| Author |
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Misato
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 26, 2003 - 11:22 pm: | 
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need a garage
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Richieg150
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 01:16 am: |
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Talked to someone last week at the Buell get together at East Troy.He has been testing the Force exhaust,his conclusion has been,the exhaust will only break if it was installed incorrectly.So,when you get your new exhaust from Force,and it breaks,it will have broken because you must not have followed the instructions to the letter.John at Force,as far as I'm understanding,will not warranty a broken XB pipe,because the only way it will break ,according to them,is if its not installed correctly.Force pipes perform great,I have one on my bike,its the warranty issue Im not quite understanding.If you install the pipe exactly like the directions say,it will NEVER BREAK!If it does break,you only THOUGHT you were installing it correctly!HMMMMMMMMMMMMMM...........very,very,interesting. |
Mikej
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 08:36 am: |
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quote:Richieg150 Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 01:16 am:
------------------------------------------------
Talked to someone last week at the Buell get together at East Troy.He has been testing the Force exhaust,his conclusion has been,the exhaust will only break if it was installed incorrectly.So,when you get your new exhaust from Force,and it breaks,it will have broken because you must not have followed the instructions to the letter.John at Force,as far as I'm understanding,will not warranty a broken XB pipe,because the only way it will break ,according to them,is if its not installed correctly.Force pipes perform great,I have one on my bike,its the warranty issue Im not quite understanding.If you install the pipe exactly like the directions say,it will NEVER BREAK!If it does break,you only THOUGHT you were installing it correctly!HMMMMMMMMMMMMMM...........very,very,interesting.
Richie,
Follow up on that and post the reply. Get input directly from the manufacturer. Follow the directions as exactly as you can. Contact the manufacturer if you find anything that causes you to deviate from the installation instructions in the slightest and document every step you take and every issue you find and every response you receive and every communication attempt you make.
If what you say is in fact a fact then it sounds to me as if there is no warranty and that situation just might come under some scrutiny as far as possible fraud to consumers. From my understanding a warranty covers a product for consumer protection and manufacturer liability. If in fact the manufacturer is saying there can be no breakage if the instructions are followed to the letter and if there is a breakage then there is no coverage then perhaps the only way to ensure you have a warranty covered product from them is to have them install the product themselves, or at the very least have some shop certified by the manufacturer install the product for you.
If in fact what you state is a fact then this alone would preclude me from buying their product. Please contact the manufacturer, or the company you bought the product from, and verify if what you state is fact or fiction - and get it in writing. Then please post your followup here.
And please take carefull note - I am not saying the Force manufactured product is good or bad, I am simply questioning what you posted because what you posted would cause me to not buy the product from any company or distributor.
Thank you. |
Tripper
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 09:45 am: |
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From what I know of Richie's dealings with Force Motor Products, the short story is this:
Force Products good.
Dealing with John Force bad.
Iv'e not dealt with them personally. I do not like that they continue to send out the sidewinder for Carb'd bikes and it strangles them unless you read BadWeb and know how to correct their error. Leads me to doubt the companies integrity. On the other hand I have met Brian and Aaron who seem to have a very good working relationship with them, so my faith tends to rise.
YMMV.
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Glitch
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 09:48 am: |
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because what you posted would cause me to not buy the product from any company or distributor.
You aren't running any Microsoft products are you.
JK |
Mikej
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 09:57 am: |
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Tripper,
I guess the key phrase there is "YMMV".
JK,David,
Why yes I do run some Microsoft products, but I did delete the Outlook program from my home system.  "> A screen door with 1/4" mesh is not good mosquito protection.  ">
edited by mikej on August 27, 2003 |
Glitch
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 10:08 am: |
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JK=Just Kidding
I'm a tech guy by trade and am appalled by the license agreement M$ has. It basically states, if it breaks it's your fault and they are not responsible for ant damage caused buy any of their products... |
Mikej
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 10:14 am: |
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I've never had ant damage in a computer, but there's always a first time.
"JK" 
(Probably starting to push my luck so I think it's time to duck and cover for a bit.)
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Glitch
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 10:19 am: |
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I've never had ant damage either!
edit: LOL! OOppss that was MY bad...it's been a long week and it's only Wednesday...
Misato:How do you store that beautiful bike when you'er not riding? Please do say "on the street"
edited by Glitch on August 27, 2003 |
Misato
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 11:31 am: |
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unfortunately it has to stay there sometimes, I chain it to my truck and put the xena disc alarm lock on it and then a cover. It doesn't stay there very long, but I have done it before.. dont like to.
I keep it at a freinds house.(in his kitchen) |
Glitch
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 11:58 am: |
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Good friend! |
Misato
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 02:00 pm: |
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yeah, his S1 is in his living room..
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Richieg150
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 05:23 pm: |
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The info I posted regarding the Force exhaust was told to me by Scott at American Thunderbike.He has been testing the durability of the Force exhaust for John at Force.As a matter of fact,he broke a exhaust at the Buell 20TH. and Force sent him another ASAP!John seems like a neat guy,really into Buells and Buellers.He even suggested that Force install a rubber mount on the front of the exhaust just for added strength,but Jonh doesnt feel its necessary.They,Scott, installed the exhaust,and it held fine.They,Scott, then installed it out of sequence torquing everything way down,then the exhaust broke.Their conclusion was that if its done correctly it wont break,period!Im not dogging the product,im stating what I was told.From my dealings with John at Force,if and when your pipe breaks-----good luck expecting any kind of warranty!I hope any pipe they sell,wont break,but that wont happen.Im not trying to chase away their business really,I have a Force exhaust on my Cyclone and it has been great,I just want others to know about Forces customer relations and their standing behind their exhaust,or should I say not standing behind their product.Im glad mine hasnt broke----yet!I bought my pipe BEFORE I knew of the problems some were having getting pipes warrantied that broke.As far as a warranty in writing goes,a warranty is only as good as the integrity of the company.Its up to the new customers calling him to see what exactly the warranty will cover,then seeing if the pipe breaks,if he will stand behind his product.If no pipes break,that will be great----but------that wont happen.Good luck! |
Misato
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 05:53 pm: |
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so where are the damn instructions anyway?
I got nothing.
what part breaks?
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Gonen60
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 07:20 pm: |
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glad I got the HD race kit now. Warrantys still good also..I bet that Force pipe sounds cool though |
Chainsaw
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 07:32 pm: |
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ASW Force pipe has awesome HP & TQ numbers...kinda ugly though IMO...won't support a jack (this means I'd have to spend even more $$$ on wheel stands)
The ceramic polished Buell race can is starting to look gooooood....(but then I'd have to buy matching chrome heel guards...) |
Chainsaw
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 07:33 pm: |
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...pardon me
NALLIN / FORCE PIPE |
Englishman119
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 09:38 pm: |
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Quote: "......his conclusion has been,the exhaust will only break if it was installed incorrectly"
Interesting, I've just recieved my Nallin/Force pipe and the only paperwork I got with it was a disclaimer about the Jet Hot coating, no installation instructions!!!!
Anybody care to summarize what they are, it might be important to me!!....and how do you break a pipe??
Mark
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Misato
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 10:12 pm: |
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yeah, I didn't get any either.
hope I did it right.. |
Richieg150
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 10:40 pm: |
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I have two fellow Buellers who just bought Force XB pipes,guess what-------no installation instructions either!HHMMMMMMMMM,kinda hard to install it correctly without instruction huh?I failed to ask them if any paper work came with their exhaust,like the warranty or disclaimer due to improper installation.The pipes I saw break were broken next to that fine looking weld at the megaphone.The older Force pipes broke sometimes at the front mount.They redesigned the front mount quite well and it fixed that point of breakage.I had a person who builds exhausts tell me,that they all will eventually fail on the Buells,but it usually takes quite awhile----not several hundred miles like I have seen on a Force. |
Dynarider
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 10:50 pm: |
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Personally I think Scot was employing some politics last week. You know that if he said "that damn pipe broke on me, what a pile of junk" that it would hit the web real fast & then Ole Johnny Force would get all pissed off. So instead he says "I purposely tightened the piss outta everything just like the folks at home will do". Maybe it actually does have everything to with the proper mounting? Maybe the constant wheelies hurt the pipe? Maybe Scots was a fluke? maybe they are all junk?
Either way we have no real way of telling outside of what Scots own feelings are about the pipe. If he says its a good pipe & just needs to be mounted properly & then there will be no problems..I would love to believe him.
Personally I have heard far to many people bitch about pipes breaking & Forces attitude when confronted with it.
BTW last week the loudest Buell was Scots for awhile until the guy showed up on the X1 with the race pipe & the hollowed Vance & Hines muffler...that bitch actually hurt my ears . |
Keef
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 11:06 pm: |
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I bought a Force exhaust for my sportster and it broke in about 1000 miles and was told no warranty because it looked like it was run over where the oval part of the megaphone mated the two pipes, well gee, it had to be oval to get the two pipes to fit the rear half of the pipe where it went into the megaphone..also there was no instructions with my exhaust either ,you mean it is supposed to include instructions I figured you just had to "naturally" know how to install it correctly.I posted the whole sordid story of my experience with the Force people on the quick board several months ago.... |
Richieg150
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 11:07 pm: |
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Dyna, politics may have been involved,I never gave that a thought.If the Force exhausts are breaking,then why are guys still buying them knowing what they may be getting in too?I myself if I didnt know better would plead ignorance,if I did know better I would think it wont happen to me!Then if it did happen to me all I could say is $#@%&*% pipe!By the way Dyna---I didnt think you were an asshole!Remember your introduction? |
Keef
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2003 - 11:13 pm: |
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Richie
That's right I remember now it WAS dyna who claimed he was a spinxter muscle but hey we can all be that way at one time or another..Rich like the time you ..oh well never mind shouldn't talk about family right little brother |
Englishman119
| | Posted on Thursday, August 28, 2003 - 01:53 pm: |
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Any consensus on which ECM should be used, the standard version or the Race kit one ?
Also, anyone had any ground clearance problems with the pipe on the left hand side ? It looks like it sticks out and expands at a point that might catch the ground when your riding on the edge to the tire ?
Mark
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Glitch
| | Posted on Thursday, August 28, 2003 - 01:57 pm: |
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I can't find it now, but I believe Aaron said the standard ECM works and the RACE USE ONLY ECM runs poorly. |
Daves
| | Posted on Thursday, August 28, 2003 - 02:06 pm: |
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If you have the Nallin set up with the PC you run the stock ECM.
I have not put mine on yet, no time before going to the track this weekend. I am sure that I will grind the end of the pipe off starting in the first left hand turn. For street riding they should be fine and they do sound GREAT! No other combo I've heard of makes as much power. Now if they could just make them so they don't poke out so far on the left side for guys that want to go to the track.
Ride to the edge!
Dave |
Gonen60
| | Posted on Thursday, August 28, 2003 - 02:53 pm: |
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Buell race kit sounds better and better..LOL |
Misato
| | Posted on Thursday, August 28, 2003 - 04:30 pm: |
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I'm getting mine dyno'd on the 18th of sept. |
Usapitbullz
| | Posted on Sunday, September 07, 2003 - 04:19 pm: |
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I really hope the left side of the megaphone doesn't grind off while on the track. I will not be a happy camper. |
Shazam
| | Posted on Monday, September 08, 2003 - 01:08 pm: |
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Joe, you are going to want to remove your curb feelers from your pegs also, if you don't like that "scratched up" look. mine are horribly flat on the end.....then again, you may not have that problem! hahahaa |
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