| Author | Message | ||
     Hughlysses |
Interview with Ryan Hahn, an Industrial Designer at EBR: http://rideapart.com/2013/10/ebr-1190rx-designer-r yan-hahn/ | ||
| Sir_wadsalot |
In the comments Wes (the tall, whiney guy in the Ride Apart vids) says if he could, all he would write would be EBR articles. RideApart is awesome. While I think the RS is sexier, lets face it, thats because it looks like a modern 999R. While the RX isn't as "sharp", it looks great, and differentiating from Ducati wasn't a bad idea. | ||
| Figorvonbuellingham |
I outride my lights on my BMW S1000RR so I look forward to having decent lighting at night. Im glad they have taken time to put lighting as a major priority. Definately a plus for night riders. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Ask Erik about headlights (and outrunning them) sometime. I suspect he had more than a little influence over "good lighting" as a requirement. There are a lot of good LED's out there now. I just got a pair of 10W flood LEDs that I bought for extra backup lights on my truck. $49.99 for the pair, 10W power consumption, single LED per housing, less than 2" across the housing...1000 lumens each. My CR may well get a pair of its own, as aux headlights. As the technology advances, there's no reason for manufacturers not to embrace it. | ||
| Gregoxb |
I agree with the one comment the guy made about the RX decal and the open cooling fans on the gills of the bike. They could have put a more mature/stylish decal on there. They could have also covered the fans with a mesh grill painted to the color of the bike. Something like this: http://www.ragingspeed.com/UK/product_info.php?products_id=157 (Message edited by gregoxb on November 19, 2013) | ||
| M1combat |
I think that would look like ass. | ||
| Gregoxb |
Well not THAT piece of shit grill I linked you to.... a high quality mesh grill with a trick pattern, cut to the exact shape of the fans, mounted securely, painted to the exact color of the bike, and a Pegasus logo painted in the center. IMO the fully exposed super-sized version of a fan you would find in your computer is off putting. I feel people who buy this bike will remedy that area. | ||
| Glitch |
You mean kinda like this?  | ||
| Hughlysses |
Wow! I'm guessing that's a whole row of Barracuda II's? | ||
| Gregoxb |
YES! Similar but nicer finish. Paint it the color of the bike with a Pegasus right in the middle. Where did you find that picture? Where was this, who was selling these bikes? Interesting. | ||
| Trojan |
I'm not one to complain but.....if you are going to sell a sports bike in the premium Ducati/KTM/BMW sector then PLEASE fit decent brake and clutch levers!!!! The ones on the RX look like they were left over from the last S1 in 1998 and just look cheap and dated. Surely there are cheap enough modern adjustable levers around now to allow fitment of something that at least looks like it wasn't sourced second hand or new old stock? This may be a cut price version of the RS but no need to go completely bargain basement is there? | ||
| Classax |
To be honest I rather like the exposed fan as it's keeping with the bikes function over form design elements. To be honest I ride every day possible and if you have never sat on a superbike in +90F heat in the middle of a four lane super slap in bumper to bumper traffic, you can't appreciate the genius of offset ducted fans that don't just blow back onto the engine or rider. GSXR's, zx10r's and every Duc (hmm never been on a Honda) in the last two decades all get BLAZING hot in those conditions. I did a MSF advanced course on an R1 once and the bike got so hot during the class I had to either shut it off or or get up to 40mph to cool it down multiple times. It was only about 85F that day. I agree with Trojan on the levers though. It does come with steel braided brake lines though. | ||
| Court |
>>>It does come with steel braided brake lines though. A little nod toward history since Buell was the FIRST manufacturer to ever put a braided line on a production bike. | ||
| Jdugger |
I like the stock levers. They are good for getting a whole hand on and they have a nice feel. Too bad the stock MC is a total piece of crap. | ||
| Figorvonbuellingham |
Are those uly.bags.on an 1190 in the upper left? | ||
| Hughlysses |
Are those uly.bags.on an 1190 in the upper left? I think that's just a regular Uly; the rear wheel has right side sprocket and left side brake. An 1190 would be the opposite. I don't think yellow bike is an 1190; I believe it's another Barracuda II prototype/mule. Note the standard XB type rear wheel; the 1190's have the "hubless" rear wheel. I'm guessing this photo was taken around the time of the Buell closure announcement. Maybe Glitch will enlighten us? | ||
| Needs_o2 |
Maybe it's a new trend towards visible moving components. The car is a creation of some cousins back in Wisconsin, the Ring Brothers, it was a 71 Pantera. It was at SEMA a couple of weeks ago. One would swear that they collaborated with EBR, they look like they came from the same stable.     | ||
| Glitch |
I'm guessing that's a whole row of Barracuda II's? Yep just waiting to go be delivered, but then we all know what happened later that week. | ||
| Reepicheep |
IMHO, I like the exposed fan on the RX much better than some kind of hardware store stamped grating over the top of it. Especially on a dedicated sportbike, not only should there not be any parts on it that aren't doing something important, there shouldn't be any parts on it that aren't doing at least two important things. | ||
| Figorvonbuellingham |
I like the EBR better than the Scaracuda. What happened to the ones they built? In someones garage somewhere? | ||
| M2typhoon |
I find it interesting that Erik already had that nicely lightened front wheel he boasted about about on the RS but not the hubless rear wheel. | ||
| Hootowl |
Just a guess, but I'll bet the breakthrough on the wheel was in being able to cast it in street legal magnesium for the RS, and not so much the shape of the spokes, as we see in the aluminum wheel on the B2. | ||
| Jdugger |
I remember comments here about the hubless rear wheel that would have made it available by production time for the B2. Even a picture was briefly posted of it. There's a LOT of weight in the wheel hub, so eliminating it would make a significant difference, too. I think Mg is roughly 1/3rd lighter than Aluminum, so that would also be some of it. I have been given the impression the new front wheel in Aluminum is about the same (a little lighter, but not much) weight as the old wheel design in Mg. | ||
| Court |
>>>I find it interesting that Erik already had that nicely lightened front wheel he boasted about about on the RS but not the hubless rear wheel. That's inaccurate. And the RS wheel is not the same as the Barracuda wheel. Why will be one of the GREAT stories of the startup of EBR. | ||
| Hughlysses |
And the RS wheel is not the same as the Barracuda wheel. VERY interesting. I guess that goes back to what you said about there being absolutely NO Buell parts that were carried over from the 1125. | ||
| Court |
>>>>VERY interesting. I guess that goes back to what you said about there being absolutely NO Buell parts that were carried over from the 1125. Precisely. You're gonna love the story. | ||
| Figorvonbuellingham |
What story? | ||
| Ratbuell |
Remind him...he'll tell you sometime. Maybe.  | ||
| Steeleagle |
Maybe for the RX, but the RS mirrors are identical to those on the 1125R!  | ||
| Hughlysses |
Maybe for the RX, but the RS mirrors are identical to those on the 1125R! Good point. I guess the deal is no proprietary or in-house produced parts were carried over. I'd imagine the mirrors come from a 3rd party supplier that any motorcycle manufacturer could purchase from. | ||
| Jdugger |
There's a number of parts that are identical to the 1125r in a practical sense, at least on the RS. That doesn't make them "Buell" parts. | ||
| Steeleagle |
In the literal sense, as Hugh stated, most all the parts aren't really "Buell" or "EBR" parts. I heard a wise man (last name Buell) make the statement "I'm not really interested in making parts. I want to build motorcycles!" I think we're all saying the same thing. It's just that I noted my 1190's mirrors were the same as my 1125's and was feeling a bit like a smart...aleck! | ||
| Court |
The key here is who owns, or can reasonably claim rights to, the IP. Harley-Davidson does not "own" the mirrors. They did "own" the Barracuda wheel. The story gets REALLY good . . . but you get the idea. EBR could never use the 1125 Helicon motor or any of the Buell developed" technology (and, by the way, no one else can either for 10 years) in EBR products. While the topic makes fun internet discussion it was, during the first 3 years, a HUGE concern and even larger risk to EBR. The last thing you need or want, starting on a shoestring and funding 18 employees, all those parts, overhead and so forth from your personal checking account, is to get entangled with a legal battle with someone who, even if they had little merit, would love to have enough to bitch slap you around and tie you up for 3-5 years. It's a big deal. But . . .it also had tons of wonderful unintended consequences. What . . for instance . . if you had something that you thought was a close to perfect as you thought you could get it . . . and your only choice was to admit you could't use it so you had to assign 3 of the brightest engineers in the business to "take this thing . . . study it and make it the very best it possibly can be . . .question everything". Free of "it has to be able to be produced by a HD approved vendor" . . "must fit a Sportster frame lug" . . blah, blah, blah . . . As a result . . some of the technology emerging, and the folks in India were sharp enough to see this and realize that EBR could do what even Honda couldn't, is nothing short of amazing. I suspect folks are going to be amazed as time passes. By the way . . . eventually the "Story of the Wheel" will, in my personal opinion, be right up there with the "Parkway Blue" and "S1 Headlight " stories in Buell history. | ||
| Figorvonbuellingham |
Does this mean we are getting a 400 hp eletric EBR? | ||
| Gregoxb |
185 hp, 102 ft-lbs of torque? Yea I'd say we are on the right track. How about the patents for "fuel in frame"? I'm assuming those are Erik's patents? | ||
| Froggy |
Erik does not have a patent for Fuel In Frame, in fact he isn't the only one to currently use that concept (Sachs Madass), and he also wasn't the first. He had some frame related patents, but not for the concept of using it as fuel storage. | ||
| Court |
>>>Erik does not have a patent for Fuel In Frame That's inaccurate. It is accurate to say "Erik was not the first to put the fuel in the frame of a motorcycle". A number of folks preceded, by years, the Buell XB frame. One of them was the frame Erik patented years ago while doing contract work before the HD/Buell allegiance of February 1983. These discussions normally take a twist toward the "Erik's not so smart, someone did it before him" sort of direction. What is also true is that no one has ever "really made it work in commercial application" (there's one you can debate until I get back from the holidays) until the XB frame. Had it not been for some hard headed folks at Genesis you'd seen the fuel in frame concept used for many other things. Erik has, by the way, patented a new "fuel in frame" concept within the last year. US 20130168170 A1 | ||
| Ducbsa |
Regarding "I'm not really interested in making parts. I want to build motorcycles!", when I was on a factory tour in '97 or so, the guide said that the HD motor was only a part number to the Buell factory. Now, it wasn't just another Sporty motor and was developed by Buell (I think). If my memory is correct (LOL), I don't think there was any parts production being done. | ||
| Court |
The last parts production ever done at Buell was S1 bodywork.      | ||
| Froggy |
Court that is good to hear. I went over that patent again, and indeed it does mention the fuel in frame. Cool  | ||
| Hybridmomentspass |
"The last parts production ever done at Buell was S1 bodywork. " So there was NOTHING made at Buell since? They didnt make any special parts in house? Hey, if you can get someone locally to make it for the same price as it'd have costed you, as well as freeing up your own labor, then that seems worth it. Just a surprising fact, I'd have figured there wouldve been many parts made ready for book #2... | ||
| Ducbsa |
They avoid the capital and labor cost of a production machine shop that way. | ||
| Sir_wadsalot |
I need to see the fans in person, but they're growing on me. They are a bit jarring though. the Lambo Gaillardo also has exposed fans in the rear bumper. I think they're behind a rock screen but you can def see them. Great posts Court! | ||
| Torquehd |
Glitch, or anyone else, any other pictures of the B2, besides the cycle world article??? | ||
| Sparky |
Regarding styling of the RX, it's my opinion that if Glynn Kerr, author of the M/C Design column in Motorcycle Consumer News mag, reports anything other than a negative write up of the new machine, he would be breaking his tradition of bashing the styling of every one of Erik Buell's bikes produced so far. However, if he gives the bike even faint praise for its looks, I just might have to give him a new found respect. | ||
| Glitch |
Yeah, I got a few, I'll try and dig them up. I don't think it's much of a secret anymore anyway. |
