| Author |
Message |
    
Jaimec
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 11:05 am: | 
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I disagree. Slowing down is slowing down, whether you're using the engine or the brakes.
And I'm not talking about downshift/engine braking which beats the hell out of the transmission, I'm just talking about throttle roll-off engine braking.
If you don't want to slow down that much, then don't roll the throttle off that much. Simple. When I roll off the throttle, I want to feel the bike SLOW, I don't want a bicycle/free-wheel/coasting sensation; that's just unnerving (I still remember that from riding a few two strokes in my time). |
Pattio
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 11:35 am: |
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Do the injectors really 'go to zero' and put out no fuel at all when we close our throttles, or do they continue to produce a computer-controlled minimum output of some kind? Is closing the twistgrip really 'turning off' the injectors? |
Jaimec
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 11:48 am: |
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I don't know how the Buell injectors are programmed. I know the Bosch injectors on the BMW bikes shut off the fuel when rolling off the throttle above "walking speeds" to conserve fuel. Naturally, when the rpms drop too low they'll start feeding fuel again to avoid having the engine stall.
I remember when I got my first K bike chopping the throttle felt like applying the rear brake really hard (but not hard enough to lock the rear wheel). It took me a bit to get used to it and smoothly roll the throttle on and off, but I quickly learned to take advantage of that feature. Used to drive my riding buddies NUTS because they'd rarely see my brake lights come on when setting up for a turn.
Because my K1200LT carries so much more mass than my old K100 the sensation isn't as "extreme" but it's definitely still there.
Again, not sure of the 1125R, but the XB "seemed" to feed a little fuel during deceleration to minimize that "rear brake" effect and it took me a few rides to adjust to that. If the Erik Buell Racing ECM feels like the old XB, then I don't have a problem with it, but it's stated above that with the Erik Buell Racing ECM there is NO ENGINE BRAKING and with that, I have a problem. |
Dirty_john
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 12:54 pm: |
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I happen to like the Erik Buell Racing race ECM on my 09 1125R, I learnt to ride bikes back in the eighties with Yamaha two strokes so no engine braking is not a problem to me, I find that it actually makes the bike more stable entering a corner, the race ECM on my XB12R acted in the same way. |
_gdkp_
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 03:30 pm: |
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hi guys,
thanks for you many posts,
i really think about to buy a preprogrammed ECM too - are there any problems if i would change it back to the original (cause i have guarantee @ the moment ..)
Thanks |
Daggar
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 03:36 pm: |
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I've got a little over 100 miles on my Erik Buell Racing ECM with the stock exhaust and a K&N air filter. I love it. I never did much engine braking with the old ECM, so the lack of it doesn't bother me. It's crazy how much cooler my bike runs. I have noticed that, with the heated grips on, the voltage drops faster and lower than it did with the old ECM. Dropped to 11.7 volts this morning, at a stop light. Goes back to the mid 12s when I got moving again though and back into the 13s if I switch them off. |
Badlionsfan
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 04:51 pm: |
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The reason engine braking is bad as told to me by my lee parks total control instructor is it's not linear braking. If engine braking was a good thing, slipper clutches wouldn't be out there. |
Fresnobuell
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 05:59 pm: |
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To me engine braking unbalances the chassis, often at inopportune times. |
Jaimec
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 07:03 pm: |
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Slipper clutches are for people who are sloppy with downshifting. It does take practice matching engine speed to road speed during a downshift, and if you don't get it right every time it can cost you serious time on the track, if not a potential highside. As a street rider I don't have those concerns.
As I DON'T ride at 100% on the street I have plenty of time to play with the throttle by rolling it on and off to regulate my speed setting up for corners.
To STOP, I use the brakes, but for modulating speed on winding pavement it's easy enough to just roll the throttle smoothly on and off. No clutching or shifting involved.
You'd have to take C.L.A.S.S. with Reg Pridmore to see what I'm talking about. Unfortunately, he currently doesn't visit as many tracks as he used to. I think VIR and Mid Ohio are as far east as he comes nowadays. I took C.L.A.S.S. several times at Pocono East and once at Watkins Glen.
Saying that, however, I will say I think I got a lot more out of Keith Code's California Superbike School... but Pridmore's stressing of SMOOTHNESS of control application has been an invaluable lesson for street riding for me. |
Dannybuell
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2010 - 08:41 pm: |
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Fresnobuell - " unbalances the chassis.."
I could be a lousy rider but this has happened a lot of times over the years on my stiffly sprung S1, I just pull in the clutch. It has happened in the CR but not nearly as much.
My riding experience has led me to many bikes over the years all twins. The last three had beefed up suspensions. The last two I still have my 96K mile S1 and the CR with almost 2K miles. There are a few things that happen to me as I am picking a line for a turn. I lean and control turn rate using arm pressure on the inside bar to establish and maintain my line. If my timing is a bit off or something in the road and I need to turn in sooner letting off the throttle places the engine's torque onto the front wheel. This additional pressure on the tire makes the bike turn in more. Lots of turn in tricks, just one of them. |
Fresnobuell
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 26, 2010 - 05:37 pm: |
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If my timing is a bit off or something in the road and I need to turn in sooner letting off the throttle places the engine's torque onto the front wheel
Close to the limit and this will cause a lowside. Just be careful. Trail braking is the preferred method to accomplish the quicker turn in you describe. Engine braking is *edit* not nearly as predictable or linear (as I read earlier +1!) as using your front brake. Trail braking is an advanced riding technique and one I use usually only when I make a mistake (ie go into a corner hot) and am forced to trail brake or run wide--so I don't profess to be some expert on the subject.
My 2 cents.
(Message edited by fresnobuell on May 27, 2010) |
Dirty_john
| | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2010 - 02:01 am: |
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"To me engine braking unbalances the chassis, often at inopportune times"
Couldn't agree more - 100% correct and if you can't change down the gearbox properly you should be worrying about the longevity of the internals.
I've been trail braking since the mid 1970s when suspension was so poor you used the front brake to control the fork rebound, only way to ride two strokes fast in those days.
Fresnobuell makes sense, especially his warning about low siding.
I am not an expert but trail braking in dry weather can be carried through to the apex and best from starting braking when in a straight line, this prevents the bike standing up when commencing braking in a turn (poor riding).
The Race ECM allows this riding style to be used without the back end chattering and in my opinion is an excellent bit of kit.
I dont trail brake all the time, only when I need to scrub off a bid more speed.
My track bike is a 2000 GSXR SRAD with carbs, to get the same effect on that bike I had to increase the idle speed a bit.
(Message edited by Dirty_john on May 27, 2010)
(Message edited by Dirty_john on May 27, 2010) |
Syonyk
| | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2010 - 01:12 pm: |
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Hm...
Stock 08, just got paid, thinking of ordering the ECU...
I'm just commuting/weekend touring, though - is it still worth it? |
Daggar
| | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2010 - 01:44 pm: |
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Well worth it. I use my bike for commuting/weekend touring as well. |
Froggy
| | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2010 - 01:45 pm: |
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quote:I'm just commuting/weekend touring, though - is it still worth it?
Frak yea  |
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