:32 am: |
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YES!!!!!
I just went through figuring this thing out a couple weeks ago.
Your oil tank has three fittings- 1) oil feed, 2) oil return, and 3) vent. The vent fitting bleeds back into the cam cover. When the engine is running, return oil is foamy (full of air) and thus raises the oil level in the tank. If already high (as in more than half full on the stick) the oil level will raise to the point where liquid oil fills the vent hose...at which point, we no longer have a vented tank, which fills up with air from the foam and blah, blah blah. Get my point? Check oil level AFTER your ride and keep it above the lower line on the stick, but not much over. And thanks to the guys on the BADWEB for helping me figure this one out.
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Grndskpr
| | Posted on Monday, April 19, 2004 - 07:11 pm: |
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Last question Reep, which way does the seal go in, since i am upgrading i dont know which way the new one goes in, so lets ee if i can explain the seal, it has an inside spring and an outside spring, which one points toward the engine???
thanks much
Roger |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 20, 2004 - 07:53 am: |
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I will check the manual when I get home, but I am just about positive tip of the V points into the engine. That way, the custom "seal installation tool" (the split and deburred copper pipe) goes right into the V all the way around, and pushes the entire seal onto the shaft. |
Grndskpr
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 20, 2004 - 09:19 am: |
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positive tip of the V points into the engine
Please explain this point, i know it sounds dumb, but it might be easier to say, the internal spring(flat side of the seal) or the other end(external spring) points toward the engine
Another way to say it is with a pic if anybody has one, just so i dont out it in backwards
later
Roger |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 20, 2004 - 09:35 am: |
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Henrik! Send me that "seal install howto minisite" files so we can get them back on the web!
I believe, going from memory, the external spring is visible after the seal is installed.
That is to say, the external spring is on the side of the seal that points away from the engine.
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Henrik
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 20, 2004 - 12:50 pm: |
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Bill; it's unfortunately buried deep in piles of boxes, which again are deep in storage somewhere. After the move all I have unpacked is day-to-day and work clothes. I'll see if I can find the computer etc. and get the files out.
Henrik |
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