| Author | Message | ||
     Amafan |
Trojan, Ben Bostrom is MR.Laguna Seca in 10 carrer WSBK starts at Laguna Seca on a Honda RC45,and a Ducati 996R he has 3 wins, one 2nd, two 3rds, two 4ths,one 5th,and one 8th . In AMA races at Laguna Seca, he has won on a Harley 883, on a Honda CBR600RR, on a Honda CBR1000RR,on a Yamaha R6 twice,and on a Yamaha R1 last year . JD Beach has never raced at Laguna Seca before, and PJ Jacobsen has raced at Laguna Seca once last year on a Suzuki GSXR 600, and races for Ducati this year. Honda is not suporting AMA RoadRacing anymore, and most manufactures will not let riders race for another manufacture, American Suzuki let Bostrom , because he is 37,and this is probably his last chance to ride a MotoGP bike,they said no to Roger Hayden,who raced for LCR last year . | ||
| Bads1 |
Actually more so Jordan motorsports let him then American Suzuki. Thing is he didn't do so well tis year with Jordan. I doubt he'll be there next year as Hayden just may. | ||
| Blake |
Matt, Elbowz is from just ten miles up the road in Longview, Texas, big sister city (70K) to Kilgore (12K), and he grew up racing at the venerable Oak Hill speedway, and he's never been anything but a class act and amazing motorcycle racer so far as I know, so yeah. It's a shame you're so often having to make excuses for Cal.  If the Brits want to put talent into MotoGP, they ought to send some young racers over here to compete in AMA Pro Racing. Seems to be an excellent springboard for MotoGP success. Probably more so once the literbikes hit the GP scene. BBoz may have lost the fire, but I'm thinking he'll rekindle it for MotoGP and even American Superbike at Laguna Seca. I'll be cheering for him. He's gotta be one of the nicest guys ever in professional motorcycle racing. | ||
| Trojan |
If the Brits want to put talent into MotoGP, they ought to send some young racers over here to compete in AMA Pro Racing. Seems to be an excellent springboard for MotoGP success. Probably more so once the literbikes hit the GP scene. I'm certainly not making excuses for Cal Crutchlow. He is big enough and ugly enough to stand on his own feet. You seem to be the one who treats any mention of your home boy Ben Spies that is less than 100% reverential as a criticism. It may surprise you to learn that I really don't give a sh*t which country a rider comes from and I actually like Ben Spies as a rider and a person, although having at least one Brit in the pack makes it a bit more interesting sometimes. As for the 'AMA pro racing is a springboard to GP success' comment. Where have you been for the last 20 years? If you want a springboard to GP success you go to Spain and race in the CEV championship. If you want your career to disappear off the International radar completely you race in the US I'm afraid. There are virtually no riders currently racing in the US that are likely to get into GP racing any time soon other than Jake Gagne or Jacobsen(and they made their name in Red Bull Rookies and racing in Europe). Team managers don't even look to the US domestic championship for riders any longer I'm afraid, and are more likely to take young riders from Spain or from eastern European/Asian countries that bring large sponsorship packages with them. BBoz may have lost the fire, but I'm thinking he'll rekindle it for MotoGP and even American Superbike at Laguna Seca. Bostrom may be Mr Laguna, but he has never ridden a 800cc GP bike and never ridden on the Bridgestone tyres on ANY track. It would be a massive ask fo him to do well and if he does so what? It isn't going to lead to any MotoGP future for him at this stage of his career. I think it is an opportunity wasted once again in giving a young rider a great opportunity rather than an old boy the equivalent of a gold watch. Given the lack of pace in the LCR garage it maybe that he can beat a his team mate or a few perennial back markers but so what, what does it prove or achieve? In a couple of years we will lose a few of the big names in MotoGP and I can't see a big gaggle of emerging stars ready to replace them other than a few more young Spaniards. Giving MotoGP rides to 37 year old superbike riders isn't going to make any diference to that fact, regardless of nationality. Jake Gagne, JD Beach, PJ Jacobsen and MAYBE Elena Myers all deserve this ride far more. | ||
| Slaughter |
I've been watching one of our local racers - Austin DeHaven. He started here locally and just got back from Spain to race Laguna. Amazing kid - just turned 17. You MUST stop in his pits to meet him. Kid has a good head on his shoulders - but AMA is secondary to European Superstock: http://www.austindehaven.com/ | ||
| Blake |
>>> As for the 'AMA pro racing is a springboard to GP success' comment. Where have you been for the last 20 years? The last twenty years? I've been watching... Kevin Schwantz, Kenny Robers Junior, Colin Edwards, John Hopkins, Nicky Hayden, Ben Spies Just prior to the above was Eddie Lawson and Freddie Spencer. Mighty Mick Doohan came to GP through Superbike racing too, but in Australia and WSBK. Odd that you missed all that. You might have made a better point if you'd said the last ten years. Even then you'd have to discount the last four Americans on the list. Send the young Brits over here for some good GP racing training. Racing in Europe doesn't seem to be getting it done for them. | ||
| Blake |
>>> There are virtually no riders currently racing in the US that are likely to get into GP racing any time soon... Says you. If I recall, you were really high on Jason Disalvo at one point, but overlooked Ben Spies until he shocked the world, dominating (when his bike didn't break, run out of fuel, or he wasn't crashed out by bone-headed racers) winning the WSBK championship in his rookie season. There are already three Americans in MotoGP. Keep an eye on Martin Cardenas. If he were on a full factory team, he'd likely be doing much better. You'd discount Danny Eslick? Wow. Josh Herin? | ||
| Jima4media |
Blake, This years' Laguna Seca MotoGP should be interesting, with no less than four Americans racing. Nicky Hayden has won it twice. Colin Edwards has been on the podium. Ben Spies is ripe for this first win, and Ben Bostrom also knows the track well. | ||
| Bads1 |
Keep an eye on Martin Cardenas. If he were on a full factory team, he'd likely be doing much better. You'd discount Danny Eslick? Wow. Josh Herin? Great riders no doubt but not yet Superbike riders. Look back and see how well Zemke was on a 600, Or even Miguel Duhamel?? They could ride the wheel's off on a 600 but not so on the 1000's by comparison. Race compound street tires on the 600's and Slicks on the liter class. Cardenas is on a great team and have had great success with past riders and championships in other classes. If anyone would of landed a ride on the LCR bike I'd say Blake Young would of been a great candidate if permission would be granted. Hes on fire right now. | ||
| Blake |
Cardenas is riding SBK this year and doing well, first non-factory rider in 4th place and has won a race. I agree about the other guys, as yet unproven on the big bikes. Eslick seems like a racer who will go as fast as any bike will allow if you just put him on it. | ||
| Jaimec |
JimA4Media: Ben has ALREADY won his first race. If he wins at Laguna, it'll be his SECOND. | ||
| Trojan |
The last twenty years? I've been watching... Wayne Rainy, Kevin Schwantz, Kenny Robers Junior, Colin Edwards, John Hopkins, Nicky Hayden, Ben Spies The last 20 years (since 1991) has NOT produced a huge list of american world champions or GP winners. Ignore Scwantz as he was retired or retiring back then but between the othes you have only a handful of GP wins and two world championships. Over the last ten years the situation is worse and if yu lok forward to the next 2-5 years can you see any US riders that are being groomed for GP racing? I agree I missed Josh Herrin (who you may rememebr I have been shouting about for a long time) and Jason DiSalvo has not performed as well as he should have done, but there are still very few who stand any chance of breaking into MotoGP in the near future. I never obverlooked Spies as he was already racing at world level. I was talking about domestic series riders who looked capable of making the transition to GP racing. This isn't a reflection of rider skill so much as a reflection of the low impact AMA racing has on team selection in GP's. This is a fact, not some nationalistic rant or fervour unfortunately. The British race scene is hardly any better I would add, and only if riders make the move to Spain do they stand any chance of getting noticed these days. Teams look towards the best national championships to source their talent, and at the moment the best series is the Spanish CEV. Also they have to please sponsors, and as a lot fo these are now Spanish of course they will em[ploy Spanish riders. | ||
| Jaimec |
An interesting analysis of the problems that plague the Ducati Desmosedici (assuming the website isn't overloaded and you can actually get to the article): http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011/08/08/the_tro uble_with_the_ducati_desmosedici_.html | ||
| Trojan |
FP1 times from Brno. It would appear that Ducati have not made any steps forward during the break between LS and here, although FP1 is early days and everyone will be feeling their way back into things. 2.4 seconds off the front is not a good sign  No surprises in the top 6, but John Hopkins continues his merry go round of rides with another wild card ride on the Suzuki (WSB,BSB and MotoGP in 3 consecutive weekends must be a record?) and is impressive in 7th ahead of his full time team mate  Crutchlow needs to perform this weekend and show that his early season form wasn't a flash in the pan, especially as he knows this track and has a good record here. 1 26 Dani PEDROSA SPA Repsol Honda Team Honda 299.5 1'56.328 2 27 Casey STONER AUS Repsol Honda Team Honda 296.7 1'57.294 0.966 / 0.966 3 58 Marco SIMONCELLI ITA San Carlo Honda Gresini Honda 291.5 1'57.408 1.080 / 0.114 4 1 Jorge LORENZO SPA Yamaha Factory Racing Yamaha 295.0 1'57.587 1.259 / 0.179 5 4 Andrea DOVIZIOSO ITA Repsol Honda Team Honda 295.2 1'57.776 1.448 / 0.189 6 11 Ben SPIES USA Yamaha Factory Racing Yamaha 290.8 1'57.903 1.575 / 0.127 7 21 John HOPKINS USA Rizla Suzuki MotoGP Suzuki 293.0 1'58.321 1.993 / 0.418 8 19 Alvaro BAUTISTA SPA Rizla Suzuki MotoGP Suzuki 294.4 1'58.345 2.017 / 0.024 9 35 Cal CRUTCHLOW GBR Monster Yamaha Tech 3 Yamaha 292.3 1'58.390 2.062 / 0.045 10 5 Colin EDWARDS USA Monster Yamaha Tech 3 Yamaha 292.4 1'58.497 2.169 / 0.107 11 46 Valentino ROSSI ITA Ducati Team Ducati 292.0 1'58.819 2.491 / 0.322 12 14 Randy DE PUNIET FRA Pramac Racing Team Ducati 291.0 1'58.927 2.599 / 0.108 13 8 Hector BARBERA SPA Mapfre Aspar Team MotoGP Ducati 297.8 1'58.973 2.645 / 0.046 14 69 Nicky HAYDEN USA Ducati Team Ducati 290.5 1'58.975 2.647 / 0.002 15 7 Hiroshi AOYAMA JPN San Carlo Honda Gresini Honda 296.5 1'59.289 2.961 / 0.314 16 17 Karel ABRAHAM CZE Cardion AB Motoracing Ducati 293.9 1'59.334 3.006 / 0.045 17 65 Loris CAPIROSSI ITA Pramac Racing Team Ducati 290.2 1'59.706 3.378 / 0.372 18 24 Toni ELIAS SPA LCR Honda MotoGP Honda 294.0 2'00.201 3.873 / 0.495 | ||
| Jaimec |
Hopper is out of the race... crashed and damaged one of his fingers. Rossi qualified on the second row for the first time this year. Pedrosa on the pole, but more importantly, Lorenzo qualified ahead of Stoner. I don't care what the midget does as long as Lorenzo finishes ahead of "The Moaner" I'll be happy. Anyone bother to read the analysis of Ducati's issues? Thoughts?? | ||
| Doerman |
I read the article. Very thorough and well written. The author sees to center on the motor being the culprit of their woes. I'm not so sure about that. The ability to read the feedback through the CF frame seems more likely to be the culprit. The Moaner seems to perhaps have had a better Rosetta stone for the feedback translation than Nicky and Vale has been able to develop. Must be really frustrating for all involved. | ||
| 46champ |
I read the article and would be inclined to believe there is something to it. I would also be interested in knowing if Bridgestone tires are constructed the same now as they were when Ducati was almost the sole user of them. It would stand to reason that Ducati would have problems the L configuration would have to increase rear weight bias relative to other configurations. Am I mistaken or is the softness of the chassis and building in flex when the bike is leaned over could this be compared to a torsion bar suspension? Since Ducati has gone to the carbon frame and the use the engine as part of the frame would cycle rate of the frame flex be at a higher frequency? Since I am a mechanic and not a mathematician or an engineer I may not be understanding the dynamics of the problem. | ||
| Jaimec |
The way I interpreted the article is that the front end vagueness affected Stoner less than it seems to affect everyone else. In other words, Stoner just cared LESS and just pushed on. Watching him ride the bike, he always seemed to be fighting it... wrestling it to bend to his will. Or maybe I'm reading it wrong. | ||
| Gaesati |
Kevin Shwantz has some interesting comments about Stoners' style. On the Ducati he adapted to its idiosyncrasies by sliding front AND rear into the corner and holding it at that point. I'd call that razor edge judgement rather than taking LESS care. Also, re: his reputation as a crasher. I read an interesting interview about his views. He commented that when he left the dirt and came to Spain and England as a road racer everybody was able to outbrake him. By the time he made it to motogp he had set out to learn how to brake as hard or harder than anybody else. He was prepared to crash to learn to do it. He believes that now he can even if it cost him a lot of crashes. Hence, his ability to ride the Ducati on the edge. Also, to paraphrase Rossi and some other racing gurus. "A fast rider can crash his way down to winning speed, a slow rider can't get up to winning speed." | ||
| Smoke4ndmears |
I think when Stoner won the championship on the Duc it was still using the steel trellis frame, but I could be wrong. Great race today. Stoner is on a tear. Shame to see Hayden down there and to see Bautista and Pedrosa wash out. (Message edited by smoke4ndmears on August 14, 2011) | ||
| Jaimec |
I really don't (ever) want to see Honda win the championship, but it's starting to look inevitable. :-( | ||
| Imonabuss |
I know a lot of people seem to dislike Stoner, but man he deserves credit as a rider. | ||
| Trojan |
Great race today. Stoner is on a tear. Yawn......did we watch the same race? Once Pedrosa crashed it turned into another no overtaking procession that was as exciting as the parade lap. Thankfully Moto2 more than made up for the lack of action (again!). The 1000's look about the same after the test too, so unless they changed the tyres or electronics we can expect to see much the same in MotoGP next year but with a slightly diferent sound track....and probably less teams and riders at the sharp end than we have now. At least we will have a few no hopers making up the numbers in the CRT ranks though (or will we?). come back two strokes...all is forgiven. | ||
| Jaimec |
Lorenzo pointed out that the 1000cc M1 does a LOT of tire sliding and thinks next year will be a lot of fun for both the riders and the fans. Rossi, too, pointed out that the extra power of the 1000s gives you a lot more options for lines and overtaking. We'll see who's right... | ||
| Trojan |
I think both are talking up the new capacity, but all the expert opinion I have read from inside the paddock believes that it will be pretty much the same story as we have now unless they change the tyre or the electronics are outlawed. Unless they do this there will be very little diference exept maybe slightly longer braking areas because of the higher top speeds (which is the main reason Honda pushed to get rid of the 990 bikes!) and maybe (and it is a definite maybe) the chance to run some different lines due to lower corner speed and higher acceleration. However, engine electronics will limit the amount of acceleration and even the place where you can start to accelerate out of a corner, so capacity increase will not change the nature of the races we have now. With the same fuel limits for the bigger/thirstier engines and no increase in engine allowance, we may even get to the point of leading riders having to cruise for the last 1/3rd of the race just to finish. Upping the capacity will not be the panacea that MotoGP really needs, and it will take something a lot more radical to bring back close racing with larger numbers of riders on the grid. Honda are looking to drop TWO factory backed riders for 2012 (probably Dovi and Simoncelli) without replacement, so the prospect of actually having less competitive teams than this years paltry grid numbers is looking fairly sure unless Yamaha/Ducati step in with more bikes for satellite teams. The BEST of the CRT teams (if they bother to enter) will probably be around 4 seconds off the pace of the factory bikes every lap, so will not bother the scoresheets unless we see some truly freak weather I'd like to think that the new rules will breath new life into MotoGP, but somehow I don't see it happening and we will be in for more rule changes within 2 years. | ||
| Noone1569 |
If anyone here is coming to Indy for the MotoGP, please feel free to PM me. We are hosting a BBQ on Friday afternoon/evening for in-town and out of town Buellers, and then riding down to Motorcycles on Meridian. | ||
| Paint_shaker |
Anybody catch the Moto 2 race? Now THAT was racing!!! | ||
| Jaimec |
I'll be there, but not on my Buell. I find my K1200LT works better for crossing multiple states and hundreds of miles... | ||
| Gaesati |
Jeremy Burgess thinks a variant of Moto 2 would be a better premier class. | ||
| Trojan |
Jeremy Burgess thinks a variant of Moto 2 would be a better premier class. I agree 100%. The premier class is dying on its feet and no amount of fiddling with the rules is going to make it viable for smaller teams and bigger grids. The manufacturers either need to sell privateer GP bikes like they did in the 'old days' of TZ, RG's etc, which is highly unlikely given the cost and complexity of modern GP bikes, or they need to simplify the formula to make it easier for smaller teams to compete (and not just trail around at the back, which is what CRT will achieve). A 'large format' Moto2 formula with either a spec engine or severely limited electronics would bring back close and 'relatively' affodable GP racing. |
