| Author | Message | ||
     Samg |
Since the bike was new..the stator was replaced in spring of 2010 and 2011...summer of 2011 was ok.. Voltage would drop to 12.1 when in traffic..I was ok with that..during one ride to NYC I was stuck in a bad traffic jam.. Voltage dropped low..battery light came on. Bailed on that ride,got out of NYC and hit the highways..voltage had been ok after that incident..then came to light,the relay issue.. And yes i had a bad relay.. I still kept riding with a bad relay and figured the stator would burn up in spring of 2012 ...it hasn't .. Still going strong.. . So I decided, getting an idea from this site to run a switch controlling that relay.. Replaced the relay and ran a switch.. Have not needed to turn on that relay yet.. Let's see how long the stator will last running on single phase only... 09 Cr.. 17k miles.. 35w hid low beam and tail and markers are LED bulbs. | ||
| Sparky |
Are you disconnecting the ECM control wire to the relay and running a separate wire? | ||
| Timebandit |
If you're going to run a manual switch to control the stator leads, you'd be best off if you made the switch interrupt the leads that will shut off the coil that's at the 1:00 position in the photos. 1:00 is the bundle that always fails. | ||
| Samg |
Yes , the switch is connected to the control side of the relay.. I didn't touch the "high voltage" wires .. | ||
| Dannybuell |
can you show some step by step pictures? | ||
| Samg |
I will try to explain it.. On the relay harness ,there are black,grey and two yellow wires.. All I did is install a simple on/off switch on the black wire.. When the switch is in the off position the system will always be in single phase mode.. When switch is on position the ECM has control over the relay...I got the switch from radio shack 54-103 | ||
| Dannybuell |
THX | ||
| Timebandit |
if you want a shunt regulator that turns on and off, why not just buy a compufire? | ||
| Swamp2 |
If you're going to run a manual switch to control the stator leads, you'd be best off if you made the switch interrupt the leads that will shut off the coil that's at the 1:00 position in the photos. 1:00 is the bundle that always fails. Is that not the coil that the relay cuts out? | ||
| Samg |
swamp.. yes ,you are right... i have the manual switch on the coil ( control ) side of the relay... Timebandit..i guess its a manual regulator that is controlled by a human... | ||
| Swamp2 |
Samg - actually I was following up on Timebandit's earlier comment. I assumed the relay deactivates the stator coil(s) that tend to overheat but maybe I'm giving HD's engineers too much credit... | ||
| Timebandit |
Blaming H-D engineers is misguided. From a practical standpoint, this is NOT about whether HD's engineers got it right or wrong. It's all about which three wires happen to occupy which three positions in the stator connector. HD engineers don't control that. The pin assignment may be randomized by the guy who stuffs the stator wires into the connector. Look at it this way -- you have 3 wires coming out of the stator, and if you interrupt any one of them with the harness/switch, you have a 2/3 chance of having picked the right one. If you're designing an add-on device and you want to assure the right leads gets disconnected, it's your responsibility to properly engineer your device. This is going to involve moving the wires in the connector so that the right one gets interrupted by your switch. If you want to de-activate one specific coil, then it's your job to engineer your add-on device correctly. To do this, just wind an inductive sensor around the desired coil and take voltage measurements as you disconnect leads. | ||
| Milt |
Randomized. I like that. | ||
| Bernhardgrave |
It doesn't matter which stator wire is cut-out. Mr. Hildstrom shows in his personal webpage (http://hildstrom.com/projects/buellstator/index.ht ml#windingpattern) that the 12 pole stator uses four poles wired to each phase, alternated every third one. So you aren't cuting-out any section of poles, but every third one all the way around. | ||
| Samg |
I figured if it's running in single phase all the time, the poles that are producing electricity are not running at full power and will stay cooler.. Hopefully I am right.. | ||
| Timebandit |
Bern, 3-phase power engineers have always known what you're pointing out, that the phase bundles alternate as you go around the stator. That's an absolute requirement to get the phase shift as the array of rotor magnets circumnavigates the stator windings. You're right though, Greg Hildstrom posted some very nifty diagrams. Look at them closely and you'll see exactly how to trace the wire that goes to the coil that is most likely to fail. Pick the right wire, and you'll be able to selectively pick which TWO ADJACENT coils you want to shut off. I've already established that the three coils from 12:00 to 2:00 are the ones at greatest risk, with 1:00 being the highest risk. So choose the right wire (your choice) to shut off the pair at 12:00 and 1:00 or 1:00 and 2:00. (Message edited by timebandit on June 13, 2012) | ||
| Timebandit |
Samg, if it's single-phasing all the time, 1/3 of the poles are working full time, while 2/3 of the poles are sleeping. those 2/3 that are sleeping passively act as heatsinks. | ||
| Samg |
Update-- yesterday I did a ride.. Was stuck in stop and go traffic for 6 miles.. Voltage started to drop in the high 11s.. So I figured time to hit that switch! Worked great.. Voltage was at mid 13s and highest coolant temperature reading was 212f.. Outside temperature was around 97f.. Once got moving ,switch was turned of.. This was the first time I needed all 3 phases of the stator since I started this topic.. | ||
| Swamp2 |
Hey Samg - thx for the idea. I stuck in a switch today as you had done and will give it a try. What the heck, it didn't cost me anything and I'm used to keeping an eye on my voltage anyway. Most my riding is < 50 miles/trip and I keep it on a tender when it's home. My bike has 1800 miles and the original stator, the harness relay has been in since 600 miles or so. I guess I'll just ride it for a while and see what happens... | ||
| Samg |
Swamp. Keep me updated.. I also changed all the light bulbs to LED, front park,taillight and plate light.. Make sure your battery is in good condition.. | ||
| Swamp2 |
Samg - I'm not sure how good the battery is. It takes a LONG time for the tender to bring it back to fully charged even after fairly short trips. Never had any problem starting the bike nor any running problems to date, though... | ||
| Timebandit |
at the risk of stating the obvious, your comment that the tender is taking a long time after short trips says that your bike is depleting the battery and not charging it. | ||
| Swamp2 |
Well, yeah but... it's always been that way... Even on longer rides - the voltage always looks fine/reasonable - the bike it never misbehaves so I've just sorta become used to it. So I don't know... I'm thinking the charging system is ok, but the battery isn't quite normal. It is the original battery, FWIW... | ||
| Samg |
Swamp.. Go to your local auto shop.. Ask them to do a load check on the battery.. If the load check shows 180cca or lower replace the battery.. Make sure your battery is atleadt 75% charged.. Of coarse 100% charge will give you a accurate test..... Also there is an other test you can do.. Unhook the negative cable on the battery.. Charge the battery till your tender says it's fully charge..then let the battery sit for 24 hours ... Check the voltage.. Should be above 12.79 volts.. Make sure ambient temp is over 60f..after you are done,hook the negative cable back up. | ||
| Samg |
Make sure you do not disconnect the negative cable for the battery tender harness ( wire ) ... | ||
| Swamp2 |
Samg - will do. I have a pretty fresh battery (last year) in my XB12Ss so will swap them to see if there's a difference in behavior. FWIW, on my 20 mile commute to work today (mostly highway) the voltage was ~ 14.2v the whole way in on single phase mode. Didn't drop until I got off and was sitting at an intersection w/ fans running - dropped to ~13ish. Maybe high 12s... I am also running Barker & EBR ECM. I think CT was below 180 the whole trip in... |
