| Author | Message | ||
     Tbowdre |
My stator is on its way to Custom Rewind for the green epoxy and lower output windings, Compufire regulator is ordered. last question: Should I pull the harness upgrade or leave it? My plan right now is to pull it. I know how great feedback is and I plan to rack up like 3000+ miles by july (road trip) and I'll pull the cover and take look so I can report back here thanks for all the help everyone! todd | ||
| Gofast |
I'm pulling the upgrade. Stator arrived today. Compufire is still sourcing the connectors for me, so they are going to borrow the connectors from the Buell VR and ship it to me on Thursday. No price on the "kit" direct from from compufire yet. | ||
| Carbonbigfoot |
Yank it. | ||
| Duphuckincati |
Yeah, yank it. And remove your harness upgrade too. | ||
| Manor |
Just a thought (I may have cobsed up here!!). I brought a 2009 1125r with the wiring harness update. As I was installing a K&N filter I decided to de-noid by removing the noid cable. No problems, but as I was putting it all back together I came across a little grey plug which I hadnt noticed before. It fitted back into the noid as far as I can remember. Question is should I have just left it out. Cheers, John | ||
| Sl33py |
Duph and Carbon - noob question time - why yank the upgrade harness? Mine is due for the replacements and upgraded harness... trying to figure out why everyone is yanking theirs. this bypasses a controller right? thx for the info and educating me on this! | ||
| Tpoppa |
Since you are getting lower output windings on the stator, you'll need to pull the harness upgrade. | ||
| Dannybuell |
Duphuckincati LOL just thought of Michael Jackson... | ||
| Bueller4ever |
Because the harness causes a no charging condition at idle. With a well made stator, you should not need the harness. | ||
| Tbowdre |
 thanks for the support | ||
| Ratbuell |
Because the harness causes a no charging condition at idle I'd rather have a PART-TIME no-charge (how long do you idle anyway?), than an overheated stator. My harness, and my working-just-fine OEM stator, are staying right where they are. My revs are staying north of 5k, and my bike starts every time. | ||
| Dirty_john |
Gents, the harness upgrade is linked to the ECU and under certain conditions such as a cold engine will allow the third leg of the stator to be active. I would leave the harness in place. At least with the third leg of the stator inactive as dictated by the ECU there will be less heat being produced at the stator (I assume), even if a rewound stator is a higher wire/insulation quality and not subject to degradation, I would only remove the harness if you are frequently getting low battery voltage. Whilst the harness is not addressing the problem of the quality of the stator windings or the lack of cooling it does serve a purpose. When/if my stator on my 09 fails it will be rewound for 475w and the harness removed I should declare. | ||
| Xtreme6669 |
Dirty... It sounds like you are saying that everyone should leave the harness on but if yours fails it will be removed? Whats up with that?? My 09CR with just over 7k miles still runs the stock stator and no harness upgrade and almost always reads 13.8 to 14.1v. Every once in a while I will catch it as low as 13.4 however I rarely bother to switch it over to the volt/temp setting. If mine fails under WTY I will let HD fix it but as soon as it is on my dime It will get a rewind... It will never see the "upgrade harness". | ||
| Jules |
Because the harness causes a no charging condition at idle No it doesn't... Well not in theory anyway.. It causes a drop in output at certain rev ranges, but not idle. I NEVER causes a no-charging output when (a) operating correctly (b) fitted correctly and (c) in a system where all of the components are acting within tolerances. A "damaged" stator may cause the output with one leg disconnected to fail to produce sufficient capacity to recharge a depleted battery but at idle according to the cct logic all legs of the stator are live. The logic controlling the stator output is a lot more complex than just "switch it off at idle", it takes into account temperature, current battery voltage, engine speed, charging cct load and a number of other factors. The "weak" point in the logic is between ~2K and ~4K Revs on a hot motor (IIRC) but in theory (i.e. according to the cct logic) even if you're at idle with a hot engine once the V drops below it's "safe" threshold all 3 legs are turned on to recharge the battery. My system is performing exactly as i would expect it to, I have a tr-state LED that monitors stator output as I ride and when between ~2k and ~4k for prolonged periods (not often I have to say) the LED changes to Amber (between 13.2V and 12V), switching to the V display confirms this to be correct and if I stay at that speed the voltage slowly drops off to around 12.2V. At idle it always "levels out" (i.e. doesn't drop any more) and will slowly start to rise irrespective of the engine temperature. Once over ~4k revs the voltage quickly climbs back up to 13.9-14.2V so mine seems to be working exactly as designed. It really isn't happy riding between ~2K and ~4k... so I just don't do that. (Message edited by Jules on April 27, 2011) | ||
| Dirty_john |
Xtreme - what I am saying is that "if " the stator fails it will be rewound to a lower output and thus the heat that will be generated in the stator will be lower allowing me to get rid of the harness to keep the installation simple. Until the stator fails the harness will remain in place to save the cost at the moment of a possibly unnecessary stator rewind. | ||
| Sparky |
What is "cct logic"?
You mean 3 legs 'cause it's a 3 phase stator, no? | ||
| Jules |
You mean 3 legs 'cause it's a 3 phase stator, no? Yes, sorry - typo on my part.. cct logic, is abbreviated "circuit logic", i.e. the logical conditions under which the sub-harness operates to control the output of the 3rd leg of the stator.. | ||
| Robissimo |
How would one go about yanking the harness update? My local dealer suggested that they might have to drop the engine in order to do so which could take 4-5 hours and cost roughly 600usd. (Message edited by Robissimo on April 27, 2011) | ||
| Jules |
He's talking out of his arse.. It takes 2-3 minutes, no tools needed (once the rider seat is off). There's a vid on youtube where the guy does it one-handed.. http://youtu.be/nBYEYGJfyBw (Message edited by Jules on April 27, 2011) | ||
| Robissimo |
Thanks Jules! Your assistance is appreciated. | ||
| Bueller4ever |
Jules, with a brand new stator, 12.5v at idle is a no charge condition imo. With both fans running, the stator can not charge the battery because of the harness. Remove harness and it's 13.8v. Now you are saying the stator is damage, then I say the harness is a waste of wire and just remove it. | ||
| Ratbuell |
If you'd rather have a couple volts AT IDLE at the expense of a cooked stator...by all means, pull the stator. Me...I'd rather have a stator that regulates itself so it doesn't overheat and die. More reason to stay out of traffic, in my mind. And technically...12.5 is "neutral" charge, not "no" charge. You are running off the stator, and not DIScharging the battery...and not cooking the stator. Or do you typically spend all your time with a 12.5v value and never ever rev the bike and never ever get the voltage output up? | ||
| Kinder |
How long are you guys letting your bike idle? Is this really an issue here? What, do you idle for 30 mins or something? | ||
| Jules |
Jules, with a brand new stator, 12.5v at idle is a no charge condition imo. With both fans running, the stator can not charge the battery because of the harness. Remove harness and it's 13.8v. Now you are saying the stator is damage, then I say the harness is a waste of wire and just remove it. Yes - I understand what you're saying it is a "neutral" charge situation at idle, but that's not unusual for a lot of bikes. I suspect that if you do spend a lot of time in stop/start traffic or stationary at lights then removing the harness is probably the right thing for you. Unfortunately with all of the variables involved in the actual design of both the stock charging system and the "upgrade" sub harness it really does make a huge difference how the bike is ridden (and where. That's not a criticism of anyone - after all the bike should work wherever you want to take it (within reason) but I suspect that those people spending minimal time in city traffic on hot days will have less issues than those that do....which I guess is fairly obvious. Ultimately it was a "voluntary upgrade" so there's no issue at all w.r.t. the waranty if removed so it's very much a personal choice thing. For me it seems to be working fine, I suspect if my riding habits change and i find myself doing more city riding i may temporarily disconnect the harness for that time. Luckily it's a 5 min job to disconnect/reconnect it and TBH it's also a 15 min job to wire a switch in to turn the harness off and leave it there (so you canm anually switch the harness on or off dependant on riding conditions). | ||
| Tbowdre |
FWIW when I posted this I was refering to removing the "upgrade" harness AFTER a rewind of the stator with lower output, higher temp epoxy and a more efficient regulator/rectifier thanks  | ||
| Dirty_john |
If my stator on my 09 fails it will be rewound to approx 475 watts , the harness will be removed and the FH012AA r/r will remain fitted. If I can get hold of a Compufire switching r/r here in the UK I will do so | ||
| Jules |
FWIW when I posted this I was refering to removing the "upgrade" harness AFTER a rewind of the stator with lower output, higher temp epoxy and a more efficient regulator/rectifier The answer to that is a simple "yes", the OEM stator has heat related issues and the OEM insulation is "marginal". With a better grade or insulation and a lower output (and therby lower heat generation) I'd remove the harness.. | ||
| Dcmortalcoil |
I'm not sure whether a better insulation would be good for the stator. I would figure a minimum insulation would be better at dissipating heat quicker to the oil. | ||
| Jules |
It's not the windings that dissipate the heat so much as the body of the stator which is bolted to the stator cover, acting as a heat sink (allbeit not a very good one).. Good insulation is absolutely essential, but I can see where you're going with your observation. What it needs is a good electrical insulator that has good heat dissipation properties...bloody hard to find that though LOL |
