| Author | Message | ||
     Lornce |
Before I reinvent the wheel... Can anyone direct me to a shop that has experience repairing spun outboard drive side bearings in PM wheels. I'm guessing it'll be a simple (or not so simple, depending on the shop...) bushing shrink install.... If I had my own lathe blah blah blah.... Mosport's only four days away.... best, Lornce | ||
| Jim_witt |
Had the same problem way back in 98. Someone HERE suggested I have the hub knurled (if I recall correctly) and different bearing pressed in. They said they've done it before. It's probably not in the archives anylonger. Anywho ... Buell ended up fixing mine but it took 5 months. -JW:>  | ||
| Lornce |
Thanks for the thought Jim. Unfortunately, knurling's a temporary solution at best. Spoke with a fellow Southern Ontario Bueller, who also happens to be a mold maker.... I'll be taking the wheel down to his shop in the morning.... Think we'll have it licked with a shrunk fit sleeve in time for the weekend at Mosport! Again, Jim, thanks for your input. best, Lornce | ||
| Blake |
Is there such a thing as oversize bearings that would more easily solve your problem? If not, the shrink fit sleeve sounds like a viable and simple solution. Let us know how things turn out. And let us know how many Beemers you lap at Mosport.  | ||
| Josh_ |
Lornce, please keep us posted as I haven't seen a viable solution posted other than replacing the wheel. Josh 99S3T w/ 46,000mi on my PMs. | ||
| Jim_witt |
Pretty weird, When I went through my wheel bearing ordeal, eveyone here told me knurling was totally the way to go. -JW:> | ||
| S2pengy |
A Friend had the shunk fit sleeve done a couple years back on his S2t with no problems since.... It is done alot on Commercial Aircraft..... | ||
| Lornce |
Thanks for the input and encouragement guys. Went down to Brian Sparr's mold making shop in Mississauga Ontario this morning and we knocked out the old bearings to better see the damage. Both drive side bearings were spun in their bores, leaving the bores over size 0.018". Checked with a local bearing supply house and the only oversize units they had available with the correct I.D. were too wide and too large in O.D. Bought three new bearings in the original size and went back to the sleeve angle.... I wanted a steel sleeve shrunk fit with 0.0025" of interference on the O.D. and 0.0005" interference for the I.D.'s fit on the bearing's outer races. Brian wanted to fit an aluminum sleeve. Brian's doing the job, so I deferred to his judgement. Being a tradesman myself, I know the long term benefit of this... If it remains in service for years to come, I'll take my hat off to him. If it fails.... THEN we'll do it my way. Brian's a good guy and loves to ride the wheels off his own 85" Sputhe motored S1. Not sure if he's interested in further bike related custom machine work, (my guess is: yes) but it may be worth calling him. He'd love to chat bikes with you anyway.... (416)258-0631 Oh yea, his 71 year old father, also a master mold maker.... Rides his own S3 Thunderbolt! Anyhow, again, thanks for the input and I'll let you know how it works out when I see the wheel tomorrow. Annnnd... I'll let ya know how the Ducati and BMW spanking goes at Mosport this weekend! Ride FAST and take chances! Lornce | ||
| Blake |
Seems to me that knurling would work fine too Jim. | ||
| Lornce |
Knurling, as you prolly know, simply displaces material to create high points upon which to support the bearing. The total surface contact area... of relatively soft aluminum material... supporting the bearing is limited and leaves the supporting material undermined. To my mind.... if the bearing can spin in a total contact surface situation... the original arrangement.... It's not going to last long on a knurled contact surface. It *may* get you down the road, but it's not an ideal, long term high load fix. Once repaired the OD undersize exhaust guides in a poorly overhauled mercedes deisel by knurling the OD's of the guides.... Worked fine in that app.... The drive belt side rear wheel bearings of our Buells are subject to vastly different loading.... No disrespect meant Jim or Blake, but I won't knurl a wheel bearing bore. It's not good engineering. best, Lornce | ||
| Blake |
Stresses on sides of wheel hub's bearing cup are quite low. Your wheel's cup diameter was probably over spec to begin with and when aluminum heats up... A sleeve is preferable though. I agree. Seems easier to do too. Win-win.  | ||
| Lornce |
The results: Brian Sparr fitted an aluminum sleeve made of much harder aluminum than the PM wheel hub itself. Think he said it's 7071, but I'll check with him to be sure. It's concentric to within 0.0002". Think that orta do.... Blake, the side (thrust) loading on the wheel bearing's outer race land, inner race land and bearing balls and races themselves is quite large when bumps are encountered while leaned over on a motorcycle. Add to that the side (thrust) loading when accelerating hard (at low bearing speeds).... Out of bumpy bends.... And the forces become substantial. Knurling is NOT at all the way to solve this issue. To be honest, I'm a little skeptical about the integrity of the aluminum sleeve.... Brian says "Relax, it's more than tough enough." He's built plenty of high performance one off specials and race bikes.... And I want to believe him.... Time and miles will tell.... best, Lornce | ||
| Easy_rider |
Lornce, It looks like it's been a year since your rear wheel repair. How did the bushing hold up. It looks I need to do the same thing or find a new PM. | ||
| Lornce |
Easy, To make a long story short.... the aluminum sleeve failed within 200 yards just riding around the pits.... Shrunk fit properly, it may have held up.... However, it was simply fitted size for size and tig welded in place.... The welds broke almost immediately. So we did it MY way with a steele sleeve shrunk fit with 0.006" interference on the O.D. It's still in the wheel over a year later having seen lots of hard miles on and off the track. Think it can safely be called a successful fix. Thanks to Brian Sparr for all his help getting it sorted out. His # is (416)258-0631. best, Lornce | ||
| Easy_rider |
A neighbor of mine runs Fabricated Steel in Indy. He put a sleeve in for me. Just got it in tonight but it feels solid! Don't think I'm going to be at work tomorrow.... The left side bearing didn't fall in, but it didn't need pressed in, either. He had some bearing adhesive that he was confident would do the trick. 20-20 hindsight tells me I should have sleeved both sides. Thanks for the guidance, Lornce! |
