| Author | Message | ||
     M1combat |
I was riding home today... I grabbed a bit of front brake and it bit VERY hard. Hard enough that I had a stomach ache for a while if you know what I mean. I tested them out a few times slowly (slow lever pull I mean) and they seemed fine. I sped up a little and tested again... fine. Then I decided to grab them quickly. They bit VERY hard initially but after that initial bite they didn't seem to be producing any more power than the lever position indicated. I tried this a few more times and found that at lower speeds I can get the front tire to lock for just a moment and then it regains traction. It felt weird. Almost like the initial bite is a good deal greater than the bite you end up with but only if you grab the lever quickly. So far I've mostly made a point of getting on the brakes smoothly and hadn't noticed this. I was just basically playing with the bike at low speed and found this. Any thoughts? My guess is that at lower speeds the front tire has less inertia and locks before the weight has had much of a chance to transfer to the front. Once the weight transfers forward a bit it gains traction and starts spinning again. I'm not too sure I want to try this at higher speeds, but I probably will at some point when there's no traffic. | ||
| Henrik |
Don't know exactly what you mean by grabbing the front brake quickly, but it sounds like you're "slamming it on hard." Which is not a good idea under any condition. Always "ease" on the brakes. You can ease on quickly but don't "slam." Another thing to consider is which brake pads you're using. Some are known to be grabby, others need a bit of heat in them to work the best. Just something to think about. Henrik | ||
| M1combat |
What I meant by quickly was exactly what you thought, pull them quickly. I understand smooth is better, but I just like to know exactly what can happen. You may want to go try it yourself if you have an XB, just so you know what CAN happen if you aren't fairly smooth. I doubt this would cause a wreck in any case unless done in a turn. Just take one finger and quickly pull the lever in. Don't pull it in far at all and you will feel the whole bike just instantly jerk to the rear. In any case, just figured I'd mention it in the interest of safety for all. I think that once the tire gains enough inertia that it wouldn't happen at all anyway. | ||
| Court |
Don: I'll give you an ol' test riders hint. Take your bike to an abandoned parking lot about 6:00 AM on Sunday mornings. (I happen to use Gage Park in Topeka, KS and Gateway Park in NYC, but you know what I mean). Find an empty parking lot with the yellow lines painted (you'd prefer WELL worn yellow lines so that the slick paint isn't a factor in what we are about to do) so that cars can park facing each other. The layout I'm describing will look like a series of huge "H" side by side....HHHHHH. Now....position yourself on the centerline, ease up to 20 MPH. As you pass a designated crossbar (H), apply the brakes and stop normally, not a panic or aggressive stop, but a normal stop. Now, measure the distance and make a note of it.. I actually do a bunch of crud like weigh my fat ass and the "as configured" bike prior to doing this and then I make reference marks and measure the spacing of the cross reference bars. Repeat the process, from 30 MPH and 40 MPH. Sit on milk carton for 5 minutes (actually walk the course, stand back and VISUALIZE what you are doing. Now, remount and do the same exercise with progressively more aggressive braking. You are NOT A HERO, don't try to be one on the first pass. My point is to LEARN WHAT YOUR BUELL DOES AND HOW IT DOES IT. I used to expose my ass to traffic and a collection of idiots over a wide area in a short period of time. When the defication hits tyhe rotary osciallator I MUST know what my options are. After a couple of these exercises, you will learn (thank you Mr. Pridmore) to roll onto the break leaver as your hand rolls off the throttle. On a good day, I want you to be able to change the attitude and orientation of that Buell without me, as a rear seat passenger, knowing it. Best compliment I EVER got over the years was the fellow from Chicago who complained his Buell wasn't working right. While at Daytona, I took him for a two-up ride on HIS bike. He wrote Mr. Wilke a letter I proudly keep here today, professing that after 12 years as an MSF Instructor he didn't know a motorcycle could be operated like that (I've had those comments on both sides of the spectrum, I confess). Court's Preaching: (old timers will recall my Airplane lesson)....Know thy gun, know thy ammunition and know thy adversary. Come see me sometime about "tight figure eight turns" and how they can save your ass. Court (who admittedly has NEVER even sat on an XB platformed bike and stands ready to be told this is all tomfoolerly) | ||
| M1combat |
Thanks for the reply Court. The brake exercise you describe is basically what I was doing but using Canyon drive which leads up to my house. I have also done a little learning going up and down hills. I don't generally measure the distances but I'll give it a shot sometime. I need to start using the rear brakes too... About 12 years or so ago I was doing some routine maintenance on my Yamaha IT250 and decided that since I had never done it, I may as well lubricate the rear brake system where the hub and caliper pieces meet around the hub... I didn't have rear brakes for at least one summer and winter (in Alaska) and basically got in the habit of never using them. I would imagine that tight figure eight turns will teach a person a lot about steering position vs. lean angle but I'm sure there's more wisdom in it than just that. If you get the time at some point or if you know of a specific article on the web that will convey the message please post. You got me thinking... What would be a good exercise to learn a "panic lane change"? Maybe slalom? | ||
| M1combat |
Also, Do you think you can build that power plant soon enough? | ||
| Henrik |
M1; I get the idea. For maneuvering practice, buy a batch of cheap, fluorescent tennis balls, cut them in half and set up a maneuvering course in said empty parking lot. Not like BattleTrax - just one maneuver at a time; for instance accelerate, slow quickly and turn within your markings. Henrik | ||
| Boulderbiker |
I wouldn't reccomend tennis balls, if you don't swerve quite right and hit one of those suckers, they'll squirt and definitely make things exciting. | ||
| Ara |
Court, you're right on. Ditto the figure eights, and not just once or twice but with regularity. It goes without saying that it helps if you practice your braking and slow speed maneuvering on a surface that's clean and in reasonably good condition. | ||
| Henrik |
tennis balls .... they'll squirt and definitely make things exciting. That'll teach ya'  Henrik | ||
| Boulderbiker |
ROFL, yeah it would, definite incentive to not screw up. | ||
| Boulderbiker |
So I admit, I'm curious about the whole figure eight thing, is this just a drill to improve your slower speed skills, do tell Court, or Ara. I'm always game for getting better. | ||
| Kaudette |
An open recommendation. If you haven't taken a formal road-riding course, then try to get on one - over here (Europe) you need to do 20 hours minimum of track riding to learn all about the bike dynamics - acceleration, braking, slow turning, fast turning, obstacle avoidance, and then high speed slaloms, etc. I had ridden bikes since I was 10 and after all these years have to say that I still learned a lot in those 20 hours. (enough to make a difference on 2 occassions already.) If you can't afford the course, get a decent book (I don't have one to recommend but I am sure some here would have an opinion to share) and get your cones or tennis balls and spend some time on the empty lot. And start with the pure basics (vision & position on the bike are still the most important things to do right) and go step by step. Good luck! | ||
| M1combat |
I've read "Twist of the Wrist I" and will be picking up "Twist of the Wrist II" and "Soft Physics of Motorcycle Dynamics" soon. |
