| Author | Message | ||
     Jaimec |
 | ||
| Bads1 |
Hayden is looking for a job?? | ||
| Jaimec |
I think he's referring to either Roger Lee or Tommy, not Nicky. | ||
| Classax |
Roger and Tommy were both on 1 year deals as I recall. Without at least one alien on the bike next year it will be another tough season. All hats off to Geoff and Aaron but... | ||
| 2kx1 |
micheal Dunlop is looking for a job | ||
| Jscott |
Tommy is pretty much retired. If Haslam, Camier or someone else isnt available, I'd see if Eslick would like a go at Europe. | ||
| Simond |
Good to see Geoff May's bike get some TV coverage in qualifying. The commentators over here also said that Erik had been in touch to refute the story put about earlier in the season concerning the test using conventional brakes. Makes you wonder what/who was behind the story! | ||
| Classax |
Josh Hayes needs to step up and quit being reveling in being the one eyed king in the land of the blind, but why wreck a good thing. Eslik is also in a good situation right now as well. I'm not sure either of those guys, all super fast, would be aliens though. EBR needs an alien to really push the chassis to the next level. | ||
| Jaimec |
Don't blame Hayes. At his age, nobody WANTS him. It took him a long time to get where he is now, but most European teams consider him "Over the Hill" despite his success. He impressed that year he subbed for Colin Edwards in Valencia, but no one came beating down his doors with any contracts. | ||
| Jumbo_petite |
Eslick would be a good match. Knows the bike, pushes hard all the time and learns tracks fast. He has proven fast in England and South America just this year. | ||
| Firstbuell |
like most here, I truly want Danny on those SBK EBRs! however, I've zero confidence that'll happen, IF his 2014 level of support from Triumph is matched or bettered for 2015...... | ||
| Vagelis46 |
""3- Larry questions using the ZTL braking system and non-linkage rear shock for WSBK. It is not clear if Erik would consider changing these. "" AMEN ! ! ! If Erik is not considering every possible change that is going to make the EBR faster in WSBK , then he should quit WSBK .... simple as that ..... EBR needs better results in WSBK .....FAST ...... | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Couldn't think of anyone who would be worse than Yates. Sorry, he must have rode for free or something. | ||
| Classax |
If Erik is not considering every possible change that is going to make the EBR faster in WSBK , then he should quit WSBK .... simple as that ..... EBR needs better results in WSBK .....FAST ...... The new rules are leveling the playing field, to a certain extent. EBR will need to match the stock power bar of 200Hp now but the math says they should be able to. The suspension of the EBR really comes into its own on rougher tracks. It just doesn't offer much of an advantage on the glass they run in WSBK. The ZTLs seemed fine the last three races, its power they need now. Couldn't think of anyone who would be worse than Yates. Sorry, he must have rode for free or something. Neither Goeff nor Aaron were on the bikes for their out right speed. They were there for their ability to communicate with engineers and awareness of minor changes to the bikes. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
""The suspension of the EBR really comes into its own on rougher tracks. It just doesn't offer much of an advantage on the glass they run in WSBK. The ZTLs seemed fine the last three races, its power they need now. "" Says..... Who exactly ???? People doing track days ? Doing track days and racing in WSBK are a universe apart ... Larry Pegram, seems to think otherwise.... He is more qualified to have an opinion..... Also in many occasions both May and Yates spoke about ZTL problems....... As an EBR fan myself , I would prefer to watch an EBR with a 2-disc front brake and a "linkage" rear suspension , racing for the top 6 in WSBK ........ instead of being different , just to be different, and being 3-5sec off the pace .... | ||
| Bads1 |
Tommy hasnt ridden in two years. Roger finished well....nothing has been said he wont be back on the Yosh team. Cory Alexander is up and coming..... watch him.... PJ Jacobson also. Eslick did well on the EBR considering its first year but should of done better then May. He didnt.... he also had a less the stellar year for Jordan racing and 3/4's through the season the team knew they wouldnt bring him back. Hes a great 600 rider but yet has to prove himself on the big bikes | ||
| Classax |
Says..... Who exactly ???? People doing track days ? Doing track days and racing in WSBK are a universe apart ... Continents maybe, Worlds tops, but not a universe apart. The persons who made that comment at different times this year were one Geoff May, one Aaron Yates, One LARRY PEGRAM and one Erik Buell... I can certainly see why they would say that, in the math on lever arm produced by linkage systems. Like I said brakes are the least of their worries( not that I'd be opposed to a conventional set up) because they are way down on topend power. Down 12-19mph in the straights the longer straights over the coarse of a 17 lap race is enough to get you lapped. The fact that they are only 3-5 seconds off the pace down that much is amazing! 2015 EBR WSBk priorities are: secure funding find a team find 35 to 45 more hp find at least one alien rider find a way to crack the top ten! find a more durable brake pad for the ZTL or ditch them for conventional ones | ||
| Gaesati |
As Classax pointed out earlier, the main advantage of ZTL is lower unsprung weight on the front end of the bike. The flow on is that front suspension can be better even if using less expensive components. The other advantage of lighter wheels, and disc components is lower centrifugal effects which equals : a) easier changes of direction and conversely, b) a reduced tendency of the front to continue oscillating once deflected thereby allowing steeper steering head angles and reducing the need for steering dampers. To get the best effect from ztl more effort needs to be applied to cooling a) the disc, b) the piston assembly and c) the brake fluid or making each component operate effectively at higher temperatures. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Aaron apparently got through surgery OK and is sporting some major hardware in one leg now. From the Team Hero/EBR Facebook page:  | ||
| Classax |
Yikes that's way worse than I thought. He'll be off the bike about 6 to 8 weeks, which means he won't be available for any winter testing. winter testing attendance will be the bellwether of how serious HeroEBR is about 2015. | ||
| Jscott |
Is that his hip joint? Ouch - I wouldn't be surprised if thats a career ender considering his previous injuries combined with his age. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Yea, it looks like he broke the ball off his femur. Old people (70+) do that all the time and get over it. Hopefully Aaron won't have any problem recovering either. | ||
| Smoke |
Hang in there Aaron! counting on you to get better and back to the track! tim | ||
| Blake |
Whatever else he may be may be, Aaron Yates is one tough motorcycle racer. On the front brake: They haven't even tried a fully vented disk yet that I know of. Similar approaches to improve cooling of pistons may also be feasible. Reducing heat transfer from pad to piston through to caliper and brake fluid seams feasible too. It would be a challenging but fun problem to tackle. One factor easily mitigated, shiny metal surfaces don't radiate heat, so if strategic radiative heat shedding might prove valuable, just adding a flat black or other highly radiative finish could be helpful. One thing is clear: "This is not your father's ZTL brake." | ||
| Reepicheep |
That actually starts to make the case for ZTL. A racing brake system that relies primarily on mass of parts to adequately cool is obviously an inferior design. So adding a second rotor and caliper is a lousy fix. | ||
| Blake |
More mass absorbs more heat with less increase in temperature. But with constant heat input, at some point it'll still heat up. Surface area and air flow are key. Having the caliper opening to the rear is inferior to having it opening in front and natually exposed to oncoming airflow. I suspect that's one of the significant benefits to a conventional system compared to perimeter rotors. So they added some ducting. A slotted rotor could really benefit cooling airflow to the caliper as well as the rotor. | ||
| Blake |
Think squirrel cage fan. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Another thing that can be done to manage heat in the front brake is to cool the fluid. IIRC, Jens posted pics of a heat exchanger setup they used on their 1190RR. The brake fluid from the caliper was circulated through it. NASCAR use to (and may still) use a system with separate "supply" and "return" lines to the brakes for short tracks (which are really hard on brakes). The separate paths circulated fluid through the caliper and back to the master cylinder each time the brakes were applied and released, helping keep the caliper and fluid from over-heating. I'd imagine there are many different approaches that could be used to improve the ZTL in this area. | ||
| Fast1075 |
The relative velocity of the rotor is part of the problem. No wait, I can't even spel enginear. | ||
| Ebmachine |
I can't spell enginear either... Perhaps we need to get some physicists involved. Not my work... "In the real world, single stops are not difficult for any decent braking system. Problems come up when you try to brake hard over and over. This is something that might be good to use a computer for. The problem is that you have to come up with some model of how a car is driven. You also need to figure out how heat is taken out of the brakes. Otherwise the simulated temperature will keep rising without limit. Say that the heat Q in the braking system obeys dQ/dt=Mav−f(T,v) , where M is the car's mass, a is its acceleration, v is its velocity, and f is the cooling function. The temperature of the brakes could then be T=T0+Q/mc , where T0 is ambient temperature, m is the mass of the braking system, and c is its specific heat (you could look this up for iron). The problem here is f. Some googling seems to show that it's reasonable to take f(T,v)=k1(T−T0)(1+k2vn). k1, k2, and n are constants. n should apparently be between 0.5 and 0.8. k1 can be reasonably estimated, but k2 can't. That depends on the details of the airflow around the brake components." http://www.physicsforums.com |
