| Author | Message | ||
     X1bueller |
As stated above, shifting into first it met either by stalling the bike or grinding gears. I have gone through the clutch adjustment procedure 100,000 time with no better result. I pulled apart the clutch pack and even replaced the grenade plate with a new clutch disks. I have posted on the clutch before and thought there might be related issues from overfilling the primary. At this point, I am not thinking its a clutch problem, but perhaps a transmission problem, and it is getting over my head. | ||
| Two_seasons |
Follow the manual exactly. If you don't have a manual, buy one. American Sport Bike sells them. | ||
| Mr_grumpy |
Or you can download at www.carlsalter.com | ||
| X1bueller |
Thanks for the advice. I have had the bike and the factory manual for 13 years. | ||
| Kalali |
How did the bike shift before the clutch adjustment? | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
Look up "grenade plate". | ||
| Two_seasons |
Why did you go into the clutch in the first place? How long have you owned this bike? What exactly have you replaced beside the grenade plate and clutch plates? Please list everything you did. And tell us what brand of parts you used as this is helpful too. From what you initially said, it sounds like it's either not totally releasing or, have worn out gears/forks. I'd suggest you remove your clutch pack and take it apart again. Make sure your first clutch plate is fiber, then metal, etc etc... Ensure that you have followed the assembly procedure exactly. Then, you need to inspect/replace for any worn shifter parts. This is a very simple clutch design. But you need to go over each and every part outside of the clutch pack that associates with the shifting. Write down all parts that need to be inspected, then check them off as you go to the next part. You'll get it. Don't give up!  (Message edited by two_seasons on October 08, 2013) | ||
| X1bueller |
>>Look up "grenade plate". look at my second sentence. >>Why did you go into the clutch in the first place? Because the bike grinds, surges, and stalls going into first. It helps if I am rolling forward or goose the throttle. I read about similar issues and read up on the GRENADE PLATE. So I decided to take care of the grenade plate issue for good measure. >>How long have you owned this bike? 13 years as stated in my second post. I am the original owner. >>What exactly have you replaced beside the grenade plate and clutch plates? All clutch disks; metal and fiber, idler bearing, all relevant circlips, clutch spring, All gaskets, Oil. >>Please list everything you did. See above^ >>And tell us what brand of parts you used as this is helpful too. All HD parts, even the oil. >>From what you initially said, it sounds like it's either not totally releasing or, have worn out gears/forks. Exactly. Even if the bike is in gear, it should completely disengage the motor from the drive train. But its not and that is where I am stumped. >>I'd suggest you remove your clutch pack and take it apart again. For what reason? >>Make sure your first clutch plate is fiber, then metal, etc etc... I have. >>Ensure that you have followed the assembly procedure exactly. I have. >>Then, you need to inspect/replace for any worn shifter parts. This is a very simple clutch design. But you need to go over each and every part outside of the clutch pack that associates with the shifting. Write down all parts that need to be inspected, then check them off as you go to the next part. The only other possible part remaining that I can think of is the clutch ramp. It looks to be in good order. | ||
| Beardo |
It sounds as if you have the adjusting screw in too far. It took me a few times to get the feel for where that exact initial contact point is. And that wasn't completely clear, to me, in the FSM. It's such a light point, but critical. THAT's the point where you back the screw off. Once good, it's smooth sailing. And hopefully I've been of some help. | ||
| Buellistic |
ADJUST CLUTCH Class 101, just PM me for a copy ... There is one step that is not in the FSM !!! | ||
| X1bueller |
Jenne, You mean the part about holding the ramp in the rear position while seating the screw? I learned that from you years ago.  | ||
| Alfau |
loosten the clutch CABLE completly. Then adjust clutch to spec. Then adjust cable to correct length. You may be surprised. | ||
| Buellistic |
Glad to hear someone is paying attention !!! | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
If you're convinced you have a clutch problem still, I'd be looking very carefully at the ramp mechanism as it can be troublesome. As Alf said, I'd adjust clutch, ramp etc, with a slacked off cable, then bring cable into equation. I assume you've checked the cable runs free too? Rocket in England | ||
| Buell_bert |
Is it possible the bearings on the opposite side of the trans may be going bad? It sounds like most of the stuff I would try have been done and done again. It sounds like a wobble. | ||
| X1bueller |
The"#14" bearing? I guess I will try anything. But that means I have to pull apart the primary again... If I do, can I reuse that gasket? I dropped the bike off of the center stand, sat on it, and tried to push it with the trans in 1st gear and the clutch pulled. Its stucker than glue. In fact, you can hear air burping from the intake, so you know its locked up. Is there ANYTHING else OTHER than the clutch that can be causing this problem? What other parts, pawl? | ||
| Jim2 |
You can usually reuse the updated version if it hasn't been a very long time since you installed a new one or last opened it up. | ||
| Jim2 |
Make sure you didn't put the clutch ramp nut on backwards. That would do it. | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
It's a long time since I had the ramp apart on my S1W. Is it not possible the ball and ramp mechanism is in the wrong position resulting in the angle not allowing correct adjustment? I feel sure I've been here before and had this same problem, and my faded memory is telling me it's when I had the ramp in bits and put it back together wrong that it happened. Rocket in England | ||
| X1bueller |
I never took the ramp apart. | ||
| Buellistic |
Waiting for your call ??? | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
But whilst the case and cable are detached is it not possible the ramp lever can rotate to the next position? I can't remember as I say, but something is bothering me about the ramp as I know I had an issue with it one time - but I've had my clutch apart a lot of times. I would add, after everything said in this topic I'd not just be looking at the clutch unit. I'd be going all the way from the bar lever, the cable route, cable condition (off the bike in my hands) working free and smooth, cable adjustment, ramp mechanism and operation, clutch adjuster components and adjustment. You have a problem you're failing to solve but you're telling yourself it can only be this because that's all you've disturbed. That is not how to do it. Start fresh and go through a process of elimination of every component. If your problem is still not found at least you've the benefit of having serviced all of the components anyway, and it narrows your search down even if it takes you back to where you started. That is how mechanicing works sometimes. Expect the unexpected. Rocket in England | ||
| Oldog |
What Rocket said..... | ||
| Buellistic |
"THE DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS !!!" | ||
| X1bueller |
Well, I can't say that the ramp got turned around. Not only have I never disassembled it, this problem started before I took apart the primary. So I have never had it out with the possibility of turning it around. In fact, I do not ever recall ever having to mess with the clutch. For the 13 years that I have owned the bike, the only thing I have ever done in that area was drain, fill, and check the level of the oil. Once a year I might remember to check the chain tension which was always spot on. I DID have the biker serviced once for a new start motor. They removed the primary, upgraded the gasket, and replaced the chain tensioner because those parts were on a recall. But that was 10 years and many miles ago. This problem actually started about 2 years ago on a 300 mile ride. It started halfway through the trip and got worse and worse until I got home and it has remained in the condition it is in today. I stopped riding it because of this. I guess I am going to just have to take it apart again see if I missed anything. I don't want to sound like a cheap-skate, but its going to take another 2 hours and $40 in gaskets, circlips, and oil. But I lost my job 6 months ago and money isnt exactly falling out of my pockets. If this doesn't work, check the sale section for a part out. | ||
| Jramsey |
 (Message edited by Jramsey on October 12, 2013) | ||
| Rocket_in_uk |
X1, given what you say it sounds to me like you're looking in the wrong place. It also sounds like you're not working this out logically. If this problem started so long ago, and the problem got worse over a lot of miles, then you stood the bike until recently, then you stripped the clutch and put it back together several times, and you believe correctly so, doesn't this tell you something? You're looking in the wrong place, blaming the wrong thing, and trying to fix something that isn't at fault. Why don't you listen to ALL the advice here? If it isn't the clutch that you've done so much work too and found nothing wrong, doesn't common sense tell you to look at the other components mentioned? For example, how do you know the ramp hasn't worn out or a ball bearing fell out of it? Because you've never had it apart? It must be ok then. Instead of whinging like a cry baby, pay a person capable of fixing it to do so. Stop trying to fix something you're incapable of. Or at the very least, listen to advice given here and follow it if you think you're capable of such repairs. Or yeah, sell the piece of shite! There is a drain plug so why waste oil? You could lay the bike on its side so why waste oil? A new gasket will be reusable several times if you are careful. Rocket in England | ||
| X1bueller |
>>If this problem started so long ago, and the problem got worse over a lot of miles, then you stood the bike until recently, then you stripped the clutch and put it back together several times, and you believe correctly so, doesn't this tell you something? You're not listening. The problem HAPPENED long ago and got worse over VERY SHORT period of time (an hour or so.) >>Why don't you listen to ALL the advice here? Most of the advice is adjusting and readjusting the clutch. I think I have that figured out. >>If it isn't the clutch that you've done so much work too and found nothing wrong, doesn't common sense tell you to look at the other components mentioned? It does, and I had questioned that. >>For example, how do you know the ramp hasn't worn out or a ball bearing fell out of it? It has less than 15,000 miles on it so the likelihood of that happening is nil. It's also not very difficult to take a look at the thing sideways and count the balls (which I have done). >>Instead of whinging like a cry baby, It's my choice if I want to describe my frustrations out loud and I am willing to bet you have possessed the same feelings some time in your life. If that bothers you, you dont have to respond. I had just posted that I would follow YOU"RE advice and pull it all part once again. That was me displaying a lot of respect in you as a technician, but the name calling draws the line sir and I have just lost all respect for you as a person. | ||
| Harleyelf |
Is your final drive sprocket properly attached? I had an issue with a Sportster once which I thought was a clutch plate problem but turned out to be a shifting (side-to-side) transmission shaft due to a stripped sprocket nut. The clutch ramp was pushing the entire axle instead of compressing the spring. | ||
| Buellistic |
NO MATTER WHAT THE "ADVISE" IS, The Devil is in the DETAILS !!! |
