| Author | Message | ||
     Buuueller |
Same here, but I was on and interstate hwy when mine broke. Jack hammer is a good discription, I thought I had a blowout and was bracing myself to go down. And yes the bolt on the other side was broken. Second time it happened. The bike has been in the garage since Oct and have no desire to repair it. Im totally out on Blasts now. (Message edited by buuueller on February 04, 2009) | ||
| Ezblast |
Want to sell the motor? EZ | ||
| Swampy |
EZ your wife should tell you NO! LOL! | ||
| Ezblast |
Shhhh - maybe she won't notice the extra motor on the work bench;0) EZ | ||
| Grantl |
Hello all, its been a while since I last posted here. My son recently stripped his exhaust pipe flange stud and we had to remove the head to get the stud out. We put the bike back together and it ran fine till today when it blew the head gasket. We ran down to the Harley-Buell dealership and got a new gasket. My question is, what is the recommended head bolt torque for a 2001 Blast? My son is currently unemployed so he can't afford to buy a workshop manual, I apologize upfront for appearing cheap, but I have bikes of my own to upkeep. Any help you can provide will be very appreciated. Cheers, Grant. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
40 ftlbs. Start at 15 ft lbs then go up 5's to 40ft lbs. Start at the bolt just forward of the spark plug. Then the bolt behind the spark plug. Then the front bolt in the middle of the cylinder head, then the rear bolt. All head related bolts have a torque spec and sequence. Sorry, I dont have a scanner or all night to type this up.  | ||
| Swampy |
In the Blast manual there is a specific pattern and torque sequence. Intake side and exhaust side, left and right. I don't remember the pattern but I do remember that the bolts are torqued to 10-15 ft lbs, backed off, then retorqued to 10 or 15 ft lbs, then tightened another 80-90 degrees(no torque value given) I just did this a couple of months ago and remember it vividly other than the torque pattern and torque value. So now you have two conflicting opinions from two internet experts...LOL Now thats funny, I don't care who you are...LOL | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
The torque sequence I described is the best translation I could make from the manual without a picture. The torque numbers are what I use as suggested by a former sponsor and a current sponsor and I've had great success with it. I'm also not a big fan of the torque to XX ft lbs then turn an additional '57 1/2' degrees method. | ||
| The4ork |
im about to upgrade my s1 with xb heads, and was wondering if the s1 head would be an upgrade for the blast? | ||
| Ezblast |
No - the Blast head in stock form is the best flowing head of all the stock Buell heads. EZ | ||
| Jeffreyh |
Ezblast, I don't know where you got your information, but NRHS disagrees. Read this: http://xlforum.net/vbportal/forums/showthread.php? t=14000 I've never had one apart but according to them it's just a Lightning head. A Lightning head has the same little valves and bad ports as the old XL1200 head it just has a different chamber and even that isn't necessarily better. XB heads and Thunderstorm heads are a big improvement over the Lightning head and have big valves and flow more and have better chambers. I heard that Cil Dunn's record setting Blast has an XB head. So I think your statement is wrong. | ||
| Gearheaderiko |
"Also, the Buell Blast comes with a version of this (lightning) head." So, in whole, the lightning heads are not an upgrade since the Blast heads 'are a version' of this head. How "a version this head" actually differentiates the two is the question. I'll let EZ defend his statement, but there isnt any question of the superiority of the XB head especially when mounted on a Blast and if your going to spend money, the XB stuff is where to do it. If you just have some stuff lying around, well then maybe a little mix and match can accomplish good things, but the Lightning heads still arent the place to start! | ||
| Ezblast |
From the 515cc area A Little Head Info to be saved: Heres the story: From what I hear, Aaron Wilson prefers a ported XB head to a ported Blast head. From what I hear, it comes down to you get a better starting point from the XB, and more fin area. However, when I was talking to Jeff Ecklund, who is one of the Tuners for Bartells that builds Flat Track bikes, and he was telling me that of ALL the Sportster/Buell heads that he has Flow tested, that the Blast head flows the best out of the box. On the Bartells Blast - Based Flat Track bikes that he has recently built, they are using Blast heads. They used to use Sportster Sport Heads, and Thunderstorm heads when they couldn't get Sportster Sport heads, but now he uses Blast heads because they work the best for him. There you have it! GT - JBOTDS! EZ From the days when they where racing Blasts in dirt track - lol - Bartell's are serious folks though - a top ten of Buell motor modifiers - EZ | ||
| Jeffreyh |
It doesn't make sense to me that a stock Blast Lightning head flows more than a stock Thunderstorm head. The Thunderstorm head has bigger valves and when Thunderstorm heads came out all the bikes got 10 horsepower more rating than they had with Lightning heads. So how could Thunderstorm heads flow less? But I'll find out for sure and report back. | ||
| Ezblast |
The key words are air flow - bigger is not always better, drag racers will use stock and sometimes smaller exhaust valves to speed flow characteristics - Bartell's knows their stuff, they are a sponsor, call him and ask him. EZ | ||
| Jeffreyh |
Ezblast, check out NRHS's response: http://xlforum.net/vbportal/forums/showpost.php?s= 9f89346c587336b744a7fb67c37d9f3b&p=2224073&postcou nt=75 According to them a stock Blast head flows 100-110cfm and a stock Thunderstorm or XB head flows 125-135cfm. Out of thousands flowed the best stock Blast head doesn't flow as much as the worst stock Thunderstorm. (Message edited by jeffreyh on October 16, 2009) | ||
| Swampy |
Ok, there is a big difference between flow and performance. Sometimes bigger is not always better. Sometimes a port design that flows more on the bench, performs less in a real engine environment, due to other factors such as cylinder head shape, valve shape and angle, port shape and the like. I have seen this happen, and yes, I was professionally employed as a builder in the 80s and did alot of head porting. The proof comes in the performance, not the flow. So yes you can have better flow numbers yet less performance. | ||
| Swampy |
I removed, "I remember" but took it off because I couldn't remember but now I do so here goes... I remember working on a 429 NASCAR engine, it had intake ports you could roll a tennis ball down. When we finished with it the ports were raised into the rocker cover area of the head and the floor was filled and raised. The resulting intake port was now much smaller a little larger than a golf ball. Now that engine in stock NASCAR trim would run, way up in the RPM range just below the point where parts would start flying, but it was pretty doggy down in the lower RPMs which was no good for what we were building it for. Too big of a port and when the valve open, there is too much intake volume to get air moving into the cylinder. | ||
| Slowhand96 |
The old Ford 351 Cleveland is a good example of this. Back in the 80's, all the guys I knew who had fast fords with Clevelands were also running restrictor plates. The intake air charge in those were very lazy at low RPMs. Long skinny diameter runners make good velocity and low RPM torque, short fat diameters for breathing in the high RPMs. RPMs that a stock blast may not be able to achieve. I snagged this off of a 351 cleveland chat. "Low speed velocity is a problem with the 4V heads. The ports are so huge that the intake flow is lazy at low RPM. Restrictor plates used to be available when this engine was commonly hot rodded. Running 4.56 gears helps this some. The best head for the street is the 2V head. These work well at all RPMs." | ||
| Slowhand96 |
Ya what Swampy said... LOL.. Swampy, you must have posted that while I was writing. We pretty mush said the same thing. Funny we both used the ford analogy, and I'm not even a ford guy. Maybe I should have mentioned those fast as hell 413 or 426 mopar max wedges that had skinny long intake runners that put the carbs over the inner fenders. | ||
| Jeffreyh |
"the Blast head in stock form is the best flowing head of all the stock Buell heads." Whether you think it's a better port or not this statement is wrong. Someone who's flowed thousands of these heads says the Thunderstorms and XB heads flow much better and even gave the numbers. It makes sense too considering they have bigger valves and make more power on the twins. Swampy & Slowhand if you actually go and read what NRHS said you know they're saying the same thing you're saying about port size and shape. According to them the Blast port is a really bad shape and too big and really turbulent and on the XB and Thunderstorm port they raised the floor and made a more gradual roof to make the port smaller and smoother. I'm not an expert so I won't argue it but they said basically the same thing you said and said that's why the Thunderstorm and XB ports are better. | ||
| Ezblast |
If your talking about NHRS - look elsewhere for good info - they are the type of folks who know what they know, and refuse to up date - they still use a plug too hot, but it works for them so they don't care if it is correct or not. I'll take my information from folks who actually raced the bike for a few years and know what they speak of. That is flow characteristics, not just flow, or the XB head would be best, the Blast head though expels quicker, being a single it must be set up for quick fill and expulsion. That is why at certain rpms a twin is actually moving less air than the single, as proven by my stack filter experience. The stack filter that is perfect for a twin does not allow enough airflow for a Blast, and a custom had to be made - fact! EZ | ||
| Jeffreyh |
"the Blast head though expels quicker, being a single it must be set up for quick fill and expulsion." Why would a single need to fill and expel quicker than a twin? That makes no sense. Do you actually have any facts to back that up? And anyway the Blast head is identical to a Lightning head except for the tie link mount and it's got the same crappy ports and small valves that all the XL1200 heads had from 1998 through 1993 and those bikes are twins if you hadn't noticed. "That is why at certain rpms a twin is actually moving less air than the single, as proven by my stack filter experience." Why would a twin need to move less air? Anyway if that was true you'd want the big valve head on a Blast. The more information you put out the more obvious it is you don't know what you're talking about. | ||
| Ezblast |
A twin has air overlap, a single does not. We are talking about stock heads, as soon as you want to modify, then go with the XB head because it has larger Valves,and I would only bother with that if you where to add a good cam. I know exactly what I am talking about, you - on the other hand are just trying to piece together fact to complement your argument - to no avail. My stack filter experiment proved what is already known by single racers, a single takes a faster gulp, not bigger, just faster, there is no overlap from the other cylinder, and so that is how it gets a full fill, and why the exhaust port on the single is usually smaller than a similar multi-cylinder motor. And your wrong about the head being the same as well, or they would have the same piston, lol - the Blast actually runs a hi comp sportster piston that on the Blast head only produces 9.2. The Blast head has several unique features that where test beds for the future XB line. Don't waste my time arguing with me, call Bartells or Wes, or JTA - they will all tell you the same thing. Please - NHRS is old news here, half of his stuff grenades, and his information as well. I don't even bother posting there anymore, because anyone who runs a 7 heat range plug and calls it good for the street has their head so far up their butt that they will never listen to reason or that the factory recommends not doing that. NHRS may be a good place to buy parts at a good price - if selective - but a really bad place for advice - as proven on this board countless times - how many iron sleeved 515cc kits have to go bad for this sink in? - sigh EZ | ||
| Jeffreyh |
"A twin has air overlap, a single does not." "a single takes a faster gulp, not bigger, just faster, there is no overlap from the other cylinder" This is not true. There's no window in time on a Harley twin where both cylinders pull on the carburetor at the same time. Someone asked NRHS about this a long time ago and he proved it. You need to do your homework before you make statements like that. "And your wrong about the head being the same as well, or they would have the same piston, lol - the Blast actually runs a hi comp sportster piston that on the Blast head only produces 9.2." Again you show how little you know. According to NRHS the Blast uses a regular Thunderstorm piston with a 15 degree squish angle. Unfortunately the Blast head has a 10 degree squish angle so it's actually a mismatch. You should take the time to learn this stuff. Talk to NRHS, they have a wealth of info. they specialize in XL stuff and have done thousands of XL heads. "The Blast head has several unique features that where test beds for the future XB line." Name just one. You have a fantasy that the Blast head is some kind of a special head made just for the unique needs of the Blast motor. I'm guessing you've never even looked at one or compared it to an XL1200 head much less flow tested one. Meanwhile a shop that's done thousands of XL heads says it's just a plain jane Lightning head with the same crappy ports and small valves. Gee I wonder who's right. You obviously just have an over-active imagination. | ||
| Ezblast |
Constant velocity mean anything to you vs single demand - it is the very reason that the twin sucks more gas than the single - overlap. All you do is quote NHRS and out of context - this conversation is going no place - call the people I suggested, stop reading mis-leading worthless info. Valve angles, decks, etc. - all are things the Blast head has in common with the XB head. Also - One more insult and your out of here - period. EZ | ||
| Jeffreyh |
Sorry EZblast you're wrong again. There's nothing special about the valve angles or the decks on the Blast or XB heads. All evolution Sportster and Buell heads have 27 degree intake angles and 31 degree exhaust angles and the decks are all the same except XB heads are .020 shorter but not Blast heads. "Also - One more insult and your out of here - period. " WOW you're going to ban me for correcting your misinformation? Go right ahead! I would think an admin on the board would WANT the information posted to be right though, guess not! Put your money where your mouth is. I will bet you $1,000 that a Blast head is just a regular Lightning head with nothing special about it except the mount place for the tie rod. The loser must pay to a charity to be chosen by the winner. Deal? | ||
| Monzaracer |
Jeffreh, Listen to the guys they speak from knowledge and experience. And as for NRHS being the end all of Blast info, better do more research,they are THE reason I WONT do a 515. Anad no the Blast heada isnt a Lightning hed with tie bar mount. It IS much more and different. Oh and the plug thing is just one falicy NRHS propagates. Oh and you want to be insulting? I would have booted you much quicker if I had actually been near the fight. Oh and I'd say EZ has considerable Blast knowledge. Rather than simply rehashing old misinformation. | ||
| Ezblast |
Actually as Court said - it was a test of parts, nothing is hi tech about any of the HD/Buell heads for stock application except that parts where tested for durability and different valve angle variations, etc. and that the Blast head was made to flow a bit faster to get the necessary fill, since it doesn't have twin overlap of air/constant fill. NO - I would ban you for rudeness uncalled for. And really - everyone on this Board knows that NHRS, though very good tuners and hotrodders still have also put out some bad information and products, happens - they used to be the best, and they are not bad now, but there are many differences between each generation and type of Buell head - saying they are the same in most respects would not be true because it is their differences that define their application. NHRS used to post here all the time, 3/4s of my and others knowledge on hotroding Blasts are from his early participation here - read! The Hobans have an awesome racing heritage as well and are very serious about eking out the last pony - they said that about the stock Blast head in their testing, I tend to believe them over NHRS in generalities. The reason they don't post here is old news as well - The Hoban Brothers shop is a sponsor - call them, I never claimed to be an expert, only to know them, so I know who to ask questions of - lol - life is a learning experience - try to deal more gently with it, cause your not going to beat it - lol EZ (Message edited by ezblast on October 22, 2009) | ||
| Jeffreyh |
Unbelievable! You guys sit there insulting NRHS and at the same time threatening to ban me for being rude! Guess there's a different set of rules for some than others huh? I got news for you I got the info about the valve angles and decks from a different shop and they're a BOARD SPONSOR. And they told me the same thing that it's just a Lightning head. So I guess if NRHS doesn't know what they're talking about neither do they? Put your money where your mouth is! I've got $1,000 that says it's a Lightning head with nothing special for the Blast except the mount point for the tie rod. I can prove it. If you're so sure it's got special valve angles or whatever then let's bet. Loser pays to a charity chosen by the winner. If you're too chicken to bet then at least be man enough to admit you were wrong and apologize to NRHS and me. I predict you'll ban me now because you KNOW I'm right and you'll ban me rather than admit you're spreading misinformation. Go right ahead! |
