| Author | Message | ||
     Jmkybf |
Ok, the back round on the bike. 1997 Frame 2000 Chassis/bodywork 2002 X1 White Lightning Engine I pieced it together from the left over parts of chopper projects. Now for the problem. The bike runs like crap. It had an '86 883 engine in it with the corresponding CDI. The problems started with that engine. The bike started carbon fouling plugs like crazy, and only running on the front cylinder. This was beginning to be winter time, and I figured it would be a great opportunity to swap engines. I put the '02 X1 Lightning engine in it and rebuilt the carburetor. I started out with putting a thunderslide dyno jet kit in it with a 195 main and 50 slow, along with the new slide, needle, and accelerator pump in the kit. I tested the resistance in the coil, and it checked out. When I tested the spark plug cables, they were out of spec, so I replaced them with ones from ironmachine.com. I also swapped in a CDI from an S1. I Started the bike and really rough idle around 2k rpm, it dies if I try to set a lower idle. When revving, it just bogs and backfires. When holding the throttle steady around 3k, it's really won't hold steady and is still backfiring. I have tried a 185, 195, and 200 main, and 42, 50, 52, and 54 slow. All these have had the same result. Right now I am sitting with the stock slide, needle, accelerator pump, and 195 main and 50 slow. This is the best I have got so far, and it is still totally unridable. When I try and ride it, it'll idle around, but when trying to rev, just backfires and shudders. Right now I am at a loss. I believe that it is running rich since it is backfiring and carbon fouling plugs, but why won't it rev? I have a 45 slow on the way to try out, but the bike still shouldn't be acting like this right? Any help would be greatly appreciated to try and get this back on the road. Forgot to say that I just replaced the intake and exhaust seals. (Message edited by jmkybf on March 19, 2009) | ||
| Sparky |
That's quite a project you got going there. Remember when bikes and cars had points and condensers and all there was were carbs? You've got so many inconsistent variables in this bike, it makes my head swim. For instance, what engine is it? X1 engines were fuel injected. S1 White Lightnings were carbureted. You've put a carb on it, OK, but what year and model Buell did the carb come from? Then you put an S1 ignition module on it. What year and model Buell did the ignition come from? I would say start with the basics: check the ignition timing, make sure all the ignition components are correct for the year of the engine, check the cam indexing to make sure valve timing has not jumped a tooth on any of the four cams, check compression, verify VOES works (switches ignition timing based on intake vacuum). | ||
| Jmkybf |
The engine is a 2002 X1 fuel injected engine. I believe that there are not fundamental changes to the engine other that the rear head temp sensor that they started putting on M2's in 2000 (I think). I am not sure where the carb came from. It is a Keihin CV40 with Harley-Davidson stamped on the side. It came with a 200 main and 50 slow in it. One thing I forgot to mention is when turing the idle mixture screw, it doesn't make any difference what so ever in the idle of the bike. It can be fully in or all the way out and it doesn't matter. This should only affect the lower RPMs right? This shouldn't be the cause of the higher RPM bogging? The ignition is off of a 1996 S1. Aren't all Buell carb'd ignitions basically the same? I would figure that any of the ignitions would be able to make the bike drivable, but maybe not optimal. I'll pull of the cam cover tonight and check the cams. I'll also check the timing. I have put a vacuum on the VOES and it clicks over, but I have yet to check the resistance in the open and closed position. | ||
| Road_thing |
"when turing the idle mixture screw, it doesn't make any difference what so ever in the idle of the bike. It can be fully in or all the way out and it doesn't matter." Sounds like you need to clean out the idle and pilot circuits in the carb. rt | ||
| Jmkybf |
I've had that carb apart numerous times and sprayed carb cleaner in all the passages. The carb cleaner came out the other side of the passages. Maybe I need to let it sit overnight in cleaner. | ||
| Sparky |
There was one poster on here recently who was sure his idle air jet was clogged and couldn't clear it easily. His idle fuel jet passages were cleared OK though. You cleaned all the passages, but you might want to double-check the idle air jet and its passages again. Another thing that might be going on is that someone might have drilled the high speed or low speed jet to some size other than what it is stamped. I guess the only way to verify this would be to compare the existing jet(s) to known good ones. | ||
| Jmkybf |
I'm pretty sure that the idle fuel jet is clear. Is the idle air jet one of the two in the front of the carb (when looking at it on the bike) just below the mouth of the carb? | ||
| Jmkybf |
An update-I thoroughly cleaned the carb tonight. The idle, main, and enricher circuits are all clear. The carb cleaner was exiting all the holes in these circuits when spraying carb cleaner in the jets and the air inlets. I took the header off so I could drill out the timing cover rivets, and the exhaust gaskets looked like they weren't sealing properly. It looked as if the header was cocked in the exhaust ports. Could this have been causing the problems? | ||
| Sparky |
An exhaust pipe not sealing completely may cause some drivability problems but I doubt that will cause excessive richness. A 50 slow jet is most likely too rich and may be why you couldn't get a decent idle mixture. A 48 slow jet I installed in my '98 S3, a Thunderstorm engine, produced borderline rich throttle response which helped overcome a pinging on acceleration condition, but could be adjusted for a good idle. So, a 45 slow jet would probably work better in your engine than a 50. With it you should be able to find a happy medium in the idle mixture from too lean to too rich. | ||
| Jmkybf |
I've got some positive progress, I think. I thought I had a 45 slow coming to me, but it was a 48. I'm working away from where I have spare parts, and a buddy brought me my extra jets. I put the 48 in with a 180 main, and it was almost ridable. I was able to go around the block and get it into 3rd gear. There were still some bogging issues in the midrange. I would get on the gas and accelerate, and then it would start bogging at around 3-4 grand and then clear up. This was especially bad in 1st gear and not nearly as worse in 2nd or 3rd. When it was bogging, it was coughing out of both the carb and exhaust. I'm assuming that this is the transition period when the main jet and slow jet are working together. My guess is that the 48 slow is still too rich and the causing this. Does this sound right? I checked the plugs and they are no longer dark black. They are starting to clear up. After that was happening, I put in a 185 main and it ran like crap again. I couldn't get it to run when I took the choke off. | ||
| Jmkybf |
FYI, I figured out what it was. I was running the fuel injection ignition trigger cup instead of the carb'd version. Runs a whole lot better now. | ||
| Sparky |
Thanks for the followup. Evidently not all ignition parts are compatible between FI and non-FI bikes. Glad you found the root of the problem. I knew there was a reason for my asking what ignition system you were running, hoping that you would have completely converted from a FI system to a non-FI system, but before this post, I didn't know that a difference in rotors could produce the symptoms you were experiencing. This is a good one for the Knowledge Vault. | ||
| Buell_bert |
Hey is that what is called a trigger rotor in the parts manual??? | ||
| Jmkybf |
Yep it is.  It is #9. The carb'd version has 2 slots, and the fuel injection looks like this.  |
