| Author | Message | ||
     Jaimec |
I wake up this morning and hit my regular racing news sites and what do I find? An early Christmas present! http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/motogp-pedr osa-new-tire-unfair-for-honda/ | ||
| Trojan |
Cal has the same brakes now. The question is: Who paid for them? Cal says he has an invoice for them but won't pay because he doesn't think a rider should have to pay for bike parts at this level of sport. I tend to agree but if he wants to be competitive he may have to soften his line and get what he needs from his own pocket unfortunately. At $75,000 per set though it would make a big hole in his pay cheque! Herve Poncharal says that both sets of brakes have been paid for, but not by whom. It would appear that Dovi also had new electronics for the test on Monday, but no mention if they both got them or not. Maybe Cal will have to stump up for that too  With Dovi scoring a podium and being fastest in testing he is certainly the lead Tsch 3 rider at the moment, and must be almost a show in for Ben Spies ride next year (assuming Lorenzo stays where he is of course)? Latest rumour in the paddock is that Cal is in discussions with the factory Ducati team for next season. That could either be a brilliantly timed move or a career ending faux pas of collosal proportions! | ||
| Crusty |
And Silly Season hasn't started yet. Fasten your seat belts, ladies and gentlemen. It's going to be an interesting ride. | ||
| Jaimec |
Basically, everything is on "HOLD" until Jorge Lorenzo announces where he'll be in 2013. Right now, it sounds like he's perfectly happy where he is. Remember, the rumors were a couple of years ago that Ducati/Marlboro offered him DOUBLE what Yamaha was paying him, and he decided to stay put. Will Honda make the same offer? Would he be willing to share a garage with Pedrosa? Would Pedrosa (and Puig) be able to STAND being #2 behind Lorenzo? (Message edited by jaimec on June 06, 2012) | ||
| Trojan |
Would he be willing to share a garage with Pedrosa? Would Pedrosa (and Puig) be able to STAND being #2 behind Lorenzo? HRC have made it plain that they will only have one Spanish rider in the team (unless Repsol force their hand of course). If they stick to that then Lorenzo would not only push out Pedrosa (and Puig) but would also conceivably block the move of Marquez to the factory team in 2014, so not an easy decision for HRC to make. However Yamaha have stated that they will not enter a bidding war for Lorenzo, so if HRC offer him big bucks he may be tempted to see what he can do on a Honda. I think he would be much more tempted by Honda than by what Ducati had to offer in the way of machinery. Both Dovi and Crutchlow have now come out and stated that they want/expect to be factory riders in 2013, although even my maths can work out that there just are not enough factory bikes to go around, even if they choose to ride a Ducati! Personally I think that there will be lots of scurrying around and huge amounts of rumour mongering for the next few months, and then very little will change. Rossi will see out his time at Ducati, Lorenzo at Yamaha and Pedrosa at Honda. The only questions will be who makes up the second spots in the three factory teams. However.......If just one of them decides to blink and move then the whole new party game begins and it could be very interesting to see who gets left without a chair when the music stops  | ||
| Jaimec |
http://www.motorcycledaily.com/2012/06/will-dani-p edrosa-ever-win-a-motogp-championship/ I'm thinking: NO. Perfect answer to Honda blowing off Valentino Rossi, ignoring the one man who DID give them a championship in the 990 era, manipulating the rules in order to give their flyweight "savior" EVERY advantage, and putting all of their eggs into one basket (until last year). | ||
| Trojan |
Pedrosa would have been long gone if it weren't for two big factors in his favour. 1. Puig in his corner manipulating and scheming for every advantage he can get for Dani ( I would be surprised it if wasn't him that 'leaked' the news of Stoners retirement among other things). Although it looks unsavoury at best, most riders/sportsmen would kill to get a manager as ruthlessly efficient as Puig has been for his boy. 2. Repsol have basically told HRC that if Pedrosa goes, they go. This of coure may change completely if/when Marquez arrives or they can tempt Lorenzo across from Yamaha. Pedrosa has been unlucky in some respects because of injury and because he wasn't given the tool to get the championship during most of the 800 era, but I think he has had his day and is very unlikely to win a championship now regardless of which bike he is riding. | ||
| Jaimec |
"Didn't have the tools??" Honda basically rammed the 800cc formula down Dorna's throat so their flyweight "golden boy" would have every advantage. When the first 800cc Honda was unveiled, Nicky's first thoughts were: "You've got to be kidding me!" It OBVIOUSLY wasn't built with HIM in mind. What Honda failed to grasp was just how instrumental Valentino Rossi was to their winning record; he got to prove his point that it was the rider, NOT the machine, that was the most important part of the formula. His dismal record on the Ducati notwithstanding, he proved it year after year on the M1, a bike that was going nowhere with Max Biaggi onboard. Rossi's development skills also gifted Spies and Lorenzo with probably the best, most sorted-out bike on the grid. I think the difference between Yamaha and Ducati is that Yamaha LISTENED to him when he and Burgess made "suggestions." In his autobiography, Rossi said the reason he jumped to Yamaha instead of Ducati was that Ducati's culture was too much like Honda's. I guess last season proved him right in that regard. Also looks like Ducati is eating some serious crow, and is doing everything possible to give Vale what he's asking for. Dani once made light of Nicky's development skills. He hasn't done much better. Either that, or it's that HONDA figured they knew more than he did, nodded their heads while listening to him, then went off and did whatever the hell they wanted anyway. | ||
| Trojan |
or it's that HONDA figured they knew more than he did, nodded their heads while listening to him, then went off and did whatever the hell they wanted anyway. That is pretty much the way I see it with Honda. You also have to rememebr that Dani spent at least two off seasons recovering from injuries and had very little development time on the bike. However Honda shot themselves in the foot when the pushed fo the 800 class simply becaue their bike was never as good as the opposition, regardless of rider. By the time they had solved all their probelsm the class was effectively over. | ||
| Jaimec |
Speculation is over: Jorge is staying put with Yamaha for the next two years. Let the "Silly Season" begin in full! | ||
| Trojan |
Speculation is over: Jorge is staying put with Yamaha for the next two years. Let the "Silly Season" begin in full! To be honest I think the 'silly seaason' is over already, with the exception of who will be Lorenzos team mate next year. Honda (and others) are pushing very very hard to get the rookie rule removed so that they can sign Marc Marquez and his entire circus straight into the factory Honda team. If that happens (as I suspect it will) then there is nowhere left for any riders currently out of contract at the end of 2012 to move to and they will have no choice but to sign for their current teams or look around for a CRT ride! All this has done is slot everyone back into the places they already occupy, making the 2012 silly season the shortest ever, and one that will be dominated by a rider who has never ridden a MotoGP bike or won the Moto2 championship yet. If by some miracle they don't get rid of the rookie rule, it is almost impossible to see where Marquez could be slotted in to an exisiting satellite team without upsetting current rules or team sponsors/owners, as he will bring with him his entire Monlau team crew and sponsors etc. I can't see either Gresini or LCR wanting to sack a whole crew for the beneift of a single season with Marquez. And lets face it....Marquez hasn't even swung a leg over a MotoGP bike and may not win Moto2 either, in which case then what happens to the winner of Moto2 2012 if it turns out to be Luthi or Espagaro etc ? Will Honda make a team available to them at any expense? I can see a lot of rule bending/breaking in order to accomodate not just Marquez (although mainly for him) but maybe a few other upcoming young Moto2 guys into what is becoming a very small pool of factory and satellite bikes. With at the very least Luthi, Espagaro, Redding and Iannone wanting MotoGP rides in 2013 in addition to Bradley Smith already signed to Tech 3 I just can't see where they will all end up as there are simply not enough competitive teams available. (Message edited by trojan on June 12, 2012) | ||
| Jaimec |
Matt, first you say "Silly Season" is over, and then you post all the possible permutations and combinations available for the remaining riders. Don't forget, if Bradley Smith is guaranteed a Tech3 ride, then what does that mean for Dovi/Crutchlow? Will Honda want to COMPLETELY refresh their garage, seeing as how Dani hasn't paid off for them at all? Or will they try to hold on to him as he's the only rider (with Stoner gone) who has been proven to be able to run with Lorenzo consistently? | ||
| Trojan |
When I say it is effectively already over I mean that the major players will be staying put in their current teams. Honda will keep Pedrosa for at least one more year and add Marquez to the factory team if they can. if they are prevented from doing this then they will sign someone on a one year deal to tide them over until Marquez joins them. Either way, they will not be looking to sign another big name from another team. That means that everyone else remains pretty static with the possible exception of the Spies/Crutchlow/Dovi triangle and who ends up at Yamaha with Lorenzo. If either Cal or Dovi get the gig then I would expect Ben top move back to Tech 3, effectively meaning that no new names come into the equation. Bradley Smith is signed to Tech 3 but whether he actually gets to ride a Yamaha M1 in MotoGP next year is still not 100% sure, so there is still a remote possibility that Tech 3 could either run a CRT bike for him or 'sub let' him to a CRT team for 12months to get experience at MotoGP level. That would still leave a place for Cal/Dovi to fill in Tech 3. Other than them, who else is anywhere near a factory ride? Bradl is under a 2 year contract at LCR and Gresini have Bautista (although they could let him go of course givne his poor results this year). Pramac look doubtful for 2013 and Karel Abrahams Ducati squad are apparently rethinking theri strategy for 2013 too, so we could actually see less satellite bikes from Ducati next year. I don't see any major teams picking up their riders though. | ||
| Jaimec |
And Nicky and Vale? | ||
| Trojan |
And Nicky and Vale? Unless Vale can convince Honda/Yamaha/Dorna to allow a 5th factory bike on the grid then I can't see him doing anything but stay at Ducati for another year. It would take some stretch of the imagination to see Vale back at Yamaha alongside Lorenzo or even at Honda for a one year contract. He won't want a satellite bike and certainly not a CRT, so he really has very little room for manoevre. Likewise Nicky Hayden. He won't have the other factories lining up to sign him as he is really on the downward slope of his long GP career now. In reality I can see Ducati wanting to replace him but not having any realistic option to sign anyone better than him may keep him for another year at least. I know Nicky is good for US Ducati sales but I think they want results more than PR now and may look to sign an aggressive 'young gun' to partner Rossi, who will retire in the next 2-3 years.. Other than Hayden, Ducati have apparently had talks already with Cal Crutchlow, so maybe he will take the second 'poisoned chalice' factory Ducati ride alongside Rossi next year if his bid for a factory Yamaha ride looks lost. If the rookie rule is relaxed (If Honda keep bleating then it probably will be!) then Ducati could take a big risk on Scott Redding as a future prospect (They have already stated their interest in him on a few previous occasions) or could go for Andrea Iannone in an all Italian team (Iannone is a friend of Valentino and so he may have some influence). I'm sure I could be very wide of the mark, but it will be interesting to see who ends up where atthe end of this year | ||
| Bads1 |
Unless Vale can convince Honda/Yamaha/Dorna to allow a 5th factory bike on the grid then I can't see him doing anything but stay at Ducati for another year. But what if rumor is true and Vale fields his own bikes through Coke a cola??? On a side note Coke is in talks as we speak about the purchase of Monster Energy. I would think Coke would really want Rossi for there marketing. Then what would happen to Tech 3 ??? Would Coke if they owned Monster.... would they sponsor the amount of teams. | ||
| Trojan |
But what if rumor is true and Vale fields his own bikes through Coke a cola??? I'm sure Rossi could raise the budget to run his own team, but not so sure he could obtain the factory bikes necessary even if they wanted to give them to him. The rules only allow the factories to supply 4 bikes each. This includes a factory squad of 2, so effectively they only have 2 bikes that they can supply to satellite teams in addition to these. Bother Yamaha and Honda are fully comitted in this respect and to supply Rossi with a bike would mean letting down one of their established satellite teams, which I can't see happening. Rossi would then be in a similar (if not worse) position as Marquez simply because there are not enough bikes to go around under current regs. Honda can get around this with Marquez by getting Dorna to ditch the rookie rule, but Rossi would still be out in the cold. His best option right seems to be to stick it out with Ducati for another year and try to convince his former employers at Honda that he is still worthy of a factory ride in the Repsol team alongside Marquez in 2014. He can then either hope for a rule change allowing more factory/satellite bikes on track or a complete change to an all CRT grid (or at least more competitive CRT bikes). If everyone rode CRT bike she coudl set up the best funded/equipped team in the paddock I suspect | ||
| Bads1 |
Bother Yamaha and Honda are fully comitted in this respect and to supply Rossi with a bike would mean letting down one of their established satellite teams, which I can't see happening. Like I said though. Tech 3 is heavily sponsored by Monster. If Coke Buys Monster and it sounds like it is. Then Coke will have some say. | ||
| Doerman |
All the changing regulation, influences, horsetrading.. Hmm... MotoGP is sounding more and more like calvinball to me. I've just become totally disinterested in this circus. | ||
| Trojan |
I've just become totally disinterested in this circus On the contrary, I think the rider market and related politics are actually adding interest to what was a pretty dull race series until now With the weather forecast of monsoon level wind and rain this weekend we could see a surprise winner of the British GP too Unless they cancel it of course  | ||
| Trojan |
It rained hard and the wind blew at Silverstone this morning....which goes a long way to explaining the result of FP1.... 1 46 Valentino ROSSI ITA Ducati Team Ducati 300.1 2'19.328 2 69 Nicky HAYDEN USA Ducati Team Ducati 299.9 2'19.405 0.077 / 0.077 3 4 Andrea DOVIZIOSO ITA Monster Yamaha Tech 3 Yamaha 304.2 2'20.127 0.799 / 0.722 4 1 Casey STONER AUS Repsol Honda Team Honda 303.6 2'20.321 0.993 / 0.194 5 35 Cal CRUTCHLOW GBR Monster Yamaha Tech 3 Yamaha 298.4 2'21.263 1.935 / 0.942 6 6 Stefan BRADL GER LCR Honda MotoGP Honda 291.7 2'21.917 2.589 / 0.654 7 26 Dani PEDROSA SPA Repsol Honda Team Honda 298.1 2'22.713 3.385 / 0.796 8 99 Jorge LORENZO SPA Yamaha Factory Racing Yamaha 293.9 2'23.174 3.846 / 0.461 9 19 Alvaro BAUTISTA SPA San Carlo Honda Gresini Honda 299.3 2'23.326 3.998 / 0.152 10 8 Hector BARBERA SPA Pramac Racing Team Ducati 296.5 2'24.150 4.822 / 0.824 11 11 Ben SPIES USA Yamaha Factory Racing Yamaha 297.4 2'24.214 4.886 / 0.064 12 14 Randy DE PUNIET FRA Power Electronics Aspar ART 278.9 2'24.360 5.032 / 0.146 13 54 Mattia PASINI ITA Speed Master ART 281.8 2'24.390 5.062 / 0.030 14 9 Danilo PETRUCCI ITA Came IodaRacing Project Ioda 273.8 2'25.012 5.684 / 0.622 15 51 Michele PIRRO ITA San Carlo Honda Gresini FTR 280.7 2'25.051 5.723 / 0.039 16 41 Aleix ESPARGARO SPA Power Electronics Aspar ART 281.2 2'25.065 5.737 / 0.014 17 77 James ELLISON GBR Paul Bird Motorsport ART 267.7 2'25.150 5.822 / 0.085 18 68 Yonny HERNANDEZ COL Avintia Blusens BQR 282.3 2'25.298 5.970 / 0.148 19 22 Ivan SILVA SPA Avintia Blusens BQR 269.4 2'28.615 9.287 / 3.317 5 Colin EDWARDS USA NGM Mobile Forward Racing Suter 266.5 2'31.468 12.140 / 2.853 The Ducati crew have apparently been seen donning Indian Chief head dress and doing impromptu rain dances at the back of the garage in the hope that it continues to pour down for 2 more days at least Ben Spies crashed out and was taken to the medical centre to check a potential wrist injury, but was released as 'uninjured' (although if it was me I'd probably have to take 2 weeks off work!). Bautista also crashed at the same place but again uninjured. Karel Abraham was declared unfit to compete despite his earlier assertion that he would race this weekend, so will not take any further part in proceedings (and therefore will not suffer any further embarresment at the hands of the CRT brigade at least until the next round ) Colin Edwards time was outside the 107% cut off so would not qualify if these times counted for grid positins, which hopefully won't be the case unless they cancel FP2 and qualifying of course. (Message edited by trojan on June 15, 2012) | ||
| Jaimec |
"Like a Duck to water" is taking on a whole new meaning in MotoGP... | ||
| Trojan |
"Like a Duck to water" is taking on a whole new meaning in MotoGP... Very Good | ||
| Trojan |
FP2 stayed dry for half an hour before the heavens opened once more, so I can't see anyone improving on the current times posted so far.... 1SPIES B.Yamaha Factory Racing 2:06.651 2STONER C.Repsol Honda Team+0.908 3DOVIZIOSO A.Monster Yamaha Tech 3+1.316 4HAYDEN N.Ducati Team+1.538 5BARBERA H.Pramac Racing Team+1.607 6CRUTCHLOW C.Monster Yamaha Tech 3+1.976 7PEDROSA D.Repsol Honda Team+1.981 8BRADL S.LCR Honda MotoGP+2.083 9LORENZO J.Yamaha Factory Racing+2.335 10ROSSI V.Ducati Team+2.836 11DE PUNIET R.Power Electronics Aspar+3.109 12ELLISON J.Paul Bird Motorsport+3.293 13ESPARGARO A.Power Electronics Aspar+3.737 Ben desperately needs a good result this weekend to bolster his hopes of keeping his factory Yamaha ride next year, so will hope he can continue this pace into QP and race on Sunday. I'm sure the both Tech3 guys will have a target pasted on his back though! | ||
| Jaimec |
Matt, I think that time sheet is a bit old. I'm seeing stories that (as usual) Stoner waited till the very end of QP2 before going out and pipping Ben for fastest time. | ||
| Jaimec |
BAUTISTA ON THE POLE?? Oh, this IS going to be an interesting race... | ||
| Crusty |
It doesn't matter who's on the pole, it'll be the usual suspects up front. Unless it rains. Everything changes if it becomes a wet race. | ||
| Jaimec |
I think Pedrosa said it best: "Jorge is too strong for the Hondas." | ||
| Trojan |
Well an interesting weekend and even quite an exciting race in MotoGP (although not at the front of course once the usual suspects got going). Stoner tried to make it hard for Lorenzo for half a lap, but the result had an inevitability about it that couldn't be stopped by Stoner or anyone else. Ben Spies started well and looked to be back to his old self, but faded badly after aonly a few laps. Don't know exactly what his problem was but I'll bet he was thanking his lucky stars that the Tech 3 guys both had 'off' weekends for differening reasons, as I'm sure he would have found himself in 7th rather than 5th if they hadn't. Ride of the day of course must go to Cal Crutchlow. He may be British, which of course means I will be accused of a certain bias, but his ride was pretty heroic nonetheless. Remember he dislocated and fractured his left ankle on Saturday morning, so missed a whole day of practice and qualifying time and wasn't passed fit to race until Sunday morning. Starting from the very back of the grid he was quicker than just about everyone up to second place and finished a brilliant 6th just behind Ben Spies. A few more laps and I think he would have been 5th but a great effort. The crowd were on their feet every lap when Cal went past and it was a good weekend to be British with Scott Redding finishing 2nd in a thrilling Moto2 race as well (and showing Marc Marquez that you can't bully everyone!). On the sour note, Honda seem to have been succesful n bulldozing the rookie rule out of the window and strong rumours suggest that Marquez has already signed for Repsol Honda for next year alongside Pedrosa. This is very bad news for private teams and for rookies looking to move up to MotoGP, simply because there are just not enough rides to go around Those that are available will be quickly filled by the established 'stars' so young riders ill find no way to progress until somebody retires at the top If the rumour mill is to be believed, it would seem that there will be at most one satellite Ducati next year (Pramac will not be renewing their contract) and the Cardion team may also not renew with Ducati. That will leave the grid looking very bare indeed once more. With little or no chance of the top Moto2 guys (other than Marquez of course, who has yet to win a championship!) getting a look in for a ride, even on a CRT bike. Unless some Moto2 teams such as Marc VDS (Scott Redding/Mika Kallio team) or Speed Up (Andrea Iannone) step up and run their own MotoGP satellite teams next year I can see the series looking pretty poor, although just getting hold of bikes may prove a huge problem for teams wishing to make the step up unless they go for CRT machines. As for other riders of quality like Tom Luthi and Pol Espagaro, they may just be sadly stuck in Moto2 for another year. The organisers need to either make it a full on all CRT championship or force the manufacturers to lease a lot more bikes to private teams, and they need to decide pretty quickly which direction it is to be. (Message edited by trojan on June 18, 2012) | ||
| 46champ |
On the sour note, Honda seem to have been succesful n bulldozing the rookie rule out of the window The evil empire strikes again. It is probably a blessing in disguise that American Honda pulled out of Superbike racing over here. I say good riddence don't let the door hit you on the ass on your way out.} |
