| Author | Message | ||
     Jaimec |
I agree. I don't think there's any way Ben can pull a "Bayliss" but it would be cool to see where he ends up in Valencia! | ||
| Vagelis46 |
Haga is not a champion. I think there is a psychological problem, when he is under pressure. Look at Spies in race 1, he was like Superman, no way he would loose the championship. Remember Bayliss ?? Would he loose like Haga did, if he was in his place ?? Haga was 14th at superpole, the last Ducati. Thats is stupid and unacceptable for a factory rider going for the title. Then he rode a stupid race 1, pushed too hard too soon and it was obvious he would crash. He blew it again this year. Haga will never get a championship and Ducati knows that already. Fabrizio looks better than Haga at the moment and he is a nice person. Fabrizio stayed behind Haga in race 1 and this ruined his race. In race 2 he did the right thing, and won the race. Ducati will loose the title next year too. Cal looks good on the R1 ! | ||
| Jaimec |
Haga is a class act. Both he and Ben had their share of bad luck. Next year will be interesting... with Ben gone... who can challenge Nitro Noriyuki? | ||
| Backcountryme |
Haga is a great rider. And on top of that he is a good person. He is deserving of a championship, and he will get on. Ben is likewise a great rider. He won the championship by riding hard. I am glad that this year didn't come down to team orders. I still feel that there is no place for team orders in motorsports. Both men are class acts. As for Fabrizio, I think that he did the right thing and took the win when he could get it. Motorsports in all levels should be about who had the right setup and the right mental attitude for that day. Not who snadbags and lets someone by. That is not racing, that is pro-wrestling. | ||
| Blake |
I agree about Haga being a class act and a great rider. I just don't see him as a champion, meaning winning the championship. Matt, your commentary just seems to always be biased one way, and I can't help but get a dig in when, accurate or no, I sense it. | ||
| Smoke |
how many WSB rookies earned the results that Ben Spies accomplished in his first year in Europe? none! how many regular WSB riders earned similar results as Ben ever? none again! case closed! see ya next year! Good Luck Ben in MotoGp!! tim | ||
| Jaimec |
In one season, Ben is already the 12th winningest rider in the history of World Superbikes. That says everything right there. | ||
| Backcountryme |
It is amazing to me how people throw around nationality. Last time I checked it is hard to tell where a person was born when they have leathers and a helmet on. Ben is a great rider. It doesn't matter where he was born (but being from Texas makes him a badass haha). | ||
| Jaimec |
Wonder if I'll find WSBK anywhere NEAR as interesting as it was this year. Does anyone know if John Hopkins will be back? | ||
| Trojan |
Wonder if I'll find WSBK anywhere NEAR as interesting as it was this year. Does anyone know if John Hopkins will be back? I think that the good thing about WSB is that the field is very close, so next year is already shaping up to be just as exciting as this year was (probably more so without a single rider dominating so much as Spies did this year). Toseland, Crutchlow, Byrne, Guintoli and hopefully Camier will all have top rides in addition to the established WSB regulars from this year, and I think that the bikes will be even more even next year. Roll on March  | ||
| Jaimec |
Just saw an interview with Fabrizio who basically stated that the racing will be a lot closer next year BECAUSE Ben Spies is no longer in the line up. That is some testament to Ben's talent and ability right there. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
I think it is about time to stop "Ben Spies is very talented" statements. I also think that WSBK will be better without Spies, who was in a different league than the other riders. I want Crutchlow to do well next year, he has a lot of future and he shows to be very fast. Britain's next hope ?? | ||
| Rocketman |
Please, let's not forget Spies 'nicked' the championship in the last race when Haga should have nearly walked it. But not for chucking it down the track Haga would be champion. Ok, we could argue otherwise. But it was a two horse season between Spies / Yamaha and Haga / Ducati and not a Spies runaway championship. Taking nothing away from Spies, it was Haga's to lose, and that he did. Perspective please peeps  Rocket | ||
| Jaimec |
Both riders had their share of bad luck, but remember Ben came back from an 88 point deficit. He won 50% of the races, and took the majority of pole positions (setting a record for most consecutive poles, AND most poles in a single season). In one season, he became the 12th winningest rider in the history of World Superbikes. And you're saying we could argue otherwise?? | ||
| Rocketman |
No, I'm saying Haga could have won had he not fallen off. But you could argue otherwise. But why bother? Rocket | ||
| Trojan |
I have to agree with Rocket. Spies was undoubtedly the marvel of the season, but he didn't run away with the championship. The simple fact that the title came down to the very last meeting is proof enough of that. Both riders made mistakes all year and Haga particularly had to battle quite serious injury mid season. It would have been interesting to see both of them fighting for the championship next year too, but alas that was not to be. Haga went to MotoGP and failed to impress, as did Toseland, Corser, Hodgson and even Bayliss to a large extent. The signs are there that Spies will be the exception but it still remains to be seen if he can get amongst the top 4 on a regular basis next year. I hope he can, but don't take it for granted. | ||
| Blake |
Talk about setting the man up for failure. Please name any non-Factory team in the past five years who has put their rider into "the top 4 on a regular basis". | ||
| Jaimec |
Not in the 800 era, anyway. In the 990 era Sete Gibernau and Marco Melandri were regular podium finishers on non-factory bikes. | ||
| Liquorwhere |
No, I'm saying Haga could have won had he not fallen off. But you could argue otherwise. But why bother? If I remember correctly, Spies was 10 points down, if he won both races and Haga finished second then it would be tied, he(spies) was still champion due to the number of wins. So Haga had to finish at least second in the first race..he didn't obviously losing the front end...and then finish ahead of Spies in the second race...he had his shot and didn't get it. I was impressed all year by the way he came back after a vicious crash and multiple injuries, but, I must point out, Ben had TWO DNF's due to mechanical failure....not a rider error, that is 50 points lost to the winner of those races, and considering the list of winners ended I believe with four, Rea, Fabrizio, Spies and Haga those mechanical failures put him closer to Haga in points than if he were to finish anywhere in the top 6. So I would argue that without those two mechanicals, as I don't remember Haga having any DNF's due to mechanical failure, then I would say Spies did in fact dominate. I was as shocked as anyone for a first year guy not knowing the tracks, but the lap times, pole positions, wins and were it not for the bike giving up on him twice....maybe no chance for Haga in Portugal. | ||
| Rocketman |
Thank you for taking up the argument, lol. I didn't really want an argument of course. But thought it only fair to point out how close and not a one horse race it was as the comment above suggested. Now about that argument. It could be said that the R1 this year had a big advantage over the Ducati. But we won't go into that given the restrictions placed on the Italians and not the Japanese. I would add though, Spies was able to capitalise on the R1's prowess which is why in part he was able to master those virgin to him tracks. We could argue had Haga been on the R1 he would have walked it, even with Spies as a team mate!  Rocket | ||
| Blake |
That's just make believe. Only Ben put a Yamaha up front. Plenty of Ducati riders were in the hunt in various races. With Ben Spies, you don't need the absolute best bike. The man finds a way to win. He proved that way back in his AMA Supersport days, being the only racer up until this year in DSB to win on a GSXR600. | ||
| Jaimec |
Rocket, the R1 was in a development phase this year. It was the first time they've run the cross-plane crankshaft in a Superbike. They had SOME data from the YZF-M1 in MotoGP, but that is a VERY different motorcycle in almost every way. The engine in the R1 was as new as the engine in the BMW S1000RR and the Aprilia RSV4. If you look at the races, it was pretty much "Ben and the Ducatis" with Max Biaggi pushing the Aprilia here and there into the party. People seem to forget that the Yamaha was a brand new bike, given to a rider who'd never seen most of the tracks on the circuit, and came off many successful years on a very different Suzuki. | ||
| Liquorwhere |
I would add though, Spies was able to capitalise on the R1's prowess which is why in part he was able to master those virgin to him tracks. We could argue had Haga been on the R1 he would have walked it, even with Spies as a team mate! A fine package for sure on the R1, and maybe if Haga had that package the year before while on the yamaha he may have been able to keep up with Bayliss. Of course the Ducati did get some restrictions add to it in terms of intake I believe, so it was a different bike than what Bayliss had....so...that leaves Tom Sykes...I believe he was a BSB champion wasn't he? Maybe he didn't mesh well with the team, maybe the bike didn't set up for him as well as Ben, it was unfortunate because I know he is faster than that. I for one would love to speculate how well Haga or Spies would have done on the Honda as Rea surely had that bike working toward the end. I still think the Yamaha was down on top end power vs the Ducati and certainly everyone was down on power in the top end vs the Aprilia...that is the wildcard next year, how fast will Max be on that Aprilia.... | ||
| Jaimec |
The R1 was definitely down on power compared to the other bikes. Top-end power was never the point of the cross-plane crankshaft. The idea was the SPREAD of power and on that I think they got it. I also think Ducati ALWAYS had the restrictors. That was part of the agreement of allowing them to run 200cc more displacement than the multis. | ||
| Davegess |
Ben had, what we call in the stick and ball sports, a "career" year. He may never be this good again. Not that he will be bad but he was out of his mind. Winning all those poles at tracks he had NEVER even seen before is simply unmatched. If he hadn't made rookie mistakes in the first few races he may well have run away with it. I can't remember ever seeing anyone have a rookie year like this in motorsports. It reminds of Rayborn winning three of the match races in what '73? on an outdated bike at tracks he had never seen. It seems to me that it was simply an unbelievable feat and may never be repeated. | ||
| Trojan |
Talk about setting the man up for failure. Please name any non-Factory team in the past five years who has put their rider into "the top 4 on a regular basis". Exactly my point. It isn't me that is setting Ben up for failure, but the press and the media hype surrounding him. If you listen to what he says himself then he is very grounded and realistic about his prospects next year, which is exactly what we should be listening to, not press speculation. personally I think he has more chance than anyone so far making the transition from Superbikes to MotoGP, and certainly think that he will be in the top 5 regularly next year. I also think that he will get much more 'factory' assistance than has been previously the case with Tech 3 riders. I also think that Melandri and Simoncelli will be up there on their 'non factory' Hondas too though, so the 'aliens' may have more to think about next season than just fighting each other. 2010 looks like being a classic racing year in all classes, and with Moto2 starting it is certainly a season to look forward to Only Ben put a Yamaha up front. Plenty of Ducati riders were in the hunt in various races. You also have to remember that there were only two R1 Yamahas in WSB this year. The second 'factory' R1 finished 8th in the series even though Tom Sykes is obviously not as talented or experienced as Spies (and missed the last round completely following his high speed crash at the previous race). Sykes is a good rider and it will be interesting to see how he goes next year on a different bike. There were not 'plenty' of Ducatis either, as only two of the Ducs were anywhere near factory spec. The rest were aging privateer bikes that did very well in the hands of Byrne and Smyrz considering how dated they actually were. If you look at the Yamaha R1 record this year in other championships it has pretty much swept the board clean. Leon Camier cantered to teh BSB championship on his, with team mate Ellison in second place, and the same was true in lots of other domestic Superbike championships. It seems to be a bike that you either love or hate, and it is obvious that some riders just can't get the best from it as well as others. | ||
| Jaimec |
Now that Mat has retired from American Superbike it probably also marks the end of Suzuki's domination of that series. | ||
| Rocketman |
I believe the prowess I accredited to the R1 stems from its cross plane crankshaft, which by all accounts made the Yamaha a doddle to ride. Frankly, Spies mother could have won on it. I know my mother could have! Rocket | ||
| Jaimec |
Rocketman: Funny how in damned near every magazine comparison this past year, the Yamaha rated at the BOTTOM. I just don't understand the evaluation process, frankly. But remember, it was considerably DOWN on horsepower compared to the other bikes on the grid, so you actually have to know how to carry corner speed to win on it. That isn't as easy as simply whacking the throttle WFO. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
I see Spies doing better than Pedrosa next year. He looks to be able to handle the pressure and do better than expected. His second half of the race in Valencia was remarkable and a great sign for the future. Spies will win a race next year ! Well done to Yamaha for keeping their top riders, unlike Honda-Suzuki. |
