| Author | Message | ||
     Blake |
First time I've watched the spec cruiser racing class. I felt like I was watching racing in slow motion. What is with the ridiculously wide handlebars? Fillmore surely doesn't like them. Poor guy. The muttered silence of the race announcers when Disalvo's bike retired was hilarious. | ||
| Blake |
Slow, cumbersome, very poor handling, and don't belong on a race track. The atrociously poor handling of those things is just too dangerous and not fun for me to watch; I just kept thinking, why is such a poor chassis being used to race such a heavy bike? Running the cruiser class instead of American Superbike as support to MotoGP was a really dumb idea. | ||
| Aeholton |
The atrocious handling is what made it so interesting. They were wrestling those bikes for all they were worth. Found it enjoyable to watch. Although, I would probably watch motorized bar stool racing too. | ||
| Daves |
It's fun to push any bike to it's limits | ||
| Blake |
It was agonizing to watch for me, mainly because of the silliness of road racing cruisers with mile wide handlebars like that. I tend to put myself in the seat whenever I watch racing. I did NOT want to be in the seat of any of those bikes. | ||
| Jyhfeei |
The bikes are styled after flat track bikes which have wide bars....but who cares about the bars? The fact is, the racing was great. I am sure the riders had a good time muscling those tanks around the track, swapping spots. Sorta like going to an antique road race, but the antique bikes are riding all out. Good stuff in my book. | ||
| Blake |
>>> who cares about the bars? Anyone who has crashed because of them. See Chris Fillmore in race one this past weekend for instance. | ||
| Blake |
I've seen flat trackers. I've ridden a flat tracker. The bikes I saw being raced despite their unworthiness to do so are incredibly poor facsimiles of a flat tracker; consider 580 LB curb weight for starters. | ||
| Imonabuss |
I watched briefly and had to turn it off. What a sad sight that AMA was represented at Indy by these horrible things instead of with the Superbikes like at Laguna. | ||
| Crusty |
It was the most entertaining race of the weekend. Unless you consider watching a snoozer like the Moto GP parade exciting. Fillmore crashed because he was knocked down, not because of the width of his handlebars. The racing was close and exciting, and a real unknown Privateer won over the better funded more visible teams. I'd think that Buell enthusiasts would look a little more favorably on a series that has close finishes and allows underdogs to triumph over high dollar efforts. | ||
| Firstbuell |
^^^^this^^^^ the battles at front [& just behind] were close and great fun to watch - it also sounded GREAT !! there was a lotta local sadness over the loss of lives at the Indiana State Fair's recent concert calamity - the much-anticipated Indy Mile was cancelled because their track's still a crime scene as it turned out, those 20 XR750s running 25 miles in the dirt were replaced with 30 XR1200s running 26 miles [twice!] at the Speedway - the drafting down the straights was the same; that wonderful V-twin growl was invigorating; and they arced into turn 1 in a similar fashion with familiar flat track bars & body positioning - only the outsized facility's scale was different.... all in all, by my measure, a great marketing success both for H-D & IMS - many thousands of fans stayed on for the XR races which closed out each raceday, a marked and important contrast to fans normally streaming out once 'premier' events are run | ||
| Blake |
Crusty, Didn't Stoner have to pass two competitors to take the lead? Didn't Simoncelli go from the front pack to fall back in the order, having to be passed each position? Didn't Ben Spies get duffed up on the first lap and then fight tooth and nail to gain a podium finish, having to pass at least six other competitors? To characterize that as a "parade" is awfully negative. I watched on television and was fully engrossed in the racing. The cruiser race by comparison may have included a pack of front runners, but it was so agonizingly slow, cumbersome and ungainly it was tough to watch. I reviewed Fillmore's crash in slow motion. Fillmore turned into McWilliams and it appeared that his right handlebar contacted McWilliams' left leg causing Fillmore's bike to steer to the right, which when leaned/leaning over into a right turn caused the bike to snap upright. An actual sport bike might have stood a chance at recovery. The massive cruiser got all twisted up and highsided. Ten bikes crashed in the first race. Great racing? | ||
| Aeholton |
Great racing? Yep. | ||
| Crusty |
There were more passes in one lap of the XR race than during the whole GP. Unless you count Nicky Haydens run to last place as passing .And at the finish there was less than .3 seconds separating the first three places of the Sportsters while it was over four seconds from Stoner to the Weasel; then another 8 or 10 seconds to Spies, then another "Pause to Meditate" to fourth, etc. Yes; I was there, and I not only felt that way, so did the majority of the fans, judging by the animated and excited way they were discussing the XR race. | ||
| Blake |
By no measure could that be deemed "great racing". The caliber of machine precludes it. In that respect (the machines) it was more akin to the special olympics. | ||
| Blake |
It would be more interesting to me if they were to take the idea to the extreme and race actual full dress baggers around. Now THAT would be a spectacle. Probably not much slower either. | ||
| Josequinones |
Smug alert! | ||
| Josequinones |
I was there, the crowd enjoyed the XRs very much. I doubt they could tell they were "slow". You could hear the crowd reaction when they kept going three wide into turn one where I was lap after lap. If people would get over the Buell thing they would appreciate the effort for what it was. How many companies are actually spending money promoting racing and getting dealers involved in this economy? More power to HD, Vance and Hines and all the other sponsors putting on the show. One last thing, Steve Rapp started that final race 1 crash. He got away with it and got on the podium. (Message edited by josequinones on September 01, 2011) | ||
| Firstbuell |
^^^^this^^^^ [again] | ||
| Paint_shaker |
While the XR is no race bike, I wouldn't call it a cruiser either. In some ways the race was much the same as MOTO GP with only a few bikes up front... yet it was different with the up front bikes passing and being passed. I like the spec bike concept as it showcases rider skill and attention to bike set up over the actual bike. Plus, (IMO) nothing beats the sound of a pack of V-twins haulin' the mail around a race track. | ||
| Tony216 |
I have a major problem with the XR class. Why the hell isn't it on TV every week? As far as them being slow, they are a whole lot faster than the old 883's were; yet that class produced great racing and gave an opportunity to a lot of great racers. While I agree that pneumatic valves and carbon frames are interesting, I rather watch a battle for the win on the last lap. | ||
| Hurricaneleah |
Hey guys, finally getting back to the swing of things after a great weekend at Indy. First of all, I want to again thank all the people on this board who supported our racing effort with Shawn Higbee. We literally could not have done it without all your help. The weekend went pretty well. I’ve said it before, and i will say it again, shawn is a hell of a talent on the bike. He is very methodical, pushes when he needs to, provides great feedback on bike set up, and is still as hungry and aggressive as ever. The bike and Shawn went faster every time he went out. Qualifying went well. Our original plan was to go out for 15 minutes, pull in and wait for a dance partner for the last 20 minutes. Shawn laid down a time good for 8th place on the grid of 30 plus bikes on only his 3rd lap out. He pulled in and we sat on the grid waiting for Barney or Rapp to go out.....we saw Jeremy McWilliams go so Shawn went with him.....Jeremy had a brake problem though and returned to the pits after only a lap, leaving Shawn stranded by himself.....not too long after that the session was red flagged due to Paul James crashing (glad your ok Paul!). Shawn’s solo lap time held up for 8th, but we felt we were definitely capable of more with a little drafting help. Saturday practice we found some good set up changes that worked well. Saturdays race went ok for us. Shawn got hit from behind on the first lap in the turn 3 crash that took 4 bikes out. This caused him to lose touch with the leaders. He got into a great race with Steve Crevier that went to the last lap. A rare mistake by Shawn allowed Crevier to nip him at the line for 5th, but we were extremely happy with a 6th place in that crowd. We had a sidewalll cut/tear on our rear tire that we sent back to Dunlop, so overall we were happy just to finish that race upright. Big congrats to Tyler for an awesome race win....really nice kid. We had very high hopes for Sunday, as we made a few more changes at Shawns request, and got a new fuel map that really seemed to wake the bike up. During a primary oil change, we found some debris and luckily caught a clutch and damaged primary chain that was just about to pack it in, so me were in thrash mode 3 hours before the Sunday race changing a primary. We were stoked for the race, as we had the best set up of the weekend, Shawn had a lot of confidence in the bike, and everything was looking good. You could tell Shawn really has his a-game out for Sunday. Shawn said later that the warm up lap for the race went awesome, as all the changes we made contributed to the best bike he had all weekend, and he was really excited to race....unfortunately, it was not to be as the clutch again slipped and smoked itself on the race start. I was devastated to have a mechanical like that take us out, as I truly thought a podium was within reach. Haven’t torn into the bike yet, but I am guessing we had contaminated the clutch pack from the prior failure. Without the benefit of a sunday practice/warm up, it didn’t show itself until race time......ggggrrrrrrrr. Although the weekend ended on a down note, overall it was a fantastic experience. I wasn’t sure what to expect from the crowd as far as accepting the XR’s in this type of program, but the response was overwhelming positive. This was driven home for me by the fact that I saw no one leave their seat after the moto gp race.....people were staying and excited about the XR race. We also got involved with some awesome people through this project, including all the great people at Indianapolis Southside Harley-Davidson/Buell who were our primary sponsor.....we spent Friday evening at the dealership with the Schulteti family who have owned the dealership since 1947. They are also a bunch of hardcore racers and super people....we definitely felt it was an honor to have their name on the side of the bike. Big thanks to Antelope Valley H-D and Spykes H-D for all of their support too. Like I said, we have been unbelievably lucky to be involved with such great dealerships and staff. I have to thank our pit crew as well, I have worked with these guys from the original MOMBA project for many years (even married one!), and you couldn’t ask for a better crew. Thanks Leah, Rick, Liz, Andy, Mark, and Brad. Our rider Shawn isn’t too shaby either...... The sponsors i am most honored to represent however, come from this board. Some sent a little money, some sent a lot. Some sent more money than they probably could have afforded. Some sent words of encouragement. It was an awesome response to our request for help. We printed out everybody’s names and comments (2 pages worth), and Shawn was able to read them before race #2. If you know Shawn , you know he is pretty reserved and laid back, but you could tell that there was a focus and determination there that Sundays race #2 was going to be something spectacular, one way or the other! All I can say is thank you, thank you, thank you. For those that sent an address, an autographed picture will be mailed to you later this week. Its a very small token of our appreciation. So that was our big Indy adventure in a nutshell. Its a bit frustrating knowing there is a bike sitting in the trailer capable of a podium. We feel like we owe a podium to our crew and sponsors. Shawn said it best in that we still have some unfinished business to attend to. To be continued.....  wfo | ||
| Jkgonzo |
It would be more interesting to me if they were to take the idea to the extreme and race actual full dress baggers around. Now THAT would be a spectacle. Probably not much slower either. With this guys skill, that just may happen.......... http://www.youtube.com/user/vystrcil?v=pJxOsYh12yY&feature=pyv&ad=9710386916&kw=motorcycle (Message edited by jkgonzo on September 01, 2011) | ||
| Blake |
Try... \youtube{pJxOsYh12yY}  | ||
| Blake |
Thanks for the great report Wes. I don't appreciate the class much, but I sure do support you, Shawn and all your fellow racers for putting yourselves out there. Lots of folks are enjoying the show. | ||
| Trojan |
Probably not much slower either. You obviously haven't seen the XR1200 race times then? For a 500+lb 'cruiser' they are pretty quick 9in the right hands | ||
| Trojan |
Didn't Stoner have to pass two competitors to take the lead? Didn't Simoncelli go from the front pack to fall back in the order, having to be passed each position? Didn't Ben Spies get duffed up on the first lap and then fight tooth and nail to gain a podium finish, having to pass at least six other competitors? To characterize that as a "parade" is awfully negative. I watched on television and was fully engrossed in the racing. The cruiser race by comparison may have included a pack of front runners, but it was so agonizingly slow, cumbersome and ungainly it was tough to watch. Your anti-Harley stance has got the better of you again I'm afraid. To classify the MotoGP race as engrossing compared to teh X1200 races is a tad overplaying it methinks. People didn't overtake Simoncelli, he had no tyres left so just fell backwards through the field as did Hayden and others. Spies didn't have to fight 'tooth and nail' to get past the other riders that had after all been considerably slower than him all weekend, so it was pretty inevitable that he would get back up to the top 3. However his ride was the only redeeming feature of another boring and predictable MotoGP parade. That isn't racing in my book. The XR1200 racing may be relatively slow, but with a full grid of identical bikes it is always close and always entertaining to watch, both in the UK and US series. I wonder if you would think the same if there had ever been a Buell XB9S race series as a support race for MotoGP? In fact the 'old' Buell S1 pro series was slow compared to the other bikes racing at the same meetings (as have been various other one make series), but I didn't hear any of this criticism then H-D have managed to get a lot of positive publicity out of these one make series for very little outlay, and they are certainly a lot more enteratining than watching some so called 'top class' racing. So congratulations to them for that. | ||
| Tachout |
I thought the xr1200 race was great fun to watch. Sure they were not the fastest bikes at the track but it was fun.Also there was a great short track at mid-america speedway saturday night.If you went to the short track i know you had a great time.All i can say is dirt track is alive and well in middle america. | ||
| Blake |
It's just my opinion Matt. Like I keep saying, if what mattered most to me was close racing, I could roll marbles down my driveway and be joyfully entertained. There were two elements that kept me watching, the people/racers themselves, and the close racing. The poor performance of the machines was just such a huge distraction that it ruined it for me. So I guess I need to add another criteria to my list, some minimum level of machine performance. >>> Spies didn't have to fight 'tooth and nail' to get past the other riders that had after all been considerably slower than him all weekend, so it was pretty inevitable that he would get back up to the top 3. Sorry mate, you've lost me there. "Inevitable"? >>> That isn't racing in my book. You'd absolutely love NASCAR. Bottom line, some horses are just better than others. THAT is racing. The machine is a vital part of it for many fans. We have other spec type series to watch if we want to see a better chance of a closely contested race. I'm really excited to see what the new mix of machines will bring to MotoGP next year. Your observation about the tires is interesting. At first we all thought it a good thing, but now, maybe not? | ||
| Blake |
Heck, the easy solution to achieve closer racing in MotoGP is to assign weight penalties to those who are winning. It's what they do in the touring car championship, yes? Or ditch the qualifying and grid the bikes in reverse order of championship points. That would be too much fun to watch, no? |
