| Author | Message | ||
     T_man |
Does anyone know exactly why the tach needle will flutter (rapidly) at high RPM on (some)1125's? Mine does this; I'm trying to find out if this happens to many others, if its harmful and lastly if it can be fixed. Thanks! | ||
| Ponti1 |
I don't have a problem with flutter, but I do remember someone posting the same problem. If I recall, their fix was to add rubber washers at the mount points of the instrument cluster, to help dampen the vibrations that caused the flutter. I bet you can find it with a search... | ||
| T_man |
If thats the case I am not worried at all; however I heard from another source that it is related to a fueling or spark problem - which has raised my concern levels considerably. If I can determine for certain it can be quelled via dampning the cluster I'll sleep better! | ||
| Ponti1 |
Yeah, I have heard of the vibration, but not anything like the spark/fueling problem. Here 's one of the threads talking about adding a little cushion to the IC: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/290 431/458663.html | ||
| Badlionsfan |
Where did you hear that fuel or spark caused it, that's a new one. | ||
| T_man |
I had a brief discussion with another badwebber on the topic in this thread: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/290 431/482999.html?1249041080 I'm hoping its a simple cluster vibration problem but after that post I am wary of a larger fix than a simple dampening mod. Anyone else have the definite answer? | ||
| Xbswede |
The only needle shake I have seen is the in 3k-4k as shown in Ponti1's posted link. | ||
| Ponti1 |
I don't see Clarkjw's comment backed up by anything. It doesn't even make sense to me. Vibration seems WAY more realistic, though less than optimal spark/fueling could definitely contribute to vibration. Perhaps that's all he meant? | ||
| Pariah |
I'm not often running my engine near redline, but what I do recall of trackdays when I happen to glance down at the tach is that the needle will vibrate approaching redline. And this is beyond about 8500 RPM, if I recall. Clarkjw is referring to a digital video of Ken Hill. Factors like the frame rate, resolution and compression of that video capture will drastically affect the quality. I don't see how it is a reliable way to conclude that the needle shouldn't vibrate. Who knows what kind of filtering or aliasing is going on. Maybe Ken Hill could chime in. So I don't know. I guess you could have your bike dyno'd. If fueling or ignition is a problem, it should show up... the dyno curve would not look normal... maybe this is the only conclusive way to verify that your engine is operating as it should, other than Anony posting here. | ||
| Blake |
The tach needle flutters when the big Helicon is near climax. Sheesh. Seriously though, if the bike is running strong, chalk it up to good vibes. | ||
| T_man |
Thanks for the input guys - I really wasn't worried about it until the possibility of erroneous spark/fueling became apparent. I'll be taking it to the drag strip next friday - I should be able to determine if there is power loss in the upper Rpm range after 5 or more runs. Earlier I did notice a hesitation when pulling through 140mph - maybe its related, anyways; Thanks again! | ||
| Smoke |
140 in 4th or 5th? tim | ||
| T_man |
5th. At about 8.5k the needle starts to blur and the power 'seems' to taper off (or maybe just flatten out) a bit. It doesn't pull through 140mph like an 1125cc bike should (in my opinion). I'm well aware this bike isn't in the same ballpark for power as a liter bike - but I swear my TL1000S pulled harder up top. | ||
| Ccryder |
Vibrating tach needle has nothing to do with power falling off. Prove me wrong, I double dog dare you!!! Show me the charts and graphs and normally distributed data to support you allegations or................. just go ride and have fun. It sure is a lot better than yanking on this BS thread. I'm going for another ride, 2nd today and, I rarely look at the tach anyway. Color me GOOOOONE!!!!!!!!!!! | ||
| T_man |
Duuude! I'm just trying to make sure something isn't wrong with my bike - cross referencing with others to ensure mine is running as strong as it was designed to. Fun is a subjective experience and my definition includes putting down as many ponies onto the blacktop as possible. I dunno about the rest of you but I have high hopes for this new rotax engine! | ||
| Ccryder |
T_man, just use some common sense!!! Being a "pre-wings" you should know what your instruments are telling you or what they can tell you. Look at the system you are questioning (the tach) and try and understand that it is just a device that reads pulses produced by the ignition system and represents them as rpm's. That's it! It does not measure power. If you think these electronic systems are a little iffy, you probably don't remember the cable driven systems. Anyway, the tach is a delicately balanced instrument that can be effected by vibration and other external factors. I don't know if this tach is servo driven or magnetically driven, either way they can be affected by many outside factors but, not engine output. The only real way you can determine if your engine is producing the right amount of power at a certain rpm is on a dyno. If your tach needle flutters, well it's a safe bet that it's another issue and not engine performance. Let's get to something really subjective. Does your 1125 vibrate more or less with a full or empty tank? Does it vibrate more or less when it's hot or cold weather? When you roll up 4,000-5,000 miles you will notice that your bike will smooth out. A number of us have noticed this change at this mileage. How about you? One more thing, don't call me Duuude. You can call me CCryder, CCR, "C-C-C-R-R" (can anyone guess what that one stands for?) or Neil. I've been using the CC Ryder handle since the early 70's (well before you took your first breath or cried to say hello to the world, not that it really makes a difference but..) when I first got into CB, that was my "handle". So T_man, what do you want to be called? Later Neil S. | ||
| T_man |
Wow, some of you 'internet riders' are a touchy bunch! Before about a month ago I'd never posted on any type of forum nor wanted to - however with this new bike I figured I could learn a little about some of its quirks and how to make it better. I know my way around a motorcycle, more so the fast very fast ones. I didn't buy this bike to toodle around; I bought this bike to squeeze out some serious performance - I'm not of the 'its got more performance than I could use' crowd. If you can't understand that - thats your issue, not mine. I am not about to take anything personally and frankly any attitude I recieve when I am simply asking honest questions does nothing more than make me laugh. This is a freakin' internet forum - RELAX! I'm on here to make my bike better - thats all - I'm not here to start arguments, jump on bandwagons or join some sort of club. If I can help someone with thier bike, I will - If you don't want to help me - then don't. But for goodness sake don't go trying to belittle someone asking honest questions. | ||
| Pariah |
Hey T_man, I've got a PhD in engineering and one thing I've learned in all my my time in school is that I don't know crap! So, I fully concur with you that your question on this issue is valid. In the history of technology, smaller issues have led to big disasters, so I'm especially concerned with complacency. Why not err on the side of caution? Belittling happens on this forum on occasion, but I think it has to do more with how new someone is to the place... Neil is really a nice guy, but lately we've had a lot of trolls on the forum who've been pissing everybody off. Stick around and you'll find this forum packed with quite useful information. MH | ||
| Ccryder |
I do not know exactly why the tach needle on some 1125's flutter. There could be many contributing factors but none of them can exactly explain the fluttering. I tried to see if mine fluttered six times this morning on my way into work and mine does not flutter/ vibrate. My set up is atypical of most due to modifications in the IC/ fairing/ handlebar region (Convertibars, Throttlemeister, Zumo, Passport 8500 X50, AmpliRider, HID h-ware, PIAA 1100X ) any of these modifications could change/ alter the harmonics of the IC. In addition, at 25,000+ miles the engine could be vibrating differently than yours. I too would be curious how many 1125's have this vibrating tach needle? We could start an informal poll. Maybe we need to know if yours vibrates, how many miles on your bike and if you have done any modifications. This would at least show us the population and frequency of this issue. Time2Work 3C 2R :+) Oh yeah, it sure is FUN playing between 6k and 10.5k!!!!!!! | ||
| Chevycummins |
My original cluster never had the tach vib problem. The second and third ones have. What I found is the original one was a little loosely mounted to the bike, if you grab it you could move it around. The replacement ones seem tighter, they don't move around thus transmitting the vibration from the bike into the cluster causing the fluttering of the tach needle. If I hold onto the cluster while driving at the fluttering RPM the needle smooths out. I think the nuts on the back of the cluster are a little too tight. | ||
| Ccryder |
Michael: That is some good info. DTX's cure was to dampen the IC with some rubber so, that follows in line with what you have observed. I am still curious as to how many 1125 riders have this issue or not and how many miles on the ODO. Probably modifications could be helpful to know too. Time2Work 3C 2R | ||
| T_man |
Thanks for the info guys, I appreciate it. If I discover anything useful and/or different regarding this issue I'll be sure to post it. Oh yeah something unrelated; I almost forgot - I plan on doing some runs at the drag strip this friday and I plan on doing some runs with the inner airbox cover 'on', some with it 'off' - just to see if there is a measurable difference in performance. I'll start a thread with the results if anyone cares to know how it turns out. Taker easy! | ||
| Chevycummins |
Thanks T_man, I'm interested to see if the cover has any effect on performance. My first dyno run was with the cover on and I think I'll see if the dealer can run it again this week since its in for repairs, this time with the cover off. | ||
| Betzy |
Just bought an 08 1125r and it does vibrate when higher than 7-8rpm. Be great to know if there is any fixes or need to have fixes. | ||
| Ccryder |
Nathan: It is not something that needs to be fixed. It is a harmonic vibration issue. It probably can be reduced if not eliminated by changing the vibration frequency of the IC with some foam/ rubber b/t the IC and the fairing. Mine actually vibrated some when it had lower miles but, it has stopped now. Some do, some don't, some quit. How many miles do you have on yours could be one of the factors. Just my $0.02 at 25,555 s'miles. | ||
| Ponti1 |
Neil....I am drooling in jealously over your miles!! In support of your post, I had this vibration for the first 1000-1500 miles, but also have not seen it for a while. | ||
| T_man |
I'm sure glad to hear the majority of people attribute the blurring tach needle to simple vibration. Thats a big relief. I bought my bike as salvage and am pretty sure it only had about 100 miles on it so maybe the vibration will go away as the miles pile up. While on the topic if anyone has had their hands go numb try mounting bar-end mirrors. They quell the vibration and provide a clear view behind. Anyways - great discussion guys! | ||
| Plumpton |
mine vibrates too. just living with it because i dont venture up in to 10000rpm long enough for it to be annoying... | ||
| Ccryder |
I use Throttlemeister heavy bar ends and they really quell the vibes. When my tach is above 6k I hardly look at it at all. Too much is happening too fast to spend any attention on the tach, that's what a rev limiter is for: "SHIFT DUMMY, NOW!!!" | ||
| Zac4mac |
If you have ever used a dead-blow hammer... I put 130 gms of birdshot in a ziplock in each bar. Zero vibes. Z | ||
| Geforce |
If you are worried your vibration is caused by a mis fire or ECM issue, simply take your left index finger and touch the center of the IC and VIOLA! No more shakey needle. | ||
| Ccryder |
Now why didn't I think of that?????????? Thanks for the "common sense" method of investigation! | ||
| Geforce |
 The first time I saw it doing that I did the above method and quickly realized that the next time I take the front clip off i would like to add a rubber washer or two to the IC to maybe help it stabilize a little. The ole finger trick worked well though. | ||
| Zac4mac |
Loretta runs like an IL4 with TORQUE. Just for shits & giggles, I dropped into 2nd while doing 70 mph. 8+ krpm and yes, my needle was buzzing. Usually when I'm at 8k, I'm accelerating to the rev limiter and NOT looking at the tach. I call this a Non-Issue. I have tuned her to the point that low end is almost as strong as an XB, but with a LOT more headroom to the limiter. I am running 2-4 krpm more than 8-10k. In the twisties, I'll be in the 4-7k range usually. But that's me.... Z |
