| Author |
Message |
    
Sloppy
| | Posted on Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 04:59 pm: | 
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I'm sad and sorry to report a bad transaction with a fellow Badwebber. Short story is that I ordered a caliper from this person and the caliper has stripped threads on it and this Badwebber blames me that I did not look at his picture close enough... caveat emptor. Below is the email thread (start at the bottom) where I tried to find a reasonable resolution. These are the facts, no disputing those, so make your own decision. Note, I removed email address information out of honor:
_________________________
Re: Caliper for sale?
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From:
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View Contact
To: B B <fusionworx
Thank you for your offer. But I don't see it being reasonable to have a machine shop perform a drill, helicoil / timsert repair for $20.
The gold pads are not in new condition, they were covered in brake fluid and definitely not worth $50. I can purchase brand new, from the package, pads for $36. Again, an offer that I do not consider reasonable.
This "caliper" you sold me is clearly damaged and missing parts. I understand if you were unaware of this so I am giving you the opportunity to turn this oversight into a fair and honorable transaction. I have been patient and reasonable with my requests and we can quickly resolve this by reimbursing me and I will return the "caliper" to you. I frankly do not understand why you would not be willing to back up a product that you sold. If you feel the product is in a good enough condition then you should reasonably feel that you will be able to sell it to someone else.
If you will not take a return of the caliper then I will end my attempts to directly resolve this dispute with you.
Please reply by Friday, 3/4/2011.
Thank you.
From: B B <fusionworx
To:
Sent: Thu, March 3, 2011 7:16:18 PM
Subject: RE: Caliper for sale?
Apologizes for not getting back to you sooner. Been working twelve hour shifts.
OK, you say there are "missing parts". I will cover the the cost of them, $4.00. I will also mail you a couple of time-serts or heli-coils to fix the "thread damage". AND I will also reinburst you $20.00 to cover the cost of having a heli-coil or time-sert installed. As I stated before these parts came off of a running and daily ridden 2001 M2. I know they are in working condition. The gold pads alone are worth $50.00. Where shall I send the parts to? Thanks.
BB
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 13:06:26 -0800
From:
Subject: Re: Caliper for sale?
To: fusionworx
I understand that you may not be aware of the damage to the caliper nor that it is not in a safe, usable condition. If you feel that this caliper is in a usable then you are welcome to sell it to another person. I am approaching this from a good will agreement where I hope we can resolve this between the two of us as a private party transaction. I am requesting that I return this item to you for reimbursement for my expenses. Are you willing to do this? If not, what do you propose?
Thank you.
From: B B <fusionworx
To:
Sent: Wed, March 2, 2011 3:00:00 AM
Subject: RE: Caliper for sale?
I bought this caliper as a huge lot of parts about a year ago. Since then most have been sitting in my garage (as the caliper was). I never claimed the caliper was brand new, nor did I ever notice it was damaged as you say. I never looked at it that closely or had it mounted on any of my bikes. I can tell you that this caliper did come off of a running and street ridden M2. You say there are a number of issues wrong with the brake caliper, which I was not aware of. This is why I made a disclaimer that the caliper was USED AND also had pictures posted, so you could see exactly what it was. I have been a member of BADWEB for years, have been selling items there the entire time and never had any issues with any of my parts or complaints from any consumers.
BB
Date: Tue, 1 Mar 2011 20:18:04 -0800
From:
Subject: Re: Caliper for sale?
To: fusionworx
The caliper arrived today but we have a number of problems -
1. The brake pin threads are completely stripped.
2. That's not the correct brake pin - the pitch and diameter is wrong.
3. The brake pin insert is missing and brake pin insert threads are damaged.
Attached are the missing parts: http://www.americansportbike.com/shoponline/ccp0-p rodshow/17303.html
I wouldn't have a problem with just ordering these parts, but the threads on this caliper are destroyed. Bottom line - the caliper is not usable.
My request is that I be reimbursed for cost of item and expenses to return item and I'll ship back to you. Or, I can take it to a machine shop and have them put inserts in it and you reimburse for costs (but I think this will be more expensive). I'm open to other options for making this a good will transaction. What say you?
Thank you. |
Funjimmy
| | Posted on Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 10:39 pm: |
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Thanks for posting.
What is his email address?
We should all send emails voicing our disapprovalx. |
Andymnelson
| | Posted on Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 10:58 pm: |
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did you pay via paypal? If so, they will back you up, BUT DO NOT DELAY in filing a dispute. |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 08:49 am: |
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All other issues aside, is the problem really just stripped threads for the pad retention pin, and a wrong pin?
Aside from ordering the right pin, that's a 15 minute fix with parts I can probably get from Auto Zone.
Annoying, and if obvious it is something that absolutely should have been disclosed, but I wouldn't classify the caliper as unusable, and you shouldn't have any problem getting it fixed for $20. Bring it to my garage and I'll do it for free (if I have the right heli-coil in my big drawer of heli-coils I have accumulated over the years).
If I sold it from a bike I bought used and was parting out, and the "wrong pin" wasn't obvious, I'd be annoyed at having to do the shipping both ways and refunding money over something as simple as needing to heli-coil that pin. Shipping two ways is likely more than the value of the caliper. At some level, when you buy used parts, you take your chances. That's a lesson in not over-paying for used parts as much as anything...
IMHO anyway, since you threw it out for opinion, that's mine. I rebuilt a KLR-250 and bought a second parts bike because I needed a head, parted out the rest.
It was a big hassle, and I was doing it to help other people keep bikes on the road cheap. Even if my time was free I lost money, and it took a LOT of time. |
Beachbuell
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 10:16 am: |
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"I can take it to a machine shop and have them put inserts in it and you reimburse for costs (but I think this will be more expensive). I'm open to other options for making this a good will transaction."
I offered to pay for the "missing parts", I offered to send you the correct heli-coil or time-sert to fix the "damaged threads" and I offered to reimburse you $20 for your "troubles". Every time you sent me an email it seemed the caliper just got worse and worse and your story was climaxing.
I have been a loyal member of this forum for many years and have never have a single issue with anyone or with any parts I have ever sold here. I'm sorry you feel something is "unusable" in your eyes, but it really is a very simple fix. Pictures and descriptions are always posted in my add's. What did you expect for $70 dollars? A brand new in the box caliper? I feel I went above and beyond to try to help resolve your "issues". Sorry you feel this way. |
Mmmi_grad
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 12:01 pm: |
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I would have taken beachbuells offer. |
Kalali
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 12:44 pm: |
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If I sell a part to someone and they "feel" I misrepresented the part, I would take it back. No questions asked. But that's just me. YMMV. |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 01:34 pm: |
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quote:I will cover the the cost of them, $4.00. I will also mail you a couple of time-serts or heli-coils to fix the "thread damage". AND I will also reimburse you $20.00 to cover the cost of having a heli-coil or time-sert installed.
Sounds 100% reasonable to me. I don't understand the obstinacy. If you think the shop will charge more for the repair then ask him to cover the repair. Sounds like about a ten minute job to me. |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 01:37 pm: |
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That said Sloppy's offer, "we can quickly resolve this by reimbursing me and I will return the "caliper" to you" is also perfectly reasonable. Why not accept it? |
Court
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 01:45 pm: |
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My take . . . was that BOTH sides to this had their heels dug in.
I expect to see them both elected to the Wisconsin legislature.
Either of the resolutions offered by either party may not have been cause for a party but certainly would have been reasonable.
Precisely, by the way, why I am ditching stuff via other venues and methods.
(Message edited by court on March 07, 2011) |
Blake
| | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2011 - 03:15 pm: |
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Giving stuff away is always more fun.  |
Sloppy
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 12:37 am: |
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I appreciate the discussion here and I have to commend the seller for being a very shrewd businessman. What he is doing in this transaction is to transfer the faulty product into my responsibility.
While on the surface the counter offer may seem reasonable, there are a number of issues. I have to find a machine shop, I have to take time off work to deliver and pickup the part and I would have to pick up any extra costs associated with the work beyond the $20. Then there's the offer for the correct brake pin and cover. Does $4 cover the costs of shipping and tax? Of course not.
It is clear that the part is damaged. The prior owner was very brave to use this caliper with missing threads for the only pin that holds the brake pads in. Whether the seller knew this or not is not important. Two very reasonable offers were tendered:
1. Refund the cost of the caliper.
2. Reimburse the costs to a machine shop to repair the caliper.
I'm sorry but I will not accept the responsibility of having to fix this caliper for the seller. That is the seller's responsibility (caveat emptor indeed!). But this issue can have a VERY simple and quick resolution... a refund. And it really is that simple. |
Blake
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 02:44 am: |
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That first sentence that Court wrote.
Sometimes compromise is a good thing. |
Beachbuell
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 06:09 am: |
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Or, I can take it to a machine shop and have them put inserts in it and you reimburse for costs (but I think this will be more expensive). I'm open to other options for making this a good will transaction. What say you?
Then why say or offer this resolution? Every time you send me an email it seems the caliper is getting worse and worse. It must be decomposing by itself sitting there. Is it possible you did the damage trying to install it? All offers are now off the table. |
Rich
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 06:21 am: |
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http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/476 23/518226.html |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 08:24 am: |
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If installing a heli-coil represents a significant obstacle for you to overcome in your life, you might want to reconsider doing your own service.
If telling a buyer "you pay to ship it back and I'll refund your money (*cough*pansy*cough)" is something that you are going to struggle with, you might want to reconsider being in the business of selling used parts.
Just sayin. |
Court
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 08:36 am: |
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How much is this caliper? I'd like to buy it.
I've saved the money up and am ready to buy now. |
Court
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 08:42 am: |
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....... Oh, and try to get back to me today ..... I don't want to be carrying all this cash around Daytona Beach with all the biker types. |
Two_seasons
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2011 - 10:04 am: |
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I think BB has done all he could.
I've had similiar experience when selling. Buyer will beat your brains out with 100 questions and IF they buy said item, are never satisfied.
Sloppy, you've put yourself out there for all to see your dirty shorts. Just fix it and move on. |
Sloppy
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 09, 2011 - 12:34 am: |
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Hmm, after closer inspection I've since discovered that both brake mounting threads are also stripped and one of holes are so marred (you can see it's a different diameter) that the bolt goes right through the hole without even turning it!
Just sharing the facts. And the facts are leading me to believe this is not a "brake caliper". My offer of a return is still open. So was my offer to reimburse for a machine shop (which is not the same as a few parts and $20). Still a very simple and quick resolution is possible...
I've only shared facts. Doesn't matter if you agree with them or not - they're only facts. It's up to the buyers and sellers to form their own opinions. |
Funjimmy
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 09, 2011 - 02:55 am: |
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quote: Every time you send me an email it seems the caliper is getting worse and worse. It must be decomposing by itself sitting there.
Given the latest post from Sloppy, that premises certainly seems plausible.
Just saying  |
Datsaxman
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 09, 2011 - 05:13 am: |
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Sloppy,
When you post your grievance in a public forum...
And when the story keeps getting worse with time...
The Court of public opinion is definitely in session.
You called it. This was never about "just the facts". It was, and still is, an attempt to expose another person as a bad seller. A BAD PERSON in general.
At best, it has gone badly. |
Kalali
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 09, 2011 - 01:44 pm: |
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Now on a positive note about transactions on this forum, I just got my HID bulbs and the voltage regulator from Jason (Jsunstar). Now even if I never use the VR, I think it is the most beautiful $5 paper weight I could buy...
Thanks Jason for quick shipment and great packaging.
Now back to Sloppy. You say: "...leading me to believe this is not a "brake caliper".
Well, look at it this way, you got a real authentic Made in USA Buell paper weight for $70. Now you need to start shopping for a brake caliper. |
Darren
| | Posted on Monday, March 14, 2011 - 11:41 am: |
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If I sold this Caliper, before I put it up for sale I would check it over to make sure it was fit for purpose and safe. This part could end someones life!
If you sell parts you should know if vital parts are missing or damaged. If you bought it as a job lot then throw it away or go back to the person who sold it to you!
This part was not fit for purpose so give the man back his money less postage.
The seller can then scrap it or repair it.
If he repairs it then he will be happy in the knowledge it was 100% safe! and put it up for sale again!
I would want someones death on my conscience! |
Court
| | Posted on Saturday, March 19, 2011 - 06:25 pm: |
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TOO COOL ! ! ! . . . I now own this caliper and predict it is going to have a VERY INTERESTING life!
Thanks for the opportunity.
It did it's first photoshoot today and it's already been shipped off to it's first step . . . .
 |
Beachbuell
| | Posted on Sunday, March 20, 2011 - 10:49 am: |
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Yeah, but its no good!
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Court
| | Posted on Sunday, March 20, 2011 - 12:40 pm: |
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I predict it's going to be great . . . I've entered into an agreement with a person to rebuild it. . . he's 9 years old. Eager to see how it works out. Being shipped to stage 1 tomorrow. |
Froggy
| | Posted on Sunday, March 20, 2011 - 02:49 pm: |
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If I was the seller of a item, and if for any reason the buyer wasn't satisfied, I would buy it back no questions asked.
I was in a similar situation a few years back. I sold a pair of XB wheels to a local guy. Sent him pictures, talked on the phone, he asked me if the bearings were good, I said they were. Well, I thought they were, and at the time I didn't know how to tell they were bad if it wasn't obvious. Long story short, I drive an hour to drop off the wheels, the buyer checks them out, all looks good, then he says the bearings are bad. I gave him a confused look, and he showed me how if you try and rotate the races, one was stiff, the other was a little notchy. I immediately apologized for that, and told him I'll get the bearings replaced and return in a few hours. He said it wasn't necessary, he can change it himself, so we renegotiated the price. In the end everything worked out, I got my money and he got wheels. |
Charlies_s1
| | Posted on Sunday, March 20, 2011 - 04:22 pm: |
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Glad it's over! |
Reepicheep
| | Posted on Monday, March 21, 2011 - 08:40 am: |
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Lyndall Golds! There's half the price of the caliper right there...
In all fairness, he *is* a pretty sharp 9 year old. I'll shoot pictures. |
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