| Author | Message | ||
     Davegess |
You could of course just watch AMA Superbike where the leaders are swapping places pretty much every lab if not several time within a lap. Sunday's AMA race was a classic. All that was lacking was variety of engine configurations at the front but we had Suzuki, Yamaha and even BMW in the lead group and one of the bike was a non factory team. And there certainly weren't playing follow the leader waiting for a mistake or a last lap chance to pass; there were swapping paint lap after lap. That was a good race! Moto GP is really boring. As for the baseball analogy? Little League??? That is a real insult to the Moto2 and 125 folks. You may not have heard of them but these guys are good. The proper analogy would be Triple A ball. Or top college football compared to the pros. And I would rather watch an exciting Triple A game, or college football game, than a yawner of a Major League (NFL) game. | ||
| Jaimec |
Watched it for the first time in years this past weekend, more to see how Geoff and Taylor did than for any other reason. AMA Superbike scoring confuses the hell out of me... | ||
| Gaesati |
Dovi is better than Hayden for example, about on par with Simoncelli and would not be third if Pedrosa had not been injured. Similarly, if Rossi wasn't on a Ducati he would be a further step lower. Dovi's time may be coming but it is not yet. | ||
| Trojan |
And there you have the reason I will NEVER root for Honda, nor do I have any interest in any of their products no matter their quality reputation. Unfortunately the same could be said of Kawasaki (who just dumped PBR from the Superbike team even after he gets their first win and spends £2m of his own money on the team!) or Yamaha or even Suzuki. None of the Japanese factories operate in a way that we would feel is loyal or justifiable unfortunately and sometimes their decisions defy logic. Honda are determined to keep Simoncelli but want rid of Dovi despite results showing that te opposite should be true. However race results are only a small part of the equation  Dovi is better than Hayden for example, about on par with Simoncelli and would not be third if Pedrosa had not been injured. Similarly, if Rossi wasn't on a Ducati he would be a further step lower. Dovi's time may be coming but it is not yet. If's and buts' don't win anything. You have to take chances when you get them and that is what Dovi has done. Unfortunately it looks like he will lose factory equipment next year so this could be his last chance. | ||
| Simond |
Unfortunately the same could be said of Kawasaki (who just dumped PBR from the Superbike team even after he gets their first win and spends £2m of his own money on the team!) or Yamaha or even Suzuki. Finding those drugs in the team truck didn't exactly help PBR's case! Do you think Tom Sykes will be able to find a ride in WSB next year? | ||
| Trojan |
Finding those drugs in the team truck didn't exactly help PBR's case! Do you think Tom Sykes will be able to find a ride in WSB next year? I think it was pretty much established that the drugs and ammunition were 'planted' in the team truck and it isn't first time that a motorsport team has been targetted in this way. Whether we will ever hear the true story I don't know..... Tom Sykes is high on a few teams shopping lists including Kawasaki, who have expressed a desire to keep him in the new team. PBM have also said that they are keen to keep Tom if they decide to carry on in WSB. If they get the Yamaha WSB team deal he would be an ideal choice. PBM apparently have options open to them in MotoGP (presumably aas a CRT team) as well and certainly have both the infrastucture and finances available to do that, although that option may not suit Sykes. Tom has shown he is a good development rider having been shouldered with the responsibility of leading the ZX10 development for 2 years, and actually had a pretty successful WSB rookie year at Yamaha too. It was only Spies stellar performance that year that made Tom look relativley average. He should hopefully find it easy to get a decent team ride for next year hopefully. | ||
| Jaimec |
OHMIGAWD!! Recognition at last from Matt!! | ||
| Trojan |
Recognition at last from Matt!! I don't think I ever said Spies winning WSB season wasn't something special? | ||
| Jaimec |
Official word from Yamaha is that BOTH Spies and Lorenzo will race in Motegi. Wonder what changed Jorge's mind? Still no word regarding Rossi or Stoner. Rossi has nothing to lose (non-Japanese factory, and he's not in title contention). Interesting to see regarding Stoner, though... | ||
| Trojan |
Wonder what changed Jorge's mind? Three things......Yamaha pressure, World Championship points and money  It seems both come ahead of well publicised 'principles' that he shouted about so hard a few weeks ago. Stoner will crumble and be there too without a doubt, because he just cannot afford not to be (although if he did stick to his principles and risk losing the championship he would go up in my estimation considerably). The only team who really do have a free choice are Ducati, because they have nothing to gain by going. Both Rossi and Hayden have spoken against going to Japan as have most of their mechanics apparently, so they may just stay away en masse and take whatever fine the FIM/Dorna decide to throw at them I think it would have been a much more entertaining GP to watch a load of Japanese test riders we've never heard of racing around on factory bikes at Motegi Funny how none of the 125 or Moto2 teams/riders have made any comments about not going either...... | ||
| Jaimec |
Maybe they have, but the journalists don't consider it newsworthy? And I agree... it might've been interesting to see what happens when you put a bunch of no-name test riders on the elite MotoGP machines to see what would happen... | ||
| Bads1 |
Stoner will be there and so will the other two. If they don't go it will be a huge insult to the Japanese factories. Besides that it would have a seismic effect at Honda Headquarters,because Honda owns Montegi.Also a disrespect for the Japanese. The riders bikes all have stickers on there bikes showing they care about Japan and what happened there. | ||
| Davegess |
125 or Moto2 teams/riders have made any comments about not going either If they had said something you would have heard something. These guys are all hungry for the next level; nothing will get in the way of that! | ||
| Jaimec |
Power outage in Spain causes cancellation of Practice #2 today. Pedrosa/Lorenzo/Stoner were 1/2/3 in the morning session. They'll have an extended 75 minute practice session tomorrow before qualifying (assuming, of course, they get the power back online). | ||
| Bads1 |
Hmmm Stoner speaks. http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/motogp-ston er-something-strange-at-ducati | ||
| Jaimec |
Third fastest bike in the extended practice was a Ducati. Unfortunately, it wasn't either of the factory bikes (it was Randy DePuniet). Rossi and Hayden were down in 9th and 10th. Three different variations of the Ducati on the grid. DePuniet and the other satellite riders have the GP11. Nicky has the GP11.1, and Rossi has the GP11.1, but with an aluminum steering bracket (not CF like on Nicky's). I understand Ducati has not given that bike a different model designation. | ||
| 46champ |
Rossi has the GP11.1, but with an aluminum steering bracket (not CF like on Nicky's). I understand Ducati has not given that bike a different model designation If we the interested spectators start calling it the GP11.2 and enough of us do it then it will be the GP11.2. | ||
| Jaimec |
Rossi qualified 13th. He'll start from Pit Lane since he will be using Engine #7 tomorrow. Stoner on Pole, Spies third, and Lorenzo fourth. Nicky Hayden was the highest qualifying Ducati. | ||
| Crusty |
Another snoozer.  I was hoping that the new frame on Rossi's Duck would help; but if it did, it wasn't nearly enough. I wonder what would happen if the FIM allowed other tire manufacturers in; instead of making Moto GP a Bridgestone show? Maybe the Duck would work better on Michelins or Dunlops? | ||
| Jaimec |
Another Honda romp. Nicky was the highest-placed Ducati. It's getting less and less likely that Jorge will get to hang on to his title, unless the remaining tracks lack the long straights that give the Hondas their advantage. Hoping the 1000cc engines, with everyone starting from scratch, levels things off a bit. Crusty: At this point, with all of the MotoGP experience Bridgestone has, anyone not running a Bridgestone would be doomed from the start. Remember, the Ducatis ALWAYS used Bridgestone from the beginning. Michelin dominated the series until the 800cc era, and the cost-cutting restrictions put on the tire manufacturers at the same time. After that, every race was actually TWO races: Michelin riders vs Michelin riders, and Bridgestone riders vs. Bridgestone riders. The debacle at Laguna Seca in 2007 was the beginning of the end for Michelin. Dunlop was in the mix too (they were the supplier for Tech3) but I don't remember them ever being even remotely competitive. | ||
| 46champ |
Jaimec: Different tires might be what Ducati needs now. The Bridgestone tires of 2007 and the Bridgestone tires of today are two completely different animals. I think todays Bridgestone tires are formated for the Honda in particular and the Japanese factories in general. Bridgestone has forgotten who brought them to the dance. I'm sure some arm twisting has gone on in the boardrooms of Japan after all who buys more tires for new production bikes Honda or Ducati. This was probably one of the unspoken reasons Bridgestone didn't want to be the sole source of tires for MotoGP they knew they would be placed under undue pressure to make the Honda work and inversely make the Ducati not work. I'm not saying they made the tires on the Ducati not work purposely, it is an unfortunate effect of making them work for Honda. Ducati gets what Honda wants weather it likes it or not, Tough shit. | ||
| Davegess |
I think ducati is lost. The comment from Burgess this weekend "I wouldn't start here" indicates to me that they do not understand the CF chassis and do not know where togo. They went too far to start and have no base line to work form. They need to toss the thing and start over. I wonder if they may be running out of cash for MotoGP? | ||
| Trojan |
Another boring processional MotoGP race, only livened up by the joke paintjobs on the Repsol Hondas that looked like someone did them in the shed the night before the race! Both Yamahas were verylucky that Dovi crashed and Supersic made a big mistake, otherwise we would have been watching a Honda top 4 I think The only bright point was watching to see how high Rossi could get before his tyres went off, and I thought he would catch Hayden at one point before he started goig backwards again. Thankfully the Moto2 class once again provided a classic race adn one of the best of the year so far (in any class!). Marquez may have come out the winner in the end, but for most of the race there were some brilliant moves being made from 1st to 15th place. Even at the end of the race the distance between 5th and 15th was just over 2 seconds! With potential CRT teams deciding not to race in MotoGP next year (Kiefer racing and Marc VDS both look very unlikely to take up their options), and Colin Edwards new team not even having a chassis or engine sorted yet, I think the MotoGP class next year will be as thin or worse than it is now so another year of following Moto2 then | ||
| Jaimec |
46champ: Ducati has more bikes on the grid than any other factory. It stands to reason, therefore, that they need more tires than any of the Japanese factories. | ||
| Trojan |
Bridgestone made the tyres to suit Dorna, not Honda. Unfortunately the only factory that has built a bike that really suits the current high grip Bridgestone tyres in all conditions (so far)is Honda. The tyres are the same for everyone though, so it is up to the other factories to catch up and make their bikes work the tyres better/harder. Moto2 is exactly the same. Dunlop makes one tyre and the teams have to make thir bikes work with it, not the other way around. Given the problems that Ducati are still battling against, and seemingly going backwards, I wonder how long it will be before they give up and go back and consider dominating WSB with a full factory team rather than waste billions chasing 8th place in MotoGP? Rossi has already made enough noises about racing in WSB before retiring after all. if that happens and the 6 MotoGP Ducatis (more next year probably with 2 Aspar bikes and maybe 2 Cardion/AB bikes too) are withdrawn, it will kill MotoGP stone dead at a stroke. How much will Dorna throw at Ducati just to stay in the game then? | ||
| Jaimec |
When does Bridgestone's contract expire? Certainly a new manufacturer providing spec tires would throw everyone back to square one. That would make things interesting, I'd think. Cheng Shin control tires, anyone? | ||
| Simond |
Great news that Bradley Smith has signed for Tech 3 MotoGP in 2013 with another year in Moto2 first. He looks so much better on a Moto2 bike than he ever did on the 125s and has performed brilliantly on a bike that has no real history of top finishes. I wonder who'll be taking over from Colin Edwards next year. It must have been difficult to make that split as he consistently outperforms new teammates. Who ever it is the Tech 3 riders will know that at least one of them will be replaced at the end of 2012. I sincerely hope that they don't sign one of the existing backmarkers to replace Colin. Eugene Laverty? It would be great to see Hopper in a two bike Suzuki team next year. What are the chances.........? | ||
| 46champ |
Trojan: Bridgestone made the tyres to suit Dorna, not Honda You don't actually believe that Honda doesn't have a say in how the tires are constructed after all it is their class with their rules. Jaimec: You must have missed the line where I said "Who buys more tires for their (production) bikes Honda or Ducati." Remember Bridgestone use to make motorcycles into the 70's, they were told by the other manufactures with Honda leading the charge that they needed to stop competing with them for bike sales if they wanted to keep selling tires. | ||
| Jaimec |
I don't believe that anymore than I believe Yamaha had more say than anyone else the past three years. Hey, Yamaha might've had MORE say, as Colin Edwards was frequently tagged by Bridgestone to test their tires over the past three years (this year too). | ||
| Trojan |
I wonder who'll be taking over from Colin Edwards next year. The smart money is on either Dovizioso or Laverty going to Tech 3, but Dovi would seem the logical choice surely? I can't see Tech 3 hiring effectively two rookies at once, with Crutchlow only in his second season next year and Laverty a complete MotoGP novice. Dovi would bring experience to the team and also knowledge of the Honda factory setup, which could be invaluable. It would though start to throw up the question of who leaves in 2013 now that Bradley Smith has been guaranteed a seat with the team. Crutchlow must know that next year is his only chance to prove to the team that he deserves to stay, and I doubt that Dovi would sign for just one year. You don't actually believe that Honda doesn't have a say in how the tires are constructed after all it is their class with their rules. Of course I believe that. Bridgestone developed the tyres completely separately from the factory teams except for letting them test the tyres at official FIA tests. If you look back just a couple of years everyone at Honda was complaining that Rossi jumped ship to Bridgestone while they were stuck with Michelins. Some bikes work better with the current tyres and others don't. I think it would be a lot better if they got rid of the Bridgestone tyres in favour of something less 'sticky' and hard to use. Maybe the WSB spec Pirellis would be good for motoGP or maybe the Moto2 Dunlops That more than anything would change the riding style and 'one line' corner technique that is currently blighting MotoGP races. |
