| Author | Message | ||
     Tiutis |
I read somewhere online that Ulysses puts down about 83HP and 67TQ. Are those accurate numbers? 20% loss. Is it because it's air-cooled? Just curious, what is 1/4 mile time for a Ulysses? | ||
| Tootal |
Those numbers are taken at the rear wheel. All manufacturers specs are taken at the crank which the Uly has 103. The crank numbers will always be 15 to 20 percent higher than at the rear wheel. So it's basically apples and oranges. | ||
| Tiutis |
Sure, but where I was going to is that seems like liquid cooled engines have less power loss or seems so. Do you agree? For example, 6gen VFR dynoes about 97HP= 108 at the crank. FZ6 88-90HP=98 at the crank. | ||
| Froggy |
2008 Buell 1125R - 146hp crank, 120-125ish real world, which puts it at 15-20% loss depending on the dyno. | ||
| Tiutis |
What are Ulysses 1/4 times? | ||
| Tootal |
Well it's not exactly designed for 1/4 mile times, the front end would be a bitch to keep down while launching! Here is what I know, A water cooled engine of the same size and configuration will likely make more power at the crank because of tighter tolerances since the engineer knows what the max temperature of the engine is going to be. Now when your talking rear wheel power then you add in the gearing of the bike and also the drive train. A chain, a belt and a drive shaft all have different efficiencies and this will reflect in the rear wheel numbers. I'm curious as what your concern is as far as the Uly numbers? (Message edited by tootal on March 16, 2012) | ||
| Debueller |
I did a 12.83 ET in the quarter with my '06 a couple of years ago. I could have done better, but the front end was reaching for the sky all through first and second gear despite the placement of my balls on the air box cover and my chin over the windsheild. And I ain't no drag racer........ (Message edited by debueller on March 16, 2012) | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Much to much information. | ||
| Tiutis |
Tootal, It's not a concern but more of a thesis that air-cooled has higher hp loss than liquid cooled. But Froggy disproved my thesis with his 1125R example. Also, I forgot that it can really depend on a dyno, so you kind of have to put two bikes on same dyno and during same (weather) conditions. Just curious about its 1/4 mile capabilities. Thanks Debueller for sharing that! Sounds like it will depend on a rider's skills a lot. | ||
| Uly_man |
"I'm curious as what your concern is as far as the Uly numbers?" So am I? A 100BHP is a 100BHP no matter how it is generated. It is how it is delivered is the point. A V-Twin does it in a different way, to say a "four" and even more so than a two stroke engine. BHP numbers are not of much help most of the time. You may well ask why a 1125 makes near 50% more BHP than a Uly. Thats because of the modern design of the Rotax engine. The Uly engine core design is very old. | ||
| Uly_man |
"But Froggy disproved my thesis with his 1125R example." The 1125R is water cooled. | ||
| Tiutis |
Uly man, my concern was that Ulysses has 20% loss from from factory claimed to actual dyno HP proven numbers. I gave an example of two liquid-colled engines loosing only about 10%. So natural question comes up as why? Is it different dynos get different results or is that Buell overestimated their Ulysses crank HP. | ||
| Uly_man |
"my concern was that Ulysses has 20% loss from from factory claimed to actual dyno HP proven numbers." This is nothing new for bikes/cars for over 60 years and much the same for MPG numbers. Its all PR bull sh+t and best ignored. And liquid cooled engines are more efficent at transfering heat than oil/air cooled ones even with the extra bits. (Message edited by uly_man on March 16, 2012) | ||
| Froggy |
Except that with MPG, all cars in the US are tested the same way and with the same equipment by the EPA, giving a fair apples to apples comparison. The testing crank horsepower is standardized now too, there were some manufacturers intentionally dynoing crate motors that didn't have some accessories to show better numbers. Next step would be to standardize wheel dyno testing, to give real world fair comparisons, as the transmission and final drive have a huge impact on how much power really gets to the wheels. Belts rob a little bit more power than chains according to what I've read. | ||
| Uly_man |
What ever happened with that Time travel car and why can we not have a bike version. Whats the BHP on a bike that can get to the "Stone Age", will I need a Gore-Tex suit for re-entry and whats the spares situation if my belt gets ripped off by a T-Rex. | ||
| Mikef5000 |
Comparing crank power to rear wheel power has absolutely nothing to do with air-cooled versus water-cooled. It has to do with everything between the crank shaft, and rear tire; which, in the power train, is just about everything except those parts effected by water/air cooling. Primary gearing, transmission gearing, final drive gearing and method (belt/chain), rear wheel weight/size, rear tire weight/traction, etc. How efficient the motor is will be differentiated by air versus water cooling. But drivetrain loss is just that... power lost to the drivetrain... not the motor. | ||
| Tiutis |
Thanks, Mike. I was just curious... So today, I finally test rode a 09 Ulysses XT and 09 Versys. Versys is definitely out as it was giving to much vibey tingly sensation to my ass and feet. Damn, I loved Uly! Power is not a problem, I was just curious. Anyways, my two concerns were heat and finding neutral. It had a plastic shield on a header but it did not much to protect my legs and crotch from heat. 1. Would wrapping mostly eliminate this problem? 2. Do all Ulys have "hard to find" neutral. I mean, I only found it once throughout my test ride. That was annoying  Tomorrow, 03 VFR turn. But I'm so stoked about the Uly though even with its weaknesses. | ||
| Mikef5000 |
Hard to find neutral usually means the clutch cable is out of adjustment. That's generally not a normal issue. Heat on the other hand, is a normal issue. A comfort kit and flash will help if it doesn't already have it. It won't 'solve the problem', but it definitely helps. The kit includes a metal header shield, a bigger right side air scoop (closer to matching the left side), and a big piece that goes over the shock under the seat. The computer reflash makes the fan run much more often, keeping everything a bit cooler. Wrapping the headers will help some, not tons though. | ||
| Tiutis |
Is the clutch adjustment an easy/cheap fix? Can it happen to a bike with 4,300 miles? | ||
| Paul56 |
Clutch adjustment is a relatively easy 2 step process. One adjustment inside the left side case, the other on the clutch cable. And depending on how the clutch has been treated, it certainly can need an adjustment at 4,300 miles. When comparing power numbers, take it all with a grain of salt. The Uly uses a small bore/long stroke engine that makes big torque and doesn't rev very high. It makes for a very user friendly riding experience. Just not the fastest thing out there, still, maybe one of the most satisfying. |
