| Author | Message | ||
     Old_dog |
Looking for some ideas from the experts here. I have a '04 XB12R with about 11,000 miles. Bike runs great, and starts without a hitch when cold. But once it's warm, unless it has substantially cooled down, the restart is bad. As I crank it, the motor turns over fine until it has almost started, then I hear/feel a nasty "clank-bang" coming from the starter housing and the starter disengages (but continues to spin until I let off the start button). This "event" happens usually once or twice, then the bike starts normally. It's as if the motor fires a cylinder but fails to start, then turns back against the starter, causing the ugly disengagement of the starter gear. Makes me very afraid I'm gonna break something if this keeps up. I've read advice (maybe on here) that on a warm restart, if you turn on the key and let the bike sit for 45 sec or a minute, the ignition ticks the plugs to burn any fuel sitting in the cylinders from the prior shutdown. I've tried this and it seems like maybe it works, a little bit, sorta. Anybody seen this? Had this happen? Know what to do? | ||
| Etennuly |
I would look for an intake leak first, then clean throttle plate and do a TPS reset. Check for the little vacuum port cap on the rt side of the throttle housing, those sometimes blow off from a backfire. | ||
| Thatman |
Sounds like a starter problem to me. | ||
| Buelldyno_guy |
If at 11K the intake seals have never been replaced, most likely they need it. When cold it is starting on the warm-up fuel map. When hot that extra fuel is not there, so it cranks harder. I also agree something else might be broken in the starter. Terry | ||
| Bobbuell1961 |
Sound like the starter clutch is starting to go but hard to tell without hearing it,if it is i would check the timing when repaired as this can work the starter harder | ||
| Hogs |
Where can one buy Better quality Intake Seals at? | ||
| Buelldyno_guy |
HD will never tell, but I would bet these are Viton fluorcarbon and are pretty good seals. It's more about the cylinder, head design and how HD want's then installed! As this steep angle V Twin heats up the cylinders grow taller as well as larger in dia. Since the heads sit on top of these growing cylinders they move further apart. The intake manifold connects the two moving heads using a slip joint that H-D wants installed dry. So if you leave the bike sit too long (months) the seals get stuck in one place on the manifold and can no longer float as designed. The fix is easy, use a little seal glide on all mating parts, manifold, heads and flanges as well as a thin coat on the seal it's self. When the flanges are torqued you should be able to get TB or carb to float, until you tighten the side mount screw. If done something like this using a seal lube think of every 7-10k miles and or 12-18 months and a little less often if you ride it all the time, they don't seem to get stuck as much Hope this helped. Terry | ||
| Bumblebee |
s I crank it, the motor turns over fine until it has almost started, then I hear/feel a nasty "clank-bang" coming from the starter housing and the starter disengages (but continues to spin until I let off the start button). This "event" happens usually once or twice, then the bike starts normally. It's as if the motor fires a cylinder but fails to start, then turns back against the starter, causing the ugly disengagement of the starter gear. Makes me very afraid I'm gonna break something if this keeps up. These sounds have been heard here before. It's the starter drive failing. Once replaced all will return to normal | ||
| Mmcn49 |
Thanks for the explanation Buelldyno_guy. | ||
| Old_dog |
Bumblebee, I've had several people who have heard it in person say what you've said - it's starter-related. Only one unanswered question with that analysis: why would the starter only demonstrate this when warm? The mixture-related thoughts like intake gaskets, TPS, Intake Air Temp, all seem to explain why there are cold/warm differences. This thing starts so consistently when cold, with no weird starter behavior at all. Thoughts? (Message edited by OLD_DOG on January 31, 2010) | ||
| Ourdee |
Please, correct me if i'm wrong. A warm starter will flow less electricity and not crank as fast and with as much torque. | ||
| Aptbldr |
When the starter switch is pushed, the starter relay is activated and battery current flows into the pull-in winding (10) and the hold-in winding (11), to ground. The magnetic forces of the pull-in and hold-in windings in the solenoid push the plunger (7) causing it to shift to the left. This action engages the pinion gear (1) with the clutch ring gear (13). At the same time, the main solenoid contacts (8) are closed, so battery current flows directly through the field windings (3) to the armature (4) and to ground. Simultaneously, the pull-in winding (10) is shorted. The current continues flowing through the hold-in winding (11) keeping the main solenoid contacts (8) closed. At this point, the starter begins to crank the engine. After the engine has started, the pinion gear (1) turns freely on the pinion shaft through the action of the overrunning clutch (12). The overrunning clutch prevents the clutch ring gear (13) (which is now rotating under power from the engine)from turning the armature (4) too fast. When the starter switch is released, the current of the hold-in winding (11) is fed through the main solenoid contacts (8) and the direction of the current in the pull-in winding (10) is reversed. The solenoid plunger (7) is returned to its original position by the return spring, which causes the pinion gear (1)to disengage from the clutch ring gear (13). - 05 XB Service Manual |
