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Tpoppa
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 03:25 pm: | 
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If NHTSA became involved. And if they deemed any action was required by HD. I have strong feeling that 08 Stator/Rotor would be the final fix. The solution already exists and requires no more R&D $$.
And the NHTSA has the power to force HD's hand. We don't. |
Froggy
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 03:37 pm: |
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quote:If NHTSA became involved. And if they deemed any action was required by HD. I have strong feeling that 08 Stator/Rotor would be the final fix.
I don't think this would be the case, then HD has to deal with a legal mess of selling vehicles that don't meet advertised specs. It is no different than Chevy recalling the Corvette due to an issue with the V8, and replacing everyones motor with a V6. That V6 could have more power, better fuel economy, and not explode after 500 miles, but it wouldn't be the solution for many. |
Tpoppa
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 04:44 pm: |
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I don't think this would be the case, then HD has to deal with a legal mess of selling vehicles that don't meet advertised specs.
That's an interesting point. Even though the 08 has less MAX output, it delivers higher output most of the time (assuming harness upgrade is installed). |
Ratgin
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 05:14 pm: |
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More people that add to the NHTSA who had had this issue the more chance the HD will act on its own.
Im hoping Erik Buell Racing has a kit available soon which would solve the issue but i wont count on it.
Also many people have te 5 yr extended. Why would/should they be required to spend more money on a solution that HD needs to sort out.
By fixing it ourselves and not reporting this issue we are letting HD off the hook.
Doesn't seem right to me. |
Thecowboyblack
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 05:17 pm: |
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"Also many people have te 5 yr extended. Why would/should they be required to spend more money on a solution that HD needs to sort out.
By fixing it ourselves and not reporting this issue we are letting HD off the hook.
Doesn't seem right to me"
+1 |
Court
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 06:47 pm: |
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I'm not unsympathetic and I am not trying to be adversarial . . but tell me what facts you base this on?
quote:More people that add to the NHTSA who had had this issue the more chance the HD will act on its own.
Is this based on something you KNOW or something you THINK?
I've been around HD and Buell, in the problem solving mode, for 25 years and I am eager to learn more. |
Crabby
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 06:53 pm: |
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Only problem i had with my 1125 is when i picked it up this weekend it was leaking oil faster than the BP spill. They took it back in havent heard back yet |
Fastphil
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 07:37 pm: |
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I did a quick check with the 2 Buell dealers in Vancouver Canada and it looks like they sold a total of less than 30 1125s. Well they would not tell me how many of them in total had charging problems ,mine and 2 others are down at this time for stators.If these numbers are typical of 1125s this is no small problem.I urge owners with past and present charging problems to file with the NTSB,this is a safety issue. Loss of lighting, stalling,burning and overheated wiring. This is maybe our only real shot at getting HD to come up with a real fix. |
Court
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 09:30 pm: |
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I'd suggest folks . . . fully cognizant you'll do whatever it is you want . . reread Reep's post.
Some folks here recall the last time the feds were summoned in . . . it took a couple years and eventually . . owing to the efforts of a couple very vocal folks . . . the feds showed up at the fellows house and never again was a word heard.
For NHSTA to get involved is must be a safety concern . . . not something that **may** contribute to a safety issue.
In addition, and I have no dog in this fight . . just sharing the typical life cycle of these deals . . if you look at a couple of the complaints that have been filed they are terribly thin on facts and filled with some silly hypothetical "what COULD have happened under certain circumstances" . . . part of the reason these things tend to go dormant in Washington.
I do hope they get taken care of . . what a frustrating problem. |
Rkc00
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 09:54 pm: |
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Well I own one of each, a 1125R and a 1125CR.
Both have had stators replaced and have been in and out of the dealers for the past 16 months. I do not trust them any longer on long rides. That sad I might be taking a 1000 mile trip this weekend an probably take my V-Rod. |
Spank
| | Posted on Monday, June 20, 2011 - 10:55 pm: |
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The only time anything gets fixed by the government, is when someone gets seriously hurt and/or dies... |
Ratgin
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 01:26 am: |
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Court.
Heat from my bike frame due to VR dying was so hot it burnt me through heavy riding pants.
Smoke poured out from the crank vent. It completely shut down while i was riding.
I was damn lucky i was paying attention and KNEW from reading here what was happening. If not i would have been on the freeway doing 65mph when this bike suddenly cut out.
ALL of these are safety items. Whether the NHTSA acts or not is their responsibility.
I have done mine by reporting a bike with serious safety issues.
I will not have someone getting hurt on my conscious as Ive done my duty and reported my concerns.
I just want it fixed permanently so i can ride when and where i want but seems as long as i own this bike that's not going to happen.
Now if HD or someone actually has a solution to these issues great. Seems clear that rewinding doesn't work either. |
Zac4mac
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 09:32 am: |
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Honestly, I think we are VERY close to a working long-term fix for the charging issues.
A well made re-wind like what Gary is doing at Custom Rewind and a modified rotor to better cool the stator.
My first exposure to BadWeB a few years ago was me dogging the Firebolt guys griping about their headlights.
Seemed like a bunch of bitching instead of trying to solve a problem.
3 years later, H-D/Buell came out with a recall that fixed it.
I'd rather fix a problem than wait for someone else to do it.
I love my 1125R and will do what it takes to keep her on the road and reliable.
I have total confidence that she will handle any trip I can take her on.
Zack |
Therealassmikeg
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 10:31 am: |
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For NHSTA to get involved is must be a safety concern . . . not something that **may** contribute to a safety issue.
So.. Basically someone(s) gonna have to take the hit and get injured or die from from the effect of any one or all of these issues |
Boogiman1981
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 10:41 am: |
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short answer is yes. then there will be a little blip over how it was reported and not fixed yadda yadda |
Tpoppa
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 11:28 am: |
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For NHSTA to get involved is must be a safety concern . . . not something that **may** contribute to a safety issue.
Disagree. This is from the NHTSA.
And note: this is for 2008-2010 models. It did not take decades. The major difference is that Suzuki gives a damn, while HD does not.
-------------------------
Component: ELECTRICAL SYSTEM:ALTERNATOR/GENERATOR/REGULATOR
Potential Number of Units Affected: 73,426
Summary:
SUZUKI IS RECALLING CERTAIN MODEL YEAR 2008 THROUGH 2010 MOTORCYCLES MANUFACTURED FROM JULY 2007 THROUGH SEPTEMBER 2009, EQUIPPED WITH REGULATOR/RECTIFIER ASSEMBLIES, SUZUKI PART NUMBERS 32800-41F11, 32800-15H10, 32800-05H11, 32800-41G10, 32800-15H00, 32800-18H00, 32800-05G10, 32800-10G10, 32800-05H20, OR 32800-06G01. SOME REGULATOR/RECTIFIER ASSEMBLIES WERE PRODUCED WITH INSUFFICIENT ADHESION BETWEEN THE POWER MODULE (CIRCUIT BOARD) AND THE RECTIFIER CASE THAT CONTAINS A HEAT SINK TO DISSIPATE HEAT. DUE TO INSUFFICIENT ADHESION, HEAT GENERATED ON THE POWER MODULE CIRCUIT BOARD CAN CAUSE THE CIRCUIT BOARD TO DEFORM, AND LIFT OF THE CASE.
Consequence:
THIS CONDITION CAUSES EXCESSIVE HEAT ON THE CIRCUIT BOARD AND UNCONTROLLED ELECTRIC CURRENT OUTPUT, WHICH CAN RESULT IN INSUFFICIENT CHARGING CURRENT BEING PROVIDED TO THE MOTORCYCLE BATTERY. THIS CAN CAUSE DISCHARGE OF THE BATTERY AND CAN LEAD TO ENGINE STALLING AND/OR A NO-START CONDITION. ENGINE STALLING WHILE RIDING CAN INCREASE THE RISK OF A CRASH.
Remedy:
SUZUKI WILL NOTIFY OWNERS AND SUZUKI DISTRIBUTORS WILL REPLACE THE REGULATOR/RECTIFIER WITH AN IMPROVED PART FREE OF CHARGE. THE SAFETY RECALL IS EXPECTED TO BEGIN ON OR ABOUT MARCH 2, 2011. OWNERS MAY CONTACT SUZUKI AT 1-714-996-7040. |
Court
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 12:11 pm: |
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Potential Number of Units Affected: 73,426
You COULD be right . . but I doubt it.
In the NHTSA Risk Matrix Assessment they will take into account:
Frequency of potential exposures
Consequences of potential exposure
Now look at some of the 1125 recalls.
2010 - No Buell recalls on 1125 model
2009 - there are none on the R. There were 140 CR's impacted.
2008 - 1,579 of the R impact by recall
Like Bill . . . I'd love to see KW loose sleep over this and some of the folks' work, who put in a lot of time resolving this, see the light of day.
But . . . unless you can, with those types of numbers . . . do a better job of getting NHTSA's attention they will be spending their time on the 73,426 Suzuki's, not the 100 or so Buells.
In addition, as I've said before, many of the efforts of owners have detracted from rather than advanced their cause simply by the "Aliens ate my bike" types of language in the complaints.
By the way . . . . there is another interesting dynamic here. With so few bikes . . if I were HD and NHTSA DID do something about it . . I'd simply buy the bikes back. That'd cost a fraction of developing, implementing and tracking the resolution. |
Tpoppa
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 12:24 pm: |
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Court,
How many 1125 owners received the voluntary harness upgrade notification? 3,000? 4,000? That would be the number affected if the NHTSA became involved and a recall was issued.
There weren't 74,000 Suzukis that had R/R fail. That was the number that had the R/R that could fail and could contribute to a safety issue.
Now, I think that Suzuki was more interested in keeping Suzuki owners happy and hoping to sell them another Suzuki in the future. HD does not seem to be quite as interested in happy Buell owners. |
Court
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 12:41 pm: |
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"Happiness", on the part of manufacturer or buyer, is not part of the decision matrix in most cases.
There have been 2 cases I am aware of where "marketing" played a role.
The first was the Buell "blanket recall" in which a number of things were recalled, none of which would have been a mandated recall, simply to incorporate "lessons learned" and to have an orderly way for deploying a "blanket upgrade".
The other was the way that Ford handled the recall on the front suspenSion on the GT-40's a couple years ago . . . where the tech showed up at your house in a snappy van and a white jump suit, set up in your garage and did all the work there so that owners (who rarely drove the cars and didn't want to leave thEm at dealers) were totally untroubled by the recall and impressed with it.
Buell has an extraordinary history of going light years beyond what is both required and reasonable. There are few companies that regularly replaced complete sets of bodywork on 11 year old bikes.
I don't know how HD would handle it and, you are right, I can't see why they would have any interest or motivation to give it a second look.
If . . returning once again to what Reep said . . it were mine . . . I'd do what I do with my Ulysses . . . I'd fix it myself . . do it right, right the piss out of the bike and have fun.
Off to ride to Harriman Park . . . . |
Tpoppa
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 02:45 pm: |
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I don't know how HD would handle it and, you are right, I can't see why they would have any interest or motivation to give it a second look.
That is really my reason for filing a complaint through the NHTSA.
Worst case scenario - Nothing changes and you wasted 5 minutes.
Best case scenario - There is a Defect Investigation and the NHTSA forces HD to do something.
By the way, you can file a complaint here:
https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/online.cfm |
Buellgrrrl
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 03:56 pm: |
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I wouldn't wait for HOG(NYSE) to solve the problem- For years the GeezerGlides were wobbling all over and all HOG(NYSE) has done is to redesign the frame and pay off some of the hundred or so product liability suits so they won't become a class action.
So get a steering damper and replace the stator with one that won't catch fire, then go after HOG(NYSE)! |
Hootowl
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 04:19 pm: |
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"HD does not seem to be quite as interested in happy Buell owners."
And why would they be? They've learned that the vast majority of Buell riders won't "upgrade" to a big twin after six months despite their best sales efforts. Buell is dead, and their Buell customers aren't going to buy anything else from them. We're just an annoyance at this point. They're running out the clock IMHO. |
Boogiman1981
| | Posted on Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 04:30 pm: |
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hoot- nail on the head |
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