| Author | Message | ||
     Hughlysses |
I posted this in the "news" thread, but I thought it was worth re-posting. Most of the article seems to be a repeat of previous stuff, but I thought this quote was pretty enlightening:
Link to article: http://www.motorcycle.in.th/article.php/Erik-Buell -Racing-Reveal-Future-Goals | ||
| Sir_wadsalot |
Superbike, naked, sport/adventure tourer, dirtbike, hayabusa sized hybrid ultra-mega open classer, rebadged hero hybrid scooter, a small electric bike and a destroked helicon 1000cc "middleweight". That's my guesstimated lineup in the next five years. | ||
| Noone1569 |
Need a 450-600 EBR supermoto! | ||
| Hughlysses |
Maybe we'll get some hints of what's to come next month. The last 2 lines of the press release say:
We know EBR intends to release an 1190RX in October, and an 1190SX and an 1190AX some time after that. We know that Buell had a 450 dirt bike ready for production before the project was squashed by Harley. Even if they don't have the complete designs for that bike, I'll bet it would be a relatively quick process to pick it back up. That would also be a quick path to a ~450 supermoto. We know from Steve Anderson's article on the closure of Buell that they had a middle-weight triple nearly ready to produce. Like the dirt bike, I'll bet they could get that going again fairly quickly. If they've developed a 250 for Hero, maybe they'll sell their own version as well. Based on those points, EBR may have a full range of motorcyels almost ready to go, at least from a design standpoint. | ||
| Trojan |
IMHO they need to build a decent middleweight naked/streetbike to rival the Triumph Street Triple/Yamaha MT-09 and MV 675 Bruatle/F3. Obviously a V-Twin motor wouldn't be ideal so an IL3 would be just the ticket. Also while the 1190 platform is excellent, it is always going to be a high end relatively expensive product with that motor, no matter what they dress it up like (sports/naked/adventure etc). I'd like to see a smaller and less expensive motor (although 250 may be a bit too small for me!) that could power a modular range of naked/street/sports/adventure bikes. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Matt- just to reiterate what Steve Anderson said about Buell's middleweight project: "...a radically designed middleweight family of three-cylinder sportbikes to broaden the range." The plan to do this (including a multimillion dollar expenditure and headcount increases) was approved in fall 2007. That's 2 years before the binders were put on Buell. I'll bet all that info is either in EBR's hands, or it won't (or hasn't) taken them long to re-create it. | ||
| Xdigitalx |
Well... if they do, I hope it doesn't sound like the MT-09. What about a parallel twin? | ||
| Hughlysses |
What's wrong with how the MT-09 sounds? Seems like most of the reviews rave about the engine note. | ||
| Xdigitalx |
I guess I like the sound of twins better but I just heard it on tube..ring ring ringggg. | ||
| Tankhead |
My buddy and I went to an EBR dealer in NJ this weekend and he told us the RX in October and then the SX IN MAY. We shall see. Nothing on the AX. | ||
| Satori |
I asked a dealer that looked like they might be on the EBR list if in fact they were going to carry them. This was their response on Sept. 26th. Thank you for your enquiry about EBR bikes. Yes, we are planning on carrying EBR bikes but haven't made our official public announcement yet. The bikes are currently in production. If you wanted one, we could try to get one of their first releases for you. However, we can't promise that we'll get one. The EBR dealer meeting is next month and we'll know more of what we, and you, can expect after that. We think that we could possibly have EBR bikes on our showroom floor as early as next summer. Note the -"The bikes are currently in production" | ||
| Tankhead |
Yeah that is what my dealer said, when he gets home from Orlando, they can start taking orders. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Tankhead- I don't know if you caught Court's "ninja" post yesterday. - Edit - Apparently at least one dealer is leaving EBR marketing materials in plain view. Did you guys happen to see anything like that? (Message edited by Hughlysses on October 01, 2013) | ||
| Tankhead |
NO. Nothing. Nada. | ||
| Tankhead |
As far as Court, I am not quite sure what is going on with the ninja posts. I really like the guy and his story about the City-x made me buy one. He even sent me a shirt for guiding the Queensryche guys to their Atlantic City gig a few years back. But it is starting to get, um, well, strange. Did something happen here that I am not aware of? It is just a little creepy. Come on Court buck up! | ||
| Hughlysses |
I figure Court must have gotten in trouble at some point and promised Erik he wouldn't "leave any posts" on Badweb.  Knowing where Court lives, I wonder if someone could figure out who that EBR dealer is and make a surveillance run for us? | ||
| Court |
>>>>I figure Court must have gotten in trouble at some point and promised Erik he wouldn't "leave any posts" on Badweb. That's patently inaccurate. My posts have been, albeit in vain, an attempt to restore at least a modicum of accuracy. There has been many, about 80%, inaccurate posts regarding EBR and what they are doing. The new products are going to be phenomenal. I'm doing better and thank those of you who have written and I hope to be riding again next year. ALL EBR dealers, by the way, have, and have had for several weeks, a good deal of information. EBR has recently added some of the top dealer development/relationship personnel to their rolls. This, in a bit of an unintended consequence, looks like it is going to be a huge benefit to not only the dealers, but new EBR customers. Expect to see an entirely new way of doing business, unshackled by the antiquated Harley-Davidson dealer model that, rivaled only by the antiquated motor, was the worst thing that ever happened to Buell during the HD years. I suspect you will be able to read a great deal about this eventually. Court | ||
| Hughlysses |
>>>>I figure Court must have gotten in trouble at some point and promised Erik he wouldn't "leave any posts" on Badweb. That's patently inaccurate. That was just intended as gentle "ribbing". My posts have been, albeit in vain, an attempt to restore at least a modicum of accuracy. There have been many, about 80%, inaccurate posts regarding EBR and what they are doing. In the absence of hard facts, rumors/speculation will always expand to fill an information vacuum. It's been a LONG wait and we're looking forward to seeing what EBR's come up with. We (at least I) do appreciate your efforts and it's good to see you posting again. | ||
| Tankhead |
Hi Court! Glad you are doing well and thanks for clearing that up. Yeah, I am looking forward to the new products. | ||
| Satori |
Does anyone have an accurate list of dealers? The closest I've found is almost a 2 hr drive.. Glad your doing well Court, glad to see you back. | ||
| Carbonfibrebob |
Great to "hear" your voice, Court. You've been missed! Bob | ||
| Bluzm2 |
Great to hear from you again Court. BTW, I still owe you a flower....  On the EBR front, I think some here did not parse our Courts comment closely enough. "The new products are going to be phenomenal." To me this implies more that one... I hope that's true for the October release... Brad | ||
| Satori |
Brad, I've noted on the quick board, but of particular interest is the size of booth they have at AIME. One bike heck a small 10 x20ft booth. but they have a 40 x 50ft booth. Much bigger than a one bike booth. | ||
| Court |
>>>"The new products are going to be phenomenal."
Open your mind. It's much more than just a motorcycle. Go back and reread the last press release. This is going to be a game changer. I've never been so happy for Erik and The Elves. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Go back and reread the last press release. Last line of official press release:
Got it. Sure sounds like something big.  | ||
| Trojan |
This is going to be a game changer. For whom....EBR, customers or the industry in general? A game changer for the industry would be a superbike at real world prices, not just another Panigale rival that you need a mortgage to buy and run. Some of the big manufacturers are only just beginning to realise that the sportsbike market fell on its face 2 years ago and is not looking like it will recover any time soon (maybe 50% falls in sales reminded then of late!). Now we are seeing Honda, Yamaha, Benelli and others coming to the market with AFFORDABLE streetbikes built in emerging markets to keep prices down. having a flagship model is all very well, but ask Ducati how many Panigales they sell in comparison with Monster and other cheaper models? Much as I love the 1190 RS I want to see a mass market, reasonably priced, middle weight streetbike with good performance, economy and servicing costs rather than a top of the range sportsbike built to enable the manufacturer to compete in WSB. | ||
| Blake |
The SV650, BMW 800cc twin, Monster 800, CBR600, and Daytona 675 already exist. No one motorcycle will please everyone. Setting the table for EBR to fail to meet one's expectations is a trivial exercise. How 'bout we wait and see what innovation and price EBR is able to offer? I'd not expect them to launch a low priced Japan inc beater. It's a Superbike racing company. No? | ||
| Trojan |
Setting the table for EBR to fail to meet one's expectations is a trivial exercise I'm not doing that at all. What I am hoping for is a mass appeal bike that will enable EBR to afford to build a flagship model to compete with the big manufacturers. Without the bikes that make profit such as Monsters, SV650's and CR600s there really would be no Panigale, Fireblade or GSXR1000. if you can sell thousands of affordable bikes it enables you to make hundreds of exotic race bikes. You can't do that the other way round unfortunately. Companies that exclusively make high end sports bikes don't have a good history in this industry. | ||
| Tankhead |
I have a feeling Erik Buell realizes all that you have stated Trojan. I would add that most first year business majors understand this concept also. Lets wait and see.... He hasn't even released the first mass produced bike yet. I'm excited... I'm happy for the man and his company whatever he brings to market. I might not be able to own one or want one but I'm excited about the new bikes none the less. | ||
| Hughlysses |
I, for one, have been quite amazed that more folks haven't been asking . . . . . :hmmmmm . . . a large group of the world's best motorcycle development and engineering folks . . . what are they doing? Frankly . . think of the EBR factory as a 5 gallon bucket . . . we, over the past 3 years, have witnessed about 78 gallons being poured in and no one has questioned "where's the output?" My personal suspicion is that folks have been so myopically focused on waiting for EBR to try to do something like Buell had done they were simply watching the wrong door. Court, you've dropped this hint several times and believe me, I've picked up on it. I've tried searching for patents by every engineer's name associated with Buell or EBR without any success. Maybe EBR has a consulting division with a completely unrelated name? I just can't think of any other way to dig into this. Hopefully some light will be shed on this in the next couple of weeks. Speaking of which- only TWO weeks to the big reveal! Edit- wow, I unintentionally caught a Court "ninja" post! (Message edited by Hughlysses on October 02, 2013) | ||
| 2kx1 |
The only info I have found is more power than the RS ,traction control and sub 19k. As far as what have they been doing in wisconsin for the past four years, three of those years it has been winter so I am expecting something big in 14 days. | ||
| Schwara |
Winter for them just means a little less time spent on their own bikes ... making it a little easier to spend more time in the office working on cool new bikes  | ||
| Davegess |
He He He.....  | ||
| Satori |
Davegess you tease.. | ||
| Hughlysses |
I'm still thinking about Court's repeated hints (in the form of questions) about what the design staff at EBR has been up to for the last 3 years. 2 possibilities occurred to me last night: (1) The engine for the new Indians. The press from Polaris would have you believe it was designed completely in-house, but I wonder... (2) Hold on to your socks- what if EBR was involved in the "twin cooling" design for the new Harleys? Maybe a deal was made after Buell's closure "we'll give you rights to use the Buell patents, but you have to do some design work for us". I kind of suspect that whatever they were involved with was farther out of the field of conventional motorcycling than this, but that makes the question so wide-open I don't have a clue where to look. Still thinking about it... | ||
| Torquehd |
I really like the guy and his story about the City-x made me buy one care to share the story? i miss my old cityX. | ||
| Torquehd |
what about that hybrid 400hp thing? wasn't that one of their new patents? | ||
| Hughlysses |
The hybrid patent was from EBR's work for Hero's "Leap" scooter, along with 2 or 3 more patents for features on the scooter. I just get the feeling from Court's posts that something much bigger was done that we haven't seen or connected to EBR yet. | ||
| Court |
>>>>I really like the guy and his story about the City-x made me buy one Could have been this one . . . . http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/17/ 88925.html?1102882938 I;m an ••••••• now . . but the story and the bike are still great. | ||
| Court |
Yep . . . it was only 9 years ago . . . memory like a steel trap.  | ||
| Court |
That was . . . . by the way . . . . about the time I introduced the Ulysses . . . quite by accident . . . about 7 months prematurely. I see part of the Ulysses photo in one of the posts in that thread. Ooooooops. | ||
| Reepicheep |
That was an *Epic* story. Remember the good old days? The XB was new, I was thin, Court looked young, and we had Avatars. | ||
| Court |
......yeah........ I was only in my 17th year of riding Buells. | ||
| Tankhead |
Yep Court, that is the one!!!! Thanks again for that story you wrote. I thanked you in person that day at Liberty. I met Erik that day and you asked me to escort the boys from Queensryche back to AC. Great memories. That City-X was the best bike. Not one problem in 32000 miles. Shame my Uly is stranded in Nova Scotia. Fixed now. Just gotta get there. Got the 2010 wheel in my garage waiting for the next tire change. Great to see you back Court, I missed ya. Hope all is well. | ||
| Torquehd |
man that makes me miss my cityx even more. i would love to have another some day. | ||
| Court |
 | ||
| Reepicheep |
If I still had my M2 and my XB9SX in the garage next to the Uly, I have little doubt that I could roll a dice to pick one and random and ride away thinking "this is the best bike ever made!" every time I ride it. (Make that 4, the 1996 KDX-200 that *is* still in there has earned the right to be in that company as well). There are a lot of different paths to make t he best bike, and therefore a lot of best bikes. Not all bikes are the best, but the ones that are found a sweet spot using unique vision, incredible hard work, and a lot of luck (luck favors the prepared). There are a lot of Bad bikes, but there is more than one best bike ever made. | ||
| Court |
That's a fact. The M2 Cyclone got there in a, at least at the time, unconventional manner. Folks who have never ridden/owned and M2 struggle to understand. I should probably add, as I write, the tale the M2 Cyclone and how it came to make the list. I expect a sea change to the way we think about motorcycle companies may accompany the next such motorcycle. | ||
| Reepicheep |
I double dog dare you to do it. And please don't let facts get in the way of the truth when you do it. (Yes, the gauntlet has been thrown.  ) | ||
| Torquehd |
I've never owned an M2... go on... hang on let me grab some popcorn. | ||
| Court |
Hahahaha . . . I'd love to. But I am going to be away and out of touch for a while. Hopefully someday that M2 story will get written. It has been nice to get to visit here again for a couple days and see old friends. | ||
| Rex |
good to hear from you. An M2 owner |
