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Boltrider
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 08:05 pm: | 
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I remember seeing some of them, but I also remember the H2 selling for 50 g's. Just a re-bodied Suburban. |
Froggy
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 08:10 pm: |
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GM bought the Hummer name from AM general in 99, I am not 100% sure but I believe it was for $1 billion. A few years ago Hummer was GM's fastest growing and strongest selling brand.
It is a mis conception that the H2 is a re-bodied Suburban, the front is based on the same GMT800 platform, but from the A-pillar back it is different. It shares the engine and many underhood components as the other GM SUVs and pickups. |
Rocketsprink
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 08:32 pm: |
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hey Court. Aren't you in the Electrical Union? If you are, you seem rather 2 faced.
You rip on Unions at every turn, yet benefit from a contact. Why the hate toward American works on this board? Why do some here seem to think that American workers should settle for less? The best thing that could happen is ALL workers get represented. This place is like a frickin' broken record, stuck in the stone age. |
Brumbear
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 08:41 pm: |
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The failure is almost everywhere though I can't see how we are going to fix anything listening to any and I mean any of the people and corporations that got us here in the first place.
IE no bs this happened to me today
I get a letter from my town I have to pay for my permit for my new siding or I will be fined. OK but... I called them and say I don't have brand new siding and I am not getting siding done I had it had it done 3 years ago. They say yes thats what we mean we lost the application and just found it the check can't be cashed the account is closed. I say I didn't write it the construction company did I paid him for it and he paid you 3 years ago. Well you have to come down and pay again and we hope it passes inspection or we will have to fine you.
IE again
Last year we were getting reassesed for property tax in the meeting I stand up and say excuse me the house across the street from me has the same square footage same amenities and same size property as mine. I have nice clean yard new siding and windows. He has 3ft grass and a elcamino with grass growing through it and the house looks like crap do we pay the same taxes?
No the representitve says your house is worth more.
Oh I thought this was a fair assesment I says I don't understand according to the rules you laid out the homes were taxed in a apples to apples way sqare footage etc etc. So why don't we tax us both the same and fine my ahole neighbor for being a pig.
We and I mean all of us all of us who tow the line are getting a screwing like never before from our local gov. to our school boards my town has 3000 students with a yearly budget of 26 million look it up I aint kidding to our ceo's to our congress and senate and I don't know how they can fix it they don't even know it was them that broke it!!!!!!!! |
Froggy
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 08:56 pm: |
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quote:elcamino with grass growing through it
Is he looking to sell? I need a bike hauler. |
Brumbear
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 08:59 pm: |
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Froggy you wouldn't haul your machine if you had to. |
Court
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 09:00 pm: |
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>>>Why the hate toward American works on this board?
No hate at all, the union has paid for me to have a splendid education.
But the union that my grandfather, who had his job threatened and his pay cut in half for holding midnight organizing meetings for, was a union that gained it's advantage as a result of having the best trained and most productive labor in the world. It was crafted, ad I learned when getting my degree in Labor Economics and Legislation in 1977, after the Trade Guilds of Europe.
When I moved to New York City almost all work was Union.
Now it's a small percentage.
When the unions were selling something of value; they have value.
The moment they started the "you have to use us and you have to pay certain people not to work and have two guys stand a watch that light switch (although that has been relaxed in the current contract) the unions in America no longer had anything to sell.
When you have to threaten me with what will happen if I don't use you . . you really have nothing left to sell. That's played out in NYC.
I'd like to go back to the stone age . . . where union labor was, bar none, the best you could get.
I'd suggest that the UAW, the one that requires folks not working be paid 85% of ST scale, has, as we say in the trades, "shit in their own mess kit".
By the way . . . I, and so do you, know some wonderfully good and skilled folks in the unions. Most of them would love to just work and do a great job. But, alas, like society it takes only a few bad ones to •••• it up for the entire group.
If the unions had an clout left Obama's open ballet (yeah, you have to stand in the hall and raise your hand to vote . . try voting against the halls' slate will likely be sending firms scurrying to open shop states.
No. I am not two faced at all. |
Crashcourse411
| | Posted on Thursday, March 05, 2009 - 09:38 pm: |
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And frame, and axle and ...
Just prior to the GM purchase there was a Kit car company that was selling the body very similar to the H2 for $6k all you needed was an interior and they had some of that available too. All you had to come up with was a Suburban chassis. Then that disappeared and GM had the H2.
Its like saying a PT Cruiser is not a reskinned Neon.
As for how the supply companies work for the auto industry. It is like being in a tanker full of crude just out of port and trusting your GPS then realizing you are in the port and stopping before you hit the dock. Those things take 3 miles to slow down let alone stop.
When you have more than six weeks supply in the pipeline and six more months of PO's and futures purchased, it is kind of hard to stop immediately when the markets hit the wall. Dealers were even ordering 1-2 months in advance and then sales dropped before they stopped ordering.
Then you take into account the sales agreements that were made on the expectation that for X model years you would make X number and at that rate parts would cost X. Now make only half the cars. Cost of parts double while sales dropped by half and customers have less cash to purchase at the current MSRP, let alone when that price really now is nearly a loss.
A Superbowl commercial showed a Dodge Avenger for $9999 +tax and title after incentives. MSRP is $19900. A Kia add showed buy one get one free. A Ford dealer had buy an F150 and get a free Focus. Hyundai was even getting in on it.
How many Buells would we buy if this was the case? Buell would be out of business, but they would sell out of bikes, and for an instant we would like it.
This is how our gov. will handle it.
They don't even see it coming.
I'll get off my soap box. I have a weekend to look forward to, and I have gotten too worked up. |
Fast1075
| | Posted on Friday, March 06, 2009 - 08:49 am: |
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The fake hummer kit was called the "Bummer" and GM threatened to sue the pants off the company for building it...it filled a need...GM saw it as a threat to Hummer sales, that is hardly the case...the people that were buying the kit were not willing to spend 50K for a new hummer and then spend another 10K on "product improvement" to modify the stocker for severe off-road use...which was the intended target for the product.
Court, I have a picture from a jobsite where the operation involved structural welding...there are 17 people in the picture...the project was a single weld on a structural member...and ALL of the people were required to be in position before the single welder could actually make the weld. The cost for that single weld was astronomical when all that was logically needed was the welder, helper, and fireman.
(Message edited by fast1075 on March 06, 2009) |
Gentleman_jon
| | Posted on Friday, March 06, 2009 - 09:45 am: |
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I remember General Motors.
Very well, in fact.
When I was a lad, we were strictly a GM family. My grandfather bought a new Cadillac every two years, and gave the old one to my father.
1957 Cadillac Sedan de Ville
My mother, (and my brothers when we got our licenses),
drove my moms red Olds Super 98 Convertible.
In those days, these magnificent automobiles reflected American skill and pride. Each division of GM made a distinct brand of vehicle, and there was no mistaking one for the other.
No other country made anything remotely comparable.
Today, that Olds, in concours condition, might fetch around $100,000. That was a real automobile, my brothers.
But as General Patton observed at the end of World War ll, all good things must come to an end.
Many, indeed, most, American car companies have gone out of business since those days, and I fear GM might be next. |
Rubberdown
| | Posted on Friday, March 06, 2009 - 10:05 am: |
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Nice story Jon! My Dad buys a new Grand Marquis every couple of years and gives his old one to my brother or me in rotation. Neither one on us really need it but we love it and drive them proudly. Mine pulls a race trailer pretty darn well. When we all meet at my Dad's house, it's like a Grand Marquis shine and show.  |
Mattwhite
| | Posted on Saturday, March 07, 2009 - 04:27 pm: |
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One of the things that really bothers me is all the talk about building cars people want.
Foreign cars are always assumed to be better. I think a lot of people have that perception of "Foriegn=better". They don't even look at the American brands.
I drive a lot of mid-sized rental cars when I travel for work. GM cars have been better than the imports most of the time.
Ford had some bad mid-size cars for a while, but the new models are great. At least their trucks get respect.
The labor problems are more complicated. The stereotype of the lazy auto worker is overblown, but the contracts that prevent the companies from cutting costs with lower
production just can't work. |
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