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Blake
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 06:07 pm: | 
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>>>In the Barber dyno tests there was one bike that was stronger than the competition.
And there was another that was stronger than all the rest.
AMA Supersport machines were making 125 RWHP back around 2004/2005. I saw the dyno of Tommy Hayden's SS machine with my own eyes, 125 RWHP.
The current DSB 600's are permitted the same engine work if not more. You think they are still making the same power as they were in 2004 or 2005?
The Formula Xtreme 600's were reportedly making right at 150 RWHP, which is supported by the fact that they were on the same pace wrt top speed down the straights as the 150 RWHP Buell XBRR.
Facts are pesky things; usually they trump wild guessing and biased opinion. |
Fresnobuell
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 06:18 pm: |
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Fresno, which part of anony's post did you find useful?
All of it. Dunno who posted it, but I sure wish we had more like it. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 07:25 pm: |
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huh? I'm officially confused.
What is the impact of the heavier bike on it's ability to negotiate a corner. If the Buell has better power to weight ratio in the straights, but the additional weight results in SLOWER times in the turns (which appears to be the case from the split times) the net effect is more equal than just the power to weight ratio comparison would indicate. |
Spatten1
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 07:30 pm: |
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What is the impact of the heavier bike on it's ability to negotiate a corner. If the Buell has better power to weight ratio in the straights, but the additional weight results in SLOWER times in the turns (which appears to be the case from the split times) the net effect is more equal than just the power to weight ratio comparison would indicate.
Then how are the Buells passing the 600s in the corners, as mentioned above? |
Crusty
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 07:36 pm: |
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Then how are the Buells passing the 600s in the corners, as mentioned above?
Danny is a damned good rider. |
Ft_bstrd
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 07:52 pm: |
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So extra weight has NO impact in ability to corner.
Interesting.
Never new that was possible. Could low end torque play any roll in the ability to pass someone in the corners? |
Elvis
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 07:55 pm: |
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Remember, going around a turn, F=mv^2/r.
Since the force is being provided by the traction of the spec tires and won't be much higher for one bike over the other, the heavier bike needs to take a longer line around the turn . . . or slow down, or both.
When braking, F=ma ('a' in that case being the negative acceleration). The heavier bike needs a greater force to stop . . . but again, the force is limited by the spec tires, so that means the heavier bike will have less deceleration given the relatively fixed stopping force and, therefore, must start braking earlier.
When the bikes accelerate, F=ma again. The heavier bike needs more force just to match the acceleration of the lighter bike.
Weight is a HUGE factor in racing, but simple minded people fixate on the very simple idea that a larger displacement bike has a "displacement advantage" pay little attention to the WEIGHT ADVANTAGE the 600's have.
If the Buell's - which are forced to be heavier than the 600's by the rules - are even close to hanging with the lighter bikes in the twisty sections, that's a real testament to the engineering of these bikes.
Unfortunately, people like Dean Adams have mouths much larger than their minds. |
Badlionsfan
| | Posted on Friday, August 14, 2009 - 10:04 pm: |
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What Elvis said. |
Diablobrian
| | Posted on Saturday, August 15, 2009 - 01:45 am: |
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It also has something to do with Eslick's intestinal fortitude and willingness to ride
a little closer to the ragged edge.
Cojones and skill. the indian and arrow working as a system. Make your own analogy
if you prefer, but Danny flat gets the most out of his bike or we'd see the podium
full of Buells race after race. Kind of like the Spies Mladin show in Superbike the
previous several years. Sure they are both great riders, but they clearly had far
superior machinery. People got SO excited when Zemke finally got a win at Miller a couple
years back because it had been so long since a non-suzuki won. Remember that? |
Diablobrian
| | Posted on Saturday, August 15, 2009 - 02:01 am: |
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Looks like Knapp may have some of the same magic as Danny, Knapp is on pole. |
Buelldyno_guy
| | Posted on Saturday, August 15, 2009 - 02:20 am: |
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A few years back, we built an AFM F-4 XB at approx 125 at the rear. But it was the 52 inch WB and the 22deg fork angle along with the straight away power that caught everybody's attention. God this thing can turn inside anything on the track is all out rider could say. Being able to take a tight inside line in turn 11 at Infineon, is not the same as getting the same bike to change directions at speed in the esses 8 and 8a. The 1125's didn't fit that track as well as they did others. Terry |
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