| Author | Message | ||
     Eisanmann |
Have any of you killers ever come face to face with a person whos only purpose in life is to kill you? Beleive me,all that fancy-pancy bullshit yer talkin' will be the last thing on your mind as you bring your weapon of choice to bear! I'm sure its great entertainment and exercise and all. But you don't want to face that monster with out yer fire breathing dragon! | ||
| Dynarider |
You know it E, some asshole wants to attack myself, my wife or kids, the last thing I would try to do is defend my family with some stupid ass karate moves. Was it in the movie scar face where pacino says something along the lines of, you attack me with a bat & I get a knife, you use a knife & I get a gun, you geta gun & I get a tank. | ||
| M1combat |
What if it's all you've got? I see the virtue of guns... really I do. It's just that sometimes you don't have the luxury. Not that I've ever been in a real "to the death" type of fight, but wouldn't it be better to be prepared? I don't mean prepared for a fight, I mean prepared for when your gun won't work, isn't there, or whatever... The first thing I look for in a gun is reliability so hopefully that won't happen. Have you watched "Saving Private Ryan"? I hate to use a movie as an example, but when that German killed the American guy on the floor of that building he needed a good martial art. He would have had a chance. As far as the last thing you would try to defend your family with being stupid ass Karate moves... What if you don't HAVE that last thing... then what are you going to do? Keep pulling the trigger after your empty? Tell the perpitrator to wait while you unjam your gun? Oh wait, I know... You'll wait for the cops to get there? I really don't mean to be a prick, but I understand both the need for guns AND the fact that you may not always have them. Do I think Martial Arts are for everyone? Nope. I haven't had to use them in "anger" even once (almost though). Do I regret the years of practice? not a bit. Do I practice with my USP also? Yep. In any case, Karate moves (if you insist on the generalization) aren't "stupid ass"... At least a few of the forms are VERY effective. Certainly more effective than a dang baseball bat (Unless you practice with a baseball bat...). IMO, "stupid ass" is underestimating your opponent. Eisanmann - No, I haven't come face to face with someone who truly wants to kill me. If I do, I hope I have a pistol or shotgun with me. If I don't, I'll happily move to plan B. Do I think plan B is effective against a gun? Not unless the guy holding the gun can't find the safety and the trigger and hasn't cocked it or put a round in the chamber... but at least I have a plan B. It certainly beats a cell phone... | ||
| Unibear12r |
Our Department went through a great deal of time and effort to prove to us and train us for the fact that at ranges of 10 ft or less the guy WITHOUT the firearm has the advantage. Stats at the time showed that most fights/shootouts started,with little warning,at ranges of 7yds or less.Our old rangemaster used to set us up at 10ft from the target and have us draw & dry fire while he ran up and smacked us on the head. In our 2(rounds) at 5(yds)from the holster drills I could have round two center mass in 1.25 seconds but on his drill the best I could hope for would be a contact shot to the body.He was old and fat too and liked to rub it in.A younger man trained for hand to hand would have had my ass. There was a lot more training in baton & hand to hand after that.If it ever hits the fan for you the odds are that you will only have what is in arms reach and be behind the curve...Knowing some hand to hand might be all you have when it comes out of the blue and there's no bazooka in reach. After saying that though I have to admit that my defense would best be my fire breathing 1911A1 as my hand to hand sucks. | ||
| M1combat |
Thanks Glenn, I've watched video's and attempted single and double leg takedowns against opponents just trying to pull a gun. The grappler generally has his way. Even the Police in my town will tell you that... they practice Jiu-Jitsu. | ||
| Teofan |
Jeeze! I guess I won't get my pictures! | ||
| M1combat |
Sorry Teofan... I hate when people Hijack my threads so I really should have stayed out of the martial art topic. Again, my apologies... | ||
| Mikej |
Teo, Jump over to the knowledge vault bodywork section and rummage around in the archives there some. Might be some old pics someone posted. If not re-post your request there and you "might" get a more focused response. Sorry I can't be of more help. | ||
| Teofan |
No problem. Martial arts against stick or gun or knife is so hotly contested I shouldn't have mentioned anything. It frosts me over when geezers like to preach over and over about their views. It should boil down to if your a SMART person you SHOULD NOT put yourself into the situation where violence is needed. | ||
| M1combat |
LOL  , good point . | ||
| Bomber |
yeah, let's get those geezers outa the way, already! | ||
| Kevyn |
Sadly, St. Louis just lost a young officer trying to arrest a drug felon who attacked the officer and his partner, got hold of a gun and shot them both before the partner shot him...very sad day here. In a past incident, an acquaintance working in his fathers ministry pantry was attacked by a gun wielding thug; managed to deflect the shot enough that only his thumb went missing, took control of the firearm and shot the robber. ...just thought this would fan the flames... | ||
| M1combat |
A VERY sad day... | ||
| Aesquire |
Tai-Chi, archery, Win 1300, whatever works. A home intruder at my house will probably steal everything before I get up. I have trained with bat, but a 13th century battle axe is the first thing I grab when I hear a noise. I figure I can sweet talk a judge/grand jury easier with that in front of them than a m-16. where are the pics? edited by aesquire on February 11, 2004 | ||
| M1combat |
OK, I don't generally pick on any martial arts... But TAI-CHI!?!? Argh!! Another of the arts I have practiced is SCA combat (practiced with full armor and Ratan sticks). Practice like that makes baseball bats MUCH more effective, but still not as good as a good shoot fighter IMO... You're right though, unless the perpetrator is actually looking to hurt someone they can probably steal just about everything in a house w/o waking the residents... | ||
| Seeeu911 |
Sad to say a friend was killed by a gun last week. He was a hand to hand combat expert and active duty canine officer. On a routine call out to an old mans home, the old guy was demented and shot Brian. His canine partner 115lb German Shepard named Echo (pronounced eatyou) killed the shooter immediately. Even trained and carrying, shit can get you. Sad days around here. some night's I do forget to set the alarm and I still sleep very soundly...because on guard for my family is Lacey. 85lbs of retired Police American Buldog.  | ||
| Lowelltroll |
SO! What exactly does this thread have to do with being a Buellist??? Shouldn't we be over at the Kung Fu/GOA site? I like combat shotguns myself, but I come here for Buell stuff, not butt-kicking stuff. Maybe you all should head over to buttkicking.com and carry on the conversation over there, eh? | ||
| S1joel |
I'm not the biggest dog in the pack, and not terribly good at fancy fighting. I usually talk to the guy as long as I can while I wait for the big bald asskickers to show up. It usually avoids the fight all together. Although not departmentally approved, I have found that a quick slap or light punch to the adams apple puts them down. Use what works for you. Sorry, no pics of an X1 trunk. Joel | ||
| M1combat |
Uhhh, this is the quick board Mr. Trollguy... Ahh crap... I responded to an admitted troll... Sorry. | ||
| Dynarider |
I love the responses from people..& its not just on this board..where they use a line like...Im 6'11" & weigh 295 lbs with not 1 ounce of fat on me anywhere. Ok sure thing tuff guy. Why is it nobody ever says they are 5'6" & weigh 327 lbs & eat ho-ho's for breakfast lunch & dinner? Gotta love the internet where everyone is a supermodel & extremely wealthy with only the best of the best jobs. Oh yea just to stay on topic..uhh what was the topic???? Now I remember, sorry no X1 trunk pics. | ||
| M2me |
Personally, I only eat ho-ho's for lunch and dinner. Breakfast? A 20 oz. Mountain Dew, a couple of smokes and I'm good to go! | ||
| Aesquire |
Taco bell & Mountain Dew, thats my breakfast! I'm a tall blond with big...ooops wrong forum. Heck I'm an old slow fat guy, I agree w/M1combat, in a life or death give me firepower & distance. (I also do SCA rattan & fencing) But Tai-Chi is under rated. The yang form combines aspects of Ai-Kido (sorry if I spelled that wrong) with punches & kicks. Not a pure defensive art, & the sloooww practice is meant to burn the muscle memory. But hey, if you say klingon wrestling is the best, no arguments from me. Bennelli ..? I'll have to try one. I'm thinking of getting a Winchester X2 tactical myself. I'll look at the Bennelli now too. | ||
| Hardluckxb |
since we're already off topic... Seeeu911 that's a beautiful brindle bully. ever let her loose on those crazy ass boar's ya'll have down there? and Eisanmann combat has evolved, we have HALO now! | ||
| Blake |
Eisenman, Your language is inappropriate. Please edit your post and delete the vulgar comments asap. | ||
| M1combat |
That's a nice rifle... Aesquire - The benelli kicks like a damn MULE compared to most 12's. It only weighs something like 6.4 or 9.4 lbs. Also, you really have to fire one to understand. Most 12's will move a long ways up and to the right when you pull the trigger. The M1-Combat/M1-Tactical will move a LITTLE bit up and right but mostly straight back. Get the ghost-ring sights and a pistol grip stock (still has the regular rifle stock as well, more like a modern assault rifle). It's illegal to have both the pistol grip AND the eight round tube extension, but who says it needs to be configured that way all the time . It takes about 30-40 seconds to convert to the eight round configuration after some practice. If you look at the Benelli 1014 take a REALLY good look, I hear it's junk but I've never fired one. I had about 22 failures to feed in about 500 rounds out of my first M1. All of them were from a box of 2-3/4 inch Law Enforcement Only low recoil rounds. They just didn't have the power to feed properly. Other than those I had absolutely NO trouble with either of the M1's I owned. I put about 100 slugs through the second w/o cleaning it, no issues what so ever. I talked to a former Captain of the YC SWAT team and he said the only reason they don't use them is because they jam... I asked him what type of rounds were used... He said LEO low recoil. Other than officers who refuse to use anything but low recoil rounds I've never heard anything bad about them except the price. I've never heard a first hand account of one breaking. I paid ~900USD for each of them, but I think you could find them a little cheaper if you looked around. Oh, and the trigger ... Have you ever pulled the trigger on a Colt Python? Most people don't believe me when I say the Benelli M1 trigger is nearly as good bone stock . Absolutely freakin wonderful trigger pull. It's definitely NOT your standard issue shotgun. It's almost like the whole Buell thing... Pay a little extra and you just don't quite understand why until that first time you ride it. Just for the record... Toys I like... Benelli M1-Combat H&K USP .40 H&K G3 H&K PSG-1 Tippman A-5 w/ reactive trigger and Armson SSR | ||
| Hardluckxb |
M1... what's a geek like you got all them guns for? protecting your computer from viruses! but seriously, did you spend time in the military? | ||
| Dynarider |
Hey, geeks love firearms too!! Guess what my wife & I bought each other for our wedding presents? I bought her the S&W .357 revolver & she got me my Ruger 9mm semi auto. Nothing says I love you like cold steel  | ||
| Unibear12r |
Ouch,I'm slow & feel old too. The battle axe really fires my imagination but I'd break stuff and loose toes=clumsy.I'd love to fence again but the knee wouldn't. Because of said knee I retired from my 15yr law enforcement hobby which I have to call a hobby because I did it for free=too much testosterone & not enough I.Q. The pension pays just as good too=see above, double it.I'm not short, tall or good looking=boring.I sold my Remington 870 to make ends meet&I work for the county=underpayed. My 7yr old owns me on any pc/nintendo game=over the hill Geezer. Eisanmann-very very nice green dragon. M1-your welcome,I owed you one.I was just trying to say that a balanced viewpoint was best. Dyna-unfair! I'm forced to diet & you call in the Ho-Ho's. You win-I'm toast. Teo-Sorry I helped the hijack and yes wisdom is the best defense. | ||
| Dynarider |
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| M1combat |
"what's a geek like you got all them guns for? protecting your computer from viruses! " I don't have all those YET . I have owned two of the Benelli's and one of the USP's (I fired a SOCOM too, but they're way out of my price range and nearly impossible to conceal...). I traded the USP and some cash for the second Benelli. I then traded the second Benelli for cash to help get an XB12R. I'm actually gunless at the moment. The G3 I'll have if I can find a good deal on one (I almost bought a Pakistani made MP5 for $800 ), and the PSG-1... Maybe some day. I'll probably have to trade my Buell for it for what they want for the damn things. Maybe a Pre '64 Model 70 is a better choice considering bang for your buck (no pun intended)anyway, but they're close. My next weapon will probably be another USP, than another Benelli, then an RPK or a Century copy of a G3. I hear if you send those Century knock-offs to a good gun smith you can wind up with a rifle that's every bit as good as the real thing for 1/2 the price. As far as why I would own those... They're fun to shoot. The most fun by far of anything I've ever pulled the trigger on though is the Benelli. It feels like you have a semi-automatic "personal battleship" in your hands. LOTS of firepower and if you want to run slugs, VERY accurate. Not like a G3 obviously, but 300 yard bullseye's are doable IMO although I never tried. They sound cool too and you can hot load whatever type of ammo you want. They also make speed loaders that allow the pro's to load five rounds in the blink of an eye. LOTS of firepower. LOTS. Aside from something like an M-249 I can't really think of anything that would feel cooler to shoot. I always tell my friends the first time they shoot the Benelli to pull one just to get a feel for it, then do two quick double taps. They always turn to me just after they regain their senses (did I mention they kick really hard?) with a big smile. Anyway, enough about the 12 gage . |
