Al is a dick. Page held his line, it's up to the faster rider to pass HIM. Explain to me, smoke or blake, if you hold your line, what do you do next? Slow down? How in the hell is Page supposed to know where and when he'll be passed. As stated above, slowing down isn't an option. Neither is "moving out of the way". How do you know which way is out of the way? And Yates should be the last one to be concerned with, with his ability to knock other riders down with ill times passes, JRP was the one I'd be worried about. So tell me, when you guys had faster riders behind, how did you know where to go? What was, in YOUR opinion, the right thing to do?
"Ludington's credentials are second to none. The guy is a pro. Yes he's emotional about racing because he gives a damn. JRP had no business not moving out of the way for a blue flag. All other riders did, as is plain to see in videos of the race. But the Honda-paid AMA hate generating journalists are out in force. The racing right now is spectacular, but the Japanese are trying to destroy it, and spending real money to do so."
I'm sorry I don't think threatening to fail people on tech for comments you don't like is very professional, do you. Why would the Japanese want to destroy racing, excuse them for thinking it should be about the actual motorcycles and AMA wants it like NASCAR, about the driver and marketing. Unlike NASCAR, people actually buy the brands of motorcycle that is winning races.I guess they could just use the Buell as the "Motorcycle of Tomorrow" that way it can be exactly like NASCAR.
From what I saw everyone but Page was able to get out of the way. Page looked back saw where they were and, to me, it looked like he put his head down and tried racing. Mid O is a big track and the racing line is pretty well defined, he could have gotten out of the way if he wanted to...I really don't think they should have suspended Al, hell I'm starting to get tired of this were professionals crap. That's all well and good in the office(which I don't agree with much either) but damn folks emotion aint a bad thing...
I don't remember calling you a dick Court. I remember saying, that in the NEW PRODUCT thread that your post was condescending and arrogant. Then again, a lot of your threads seem to have that tone, sooner or later. I don't believe I compared JRP to Noble. Seems some of the AMA racers are a little jealous of his wealth. Once again, your arrogance has come shining through. But I expect nothing less from you. BTW, where is the $7 you owe me for shipping the bag for the Uly? Ya know what? Keep it. Put it towards humility lessons.
I thought the question posed to Smoke and Blake was rather straight forward. In a rather technical section of a track, HOW do you move over and know you aren't moving into the line the approaching rider has picked to get around you? He's behind you. I know I don't have mirrors on my race bike and I doubt they do in the AMA either. With that, you can take this thread, and this site, and shove it.
rocketsprink, it looked to me like jrp attempted to stay with hayes instead of maintaining his pace. for me, when the first expert goes by i figure that there is a line of them on my ass and i try to stay predictable and at the same pace as i am going. about halfway through the expert field (about 8 of them) i can manage to try and follow at an ever widening margin. it is impossible at my present skill level to attempt to keep up with the expert leader.(usually 10-15sec per lap faster than me)one thing the blue flag doesn't mean is: hey you-you are about to be lapped-try to stay on the leader's tail! on Luddington's suspension, to me, it was the threat of technical dq that sealed his fate. see ya at the track. by the way, my hat's off to anyone who can qualify to be in the show!! they have skills i can only imagine!! tim
JRP holds them up, no question. Hayes is held up for 3 corners and has to fight his way around JRP. After 5 corners of fighting with him the video ends without Yates finding a way through. JRP may have held his line, but he appears to have made zero effort to "allow the faster rider to pass". It sure looks like JRP was trying to run with them through those corners.
Ludington was unprofessional and shouldn't use tech inspections as a threat against racers, but JRP absolutely deserved strict punishment for this and it was a sorry thing for JRP to hide behind the "hold your line" rule and whine about it.
I watched the video from Sat and Sun. I wasn't able to see the blue flags, but they were apparently shown on Sat to John Page at some point. CLEARLY, Page could have held his line OFF the race line afer coming out from under the Honda bridge. Instead he chose to run tight on the race line janmming up the leaders. Even the race announcer expected Page to be off the race line and says "Josh is probably gonna get by Johnny Rock right here on the inside. And uh, no he got closed off..."
In the very next turn, Hayes bobbles a bit as it looked as if he was expecting Page to go wide so he could pass on the inside. Page didn't and and Hayes had to mid corner adjust and pass him on the outside.
Going into the next corner, Hayes gets by Page. At this point Page should expect there are probably other faster riders behind him and adjust accordingly. It is also readily apparent that Yates thinks Page will hold his line to the outside of the race line. Instead, Page (after being passed by Hayes) comes back across the track and closes the door on Yates. Page then tries to keep pace with Hayes.
A few turns later Page gets passed by Maldin and Bostrom. He then clearly tries to race Bostrom. The annoucer even comments "...the leader goes by, you gotta kinda assume there is a couple more people coming..."
Before you spout off "it's a tough part of the track to do anything" the Sunday video clearly shows where other backmarkers are holding their line, OFF the race line, in the EXACT same part of the track.
It can (and should have) been done by Page. He messed up. It is very likely he did it on purpose for his reality show.
He didn't help matters when interacting with AL. It was very obvious that Page was pushing buttons trying to get Al flustered. Al fell for it hook, line and sinker and Page's camera guy "just happened to be there to catch it" (yeah, right)! Al messed up.
As far as jealous? I never heard the name John Page until 2 days ago. From what I gather of him, he has an arrogant attitude, some money and barely enough skill to make the grid for AMA. I give him credit for making the grid, but that is about it.
After watching him get smoked on the race track, it is rather obvious he will be nothing more than a back marker in AMA. The sad part is, it looks like he has enough jingle that should afford him a LOT of opportunity to develope his skills and become a better rider.
As far as the Al vs. JRP video, all I can say is WOW. He may not be right, and he may or may not (not) be much of a Superbike racer, but he sure out debated, and out classed the Technical Director of the AMA's top racing division. That is SAD! In fact, based on that video, it seems Mr. Page is much more qualified to do Mr. Ludington's job, than Mr. Ludington.
I try not to get into character debates so please forgive me...but....
Being a racer and sometimes the one lapping - sometimes the one being lapped I can say JRP was in the wrong - completely, plus being mic'ed up in that situation was even more wrong. Yes, Al could have threw a few less F-bombs, but if you knew him he is an emotional guy and has a huge passion for what he does. JRP was trying to stir things up - I don't care what he says to the contrary.
Anyone remember the Aaron Yates dropkick? Well, same thing. People saw what Aaron did and not what Anthony Fania did - sensationalism at it's best. Aaron is a great guy - and very emotional. Was it right - no, but was it right for people to jump to conclusions and condemn him - absolutely not...
I stand behind Al 100%, it's just too bad it cost him so much when we all make mistakes.
For sure, Walt. My comments, for one, are based only on what I witnessed at the race, and on the actions caught on video. Based on what I observed in that context, both men acted unprofessionally. They are my only direct observations of actions by either man, and thereby, certainly not enough of a ledger to measure them as men. I'm more akin to the "do not judge unless you want to be judged" line of thinking anyway. Now, no one but higher level motorcycle race fans will likely view the video of the actual race incident or what transpired in JRP's garage. My concern is that this incident seems to support those hardcore fans, as well as many of the high profile race teams, who can be heard saying that the AMA is not operated anywhere near a world class standard. I'm a fan of AMA racing and I expect both the racing and the organization to be professional.
Please note...my comments were definitely not pointed at anyone nor meant to be argumentative or "fuel for the fire."
As with everyone else, I have my own views and opinions.
I guess I was just venting those views and opinions.
I am as frustrated as everyone else and I think the video all over the internet hurts and not helps the sport we all love.
AMA/DMG does do some things that make a person shake their head, but overall I think they are going in the right direction.
What I wish is that the road racing fan (casual and hardcore) would at least try to embrace what the new AMA is about. If it fails, it fails. But if it does we will all be worse off.
What I wish is that the road racing fan (casual and hardcore) would at least try to embrace what the new AMA is about.
Great post Walt.
That would make a world of difference for sure. The AMA has done lots of GOOD things this year. If people would just look at the glass as half full....
Who would have thought that Yamaha would have a double win weekend in Superbike and Buell would be second in points and wins in DSB? Not to mention the best AMA race in recent memory this last weekend at Mid-Ohio...
Have you guys been watching the Superbike races for the last couple of years? To say that "when the leader goes by, you should expect there to be more" is a joke. For the last couple seasons it has been somebody on a Suzuki 15 seconds ahead of second place!
+1 for what Walt said. Quit bitchin about the current class structures and enjoy the racing!! When was the last time two riders other than Mladin and Spies were fighting for the win? And DSB has gotten a lot of brands involved, including BUELL!! They are going in the right direction, Rome wasn't built overnight. It may take a season or two to get the everything straightened out and settled in. But it has enticed Buell into building the Factory Superbike 1125RR! These are exciting times for motorcycle racing and especially for Buell!
For the last couple seasons it has been somebody on a Suzuki 15 seconds ahead of second place!
Well its the new AMA and Suzuki runaways seem like a thing of the past (hopefully.) By that logic JRP should have been really weary after Hayes blew past him on a Yamaha...
Finally caught that second Mid Ohio Daytona Sportbike race last night on the DVR.
WOW! What a race, from start to finish. Anyone who thinks those bikes are not evenly matched (at least the top 4 or 5) isn't paying attention! The 1125 and the ZX6 had different strengths and weaknesses, but the laps were within fractions of a second, and for the first few laps, there were two lead changes every lap. Amazing.
The goal of DMG is to get lots of brands in the race. Sounds like a fun criteria for classes to me...
+1 to the racing this year...the level of COMPETITIVENESS is great. I was very skeptical at the beginning of the season, but it's working out. How others are so up in arms about the class structure and rules is absolutely beyond me....are they watching the same races I am?
I was kinda down on Miguel Duhamel a couple years ago for dissin' JRP, submitting basically that he shouldn't even be out there. After seeing his actions last weekend, I take it all back.
