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Averagejoe
| | Posted on Saturday, November 07, 2009 - 04:21 pm: | 
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I like 15w40 myself,  but thats bull about 20w50 for older engines and tractors, have been running either 15w40 or 20w50 in all my sportbikes since 92 and never had an engine problem, only reason nothing uses thick oil now, is gas mileage, thats it!
(Message edited by AverageJoe on November 07, 2009) |
Redbuelljunkie
| | Posted on Saturday, November 07, 2009 - 08:17 pm: |
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20W-50 oil is for old engines or Tractors.
Wrong. 20W-50 weight oil is for use in any engine designed for it. Oil weight choice is primarily a function of ambient temperature extremes for the area where the engine is to be operated. In colder climates, the lower the winter number (W) due to lower viscosity due to temperature, and higher in warmer climates. The operating weight is the second number, and reflects the viscosity of the oil at operating temperature.
Therefore, a 20W-50 oil flows like a 20 weight at it's lowest maximum temperature and is 50 weight at operating temperature. As you can see, unless you are riding in extremely cold climates (below zero F) it really doesn't matter if it's 0W, 10W, 15W, or 20W- during operation they're all a 50 weight oil.
In warm states like Florida, dealerships usually use 20W oil in bulk, even if their products call for 10W or 15W- you're never going to see the minimum temperature, it's the second number that counts. The operating weight of an oil is a function of engine design- tolerances, flow characteristics, heat, and a myriad of other technical specifics. It is important to not stray too far from manufacturer's suggested viscosity for oil at operating temps. |
Redbuelljunkie
| | Posted on Saturday, November 07, 2009 - 08:49 pm: |
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Generalization that is not based on fact, at least not at this dealership.
Generalization based on facts from my experience- and many, many other people I've talked to. But being a generalization, it does not purport to include all H-D dealerships. For example, Gainesville Buell/H-D is a refreshing exception to the typical H-D dealer pretentiousness.
I have owned products from the following manufacturers: Aprilia, Buell, Ducati, Harley-Davidson, Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, Triumph, and Yamaha, and have had maintenance performed at multiple dealerships for each. Over the course of 25 motorcycles, I have had three experiences where the dealer's service department has informed me that using any oil other than the one with the manufacturer's name on it would void my warranty. In all three cases it was a Harley-Davidson dealership. It's just a symptom of the arrogant attitude displayed at many H-D dealerships that so many motorcyclists find distasteful. |
Moosestang
| | Posted on Saturday, November 07, 2009 - 08:58 pm: |
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Man there is some good info and bad info in this thread!
Redbuelljunkie, how much is that Amsoil you be slinging? I want to see what all the fuss is about.
+1000 for the gas mileage dictating oil viscosity!
(Message edited by moosestang on November 07, 2009) |
Stevering
| | Posted on Saturday, November 07, 2009 - 09:02 pm: |
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Ain't it great that some dealerships assume that riders are too stupid to read? National warranty laws basically state that the DEALER has to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that ANY modification to a vehicle was the cause of a failure. This includes motor oil.
The API has standard ratings for various engine oils. If the oil maker adheres to the standard needed for th application, the name on it DOES NOT MEAN SHIT! So, to the arrogant ass HD dealers who don't know any better FO! My fav oil is AMS Oil, syn. I use it in my Bandit 600. No probs. When I go for the first service on the CR, I'm taking the AMS Oil with me and I will make sure they use it! |
Hogluvr
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 10, 2009 - 05:58 pm: |
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OK, last and final question (for now): 
Would you guys change the oil on a bike with 14 miles for winter storage, or let it sit as-is and change it when it's broken-in next Spring? |
Averagejoe
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 10, 2009 - 08:39 pm: |
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Hmmm 14 miles, thats tuff, not enough to do any break in, but no way I would let break in oil sit around for the winter. Cause it has so much metal and assy lube etc in it. But I would say with 14 let it sit, no different than it sitting on the showroom floor thru the winter. My bike was built in sep 08 and I just bought it so it sat for over a year with the original oil it it, sure it will be fine. |
Hogluvr
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 10, 2009 - 09:39 pm: |
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Yeah, mine has a MAR 08 build date so it's been sitting at the dealership a while as well, I'm just wondering if 14 miles is enough to put contaminants in it to the point where they would be harmful left sitting? I'm with you on the fact if it had a couple hundred or so, I wouldn't even think twice about it... |
Swamp2
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 10, 2009 - 10:03 pm: |
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Well, you can spend $7 on some cheap dino 20W-50 from your local auto parts store and not waste your emotional energy pondering it anymore... But with that said, I personally would not worry about it. |
Averagejoe
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 11, 2009 - 08:09 am: |
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Yep like swamp2 said got by 3 qts of castrol or kendall just drain the oil and refill with 2.5 qts and break in in the spring and change again. Cost ya all of 7-10 bucks |
Hogluvr
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 11, 2009 - 10:08 am: |
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I'm not worried about the cost, more concerned by some of the confusion this thread is causing. I've heard yes and no to possibly voiding my warranty by changing the oil myself, although it seems to be leaning more to "no" as long as I document it. Since the two closest dealers to me seem to have dropped Buell entirely, looks like my dealer of choice is now Western Reserve, a quick call to them should clear up the warranty question. I've also seen that these bikes leave the factory with both semi-synthetic and dino oil, still not sure which one is correct. I DO know from past lives that I've NEVER heard of breaking in a new motor with synthetic, but what do I know, I'm old and maybe technology has changed? Like I said cost isn't so much of an object, I'll even break down and buy the stealership dino oil if it makes them happy, just want to treat this baby right!  |
Dentguy
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 11, 2009 - 10:32 am: |
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Would you guys change the oil on a bike with 14 miles for winter storage
Hogluvr,
How were the 14 miles ridden?
Will it be below freezing temps over the winter where it is stored?
How was it treated meaning numerous start ups and shut offs before you got it or since you've gotten it? Probably don't know that answer about before you got it.
What I'm getting at is.....If it has collected moisture (from condensation) in the oil from short runs, start ups etc...You don't want to let that stuff sit all winter. Especially if it's below freezing. Oil is cheap enough. I would just change it or take it for a long ride to let any moisture that may be in there breathe out. But that's just me.
(Message edited by dentguy on November 11, 2009) |
Hogluvr
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 11, 2009 - 10:46 am: |
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The 14 miles were on it before I got my hands on it, it had 8 miles on it when I looked at it, then I'm assuming a tech took it out for the other 6 when I called and asked them to make sure all recalls and flashes were done prior to me picking it up. It went 200 miles on a trailer, does that count?
I started it up once since I've had it, tried to ride it across the lawn to get it into the garage when I got it off the trailer, the thing just spun the back tire in the wet grass, so I had to push it. So I guess my answer is I have no idea how those 14 miles were put on, fast, slow, who knows? What I do know is that it will sit in a heated garage over the winter with my other babies, so freezing isn't an issue. I'd PREFER just to change the oil out and be done with it, if I could get a SOLID answer to the two questions I put out there, lots of conflicting answers and opinions... |
Redbuelljunkie
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 11, 2009 - 12:14 pm: |
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There should be no confusion- the answers are simple and straightforward.
You will not void your warranty if you do your own maintenance. You must use oil that meets the specifications of the manufacturer, you should follow the service procedure per the manual, and you should document your work. If you do the above it is against Federal Law for a manufacturer to claim non-dealer service will void a warranty.
It really doesn't matter what oil is in your bike now- it's a good idea to change it before storage (you don't know its history), and there's no reason to use synthetic, especially if you have any concerns about it.
Buy some quality, inexpensive mineral oil, change it, document it, then store it. This really is not that big of a deal- it appears you already know what you want to do- just do it.
And one last thing... enjoy the hell out of it next spring!
(Message edited by redbuelljunkie on November 11, 2009) |
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