| Author | Message | ||
     1_mike |
Found out today that there IS new mapping for the early 08 CR's. Mine has an Aug. date on the steering head. Some parts inside have "June" (06-08) assemble date signoff dates on them. As you may have seen from my "lean surge" post...I'm not overly happy with the way it runs. Went to the dealer today to "check" the current mapping. Well...a "later" map is available. What did it do - 1. Actually hurt the idle a little. Doesn't start as nicely, slightly lower idle speed. Rougher from idle to about 2200rpm. Thumps...more like a "Harley" engine without mufflers and a low idle speed. 2. Removed about 1/2 of the surging. Which did make the driveability from about 2200rpm.....go way up. 3. Coolant heat actually did go "up" a little, but it seems much more stable. That is it doesn't go up and down as rapidly. 4. Didn't seem to do anything to the "acceleration" characteristics, which were/are, ok as is, but I think there's more to be had. While it still isn't "right"...it "is" much better, much more drivable. You...early build guys might want to check with your dealer....just to see what they may have for you. Mike | ||
| Xl1200r |
Thanks for the heads up. Mine can be a little cold blooded in the low rpms. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
How much time is spent around the 2200 RPM range? | ||
| Buellborn |
When you at 2200 rpm its something important like in a city corner, pulling the clutch in when you shift, school zones, parking lots every time you take off etc | ||
| Xl1200r |
How much time is spent around the 2200 RPM range? I typically keep the rpms pretty low on most everything I ride/drive, and this bike is pretty tough in 30-40mph zones because of the jumpiness. I'm not sure if it's surging or driveline lash, but if I'm going slow, then have to slow down some, then get back on the throttle, it doesn't matter how gentle I am, it will jerk the bike pretty hard. I've gotten into the habbit of just ducking the clutch and letting it back out in these situations. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Do people really expect the engine not to bog at 2,200 RPM? Idle is 1,500 RPM. Let's get serious. This isn't an XB and you certainly are not doing your engine any favors by running at 2,200 RPM. I don't get it sometimes, people buy (or sit on the sidelines and criticize) a bike that has an engine that loves to rev with a redline of 10,500 and they don't use the upper half of the rev range. | ||
| Ridenusa4l |
+10 Fresno Jake | ||
| Spectrum |
I'm sure it's just a typo, but I'm surprised no one has said it yet. 08 1125CR? Didn't think there was such a thing. I think you meant 09 1125CR with an 08 build date. Just wanted to make sure we are not confusing folks that are new to 1125's Can any of you dealer guys confirm what 09's have reflashes available and what they do? | ||
| Buellborn |
I assumed he meant 2008 Build | ||
| Xl1200r |
Do people really expect the engine not to bog at 2,200 RPM? I know what bogging is, and that's not what I'm talking about. Just because an engine can rev to the moon doesn't mean it should be expected to hang up there all day. I don't spend much time at 2200rpm, but I do tend to cruise around 3000 or so, and what feels like some driveline lash to me makes the bike all herky jerky there. | ||
| 1_mike |
Spectrum - It was built in 08...it was purchased in 08. Yes..it is an 09 "model"! Does that satisfy you? All - Below the 2200rpm, nothing was said about bogging. It just isn't as smooth and clean running. As someone noted...yea, there is time in corners that one may be below the ideal! Idle to 2500rpm is lower thAn the more ideal rpm's. Everyone uses those rpm's! As XI1200r says, the trans. gear lash will come into play as a real annoyance occasionally in the lower rpm, though the new mapping has helped. And for those rpm freaks...every now and again...maybe twice a day, I can verify that the rev. limiter still works...and do! Believe it or not...even Saturday (So. Cal.)...I had to do some lane splitting to get home from the dealer. I fully understand that a better rpm range is above 3000rpm...BUT...occasionally...the traffic dictates otherwise....and always will. I've been on a sportbike of one kind or another as daily transportation for 20+ years, with an average of a 66 mile commute. Currently it's an 84 mile daily commute. And though not nearly as much as I used to, a weekend day here and there, I loosen things up with a trip up Angeles Crest or Angeles Forrest hwy's. Used to be one day every weekend. Not so much lately, even my Yamaha R1 only made a few trips in its life. Though, I might try to make time head up there with the 1125 just for the fun of it. Mike | ||
| Steeltech |
Traffic doesn't dictate rpm, it dictates the speed. You dictate rpm with your gear. Cruising speed for me on this bike starts at 3k rpm. If I can't keep it in an acceptable rpm range through a turn I will pop it down a gear. I don't want any of the 'drive line surging' while I'm going over in a turn. Why don't I just kick my rear brakes while leaned over while I'm at it? If you have surging you won't have reliable traction in the corner. I have ridden my 1125r in most any condition and can usually keep it over 3k rpm. Why would you want to take an 1125 below 3k rpm? The charging system for the bike is suppose to be above 3k, if not they say you are not getting a positive gain in you electrical system vs. what you are using. As FresnoBuell stated, if you want a low rpm bike the XB will do it all day long. Plus they were sitting right next to the 1125 on the show room floor. Idk man...not looking for an argument, but I found out as soon as I got on my bike that she needs to be revved a bit. Then all the service bulletins that followed supported that. Hell, before the remap I had to run at almost 4k rpm to deal with the bump. The new remap evened it out down the 3k, and lower isn't bad...it just doesn't like it as much. | ||
| 1_mike |
Steel - EVERYONE...goes thru the idle thru 3000rpm at one point or another! As far as traffic...absolutly..YES it does! Ever have someone pull in front of you just as you WERE getting ready to shift gears from having been even slower...? Sorry...it does happen. Mike | ||
| Steeltech |
well...she takes off perfectly fine from idle up to 3k...acceleration is different from cruising. Different section of fuel map and different conditions. Mine takes off the line very well and gets up rpm without any hiccup, whether cruising for going flat out. And then you are going to talk about the off beat 'someone cutting you off' situation.... Well...when that happens...I might go ahead and grab the clutch. Its automatic for me. I just know that I got to grab a handful of brake so I automatically grab the clutch. Then downshift and give the guy the finger for cutting me off. I usually whale on the horn a bit to make sure he sees me give him the finger. But really, that is an emergency stop. Your main concern shouldn't be that so much as how it performs under normal circumstances. For a daily rider that should be cruising. For the track ••••• that should be b@lls to the w@alls acceleration and nothing below 6k rpm. Sure things happen, but are you gonna base the entire bikes performance on if it has a little drive line lash when you don't pull the clutch in bellow 3k rpm? Here is my speculation on the low end hiccup on these bikes. I believe the velocity of the air traveling into the engine is to low while at lower RPM. I believe that Buell having those two 62 mm throttle bodies is to much air while the bike runs at lower rpm. To put that size in perspective...The stock throttle body for the 110 engine from HD that feeds BOTH cylinders is 46 mm. So for 1800cc of displacement, you have 1 46 mm throttle body. Now compare that to the 62 mm throttle body per 562.5cc cylinder. the 110 has a pretty good low end, because the rpm range is pretty much half that of the 1125. Being that the bike is a sport bike, they tuned the throttle body size for power from 4k to 10.5k rpm. Idle is just while she warms up : ). Now Suzuki had an answer to a similar problem. They now have on their GSXR line 2 flapper valves and 2 injectors PER throttle body. One of the sets of flapper valves is controlled by the twist grip, the other is controlled electronically. Their reason for doing this was under sudden acceleration the bike would stutter and take off since you were giving it to much air at once. I feel it might also help with this low end issue on the 1125. Allowing the ecm to close the second flapper valve a bit more to reduce the air could possibly solve the issue. I just don't see Buell redesigning their throttle body for a RPM range they never plan on using. Not to mention adding those couple of ounces for a new servo. ST | ||
| Dirty_john |
I own a Firebolt and an 1125R and whilst you can ride the Firebolt's excellent low down torque the Helicon engine is designed to produce its output much higher in the rev range and thus cannot be lugged at low revs in the same way. I never operate the Helicon below 2500 rpm apart maybe from moving away and trickling through traffic jams. | ||
| Buellborn |
The arguments stating the bike should never be below 3000 rpm is idiotic. So in true redneck fashion, then lets just set the idle to 3,000 rpm. heh heh heh, problem solved. Now for some duct tape on the clutch cover and flashlights for turn-lamps. | ||
| Funktron |
Spectrum - agreed......build date is one thing.......but when you talk about a vehicle of any kind, you talk about the model year. If you are talking about build date, then say such. Semantics?.........maybe.......but accuracy allows me to keep a job. 1_mike - I hate to jump in your shit (don't hate it too much).......but wtf are you talking about? Any why "do" you use quotes "where" they don't belong? (thanks for the heads up on the software for the CR riders) (ok, I'm off of my A-hole box) | ||
| 1_mike |
Thanks Buellborn - And...for yous 10,000rpm crowd... Yesterday morning...comming in to work, some hangup on the 605 (So. Cal.). Traffic was running about..."maybe" 5mph. About 5+ miles of this. So...for all the experts out there...how exactly does one traverse THIS...at 3000rpm or better? Please do tell....without a grin on your face...! This is not uncommon. And for Dirty John - Youv'e been reading too many magazines. Mike | ||
| Funktron |
I'd throw that beeyatch in first and cut thru traffic while keeping a close touch on that clutch lever. | ||
| Funktron |
....or move  | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Yesterday morning...comming in to work, some hangup on the 605 (So. Cal.). Traffic was running about..."maybe" 5mph. About 5+ miles of this. Criminey.....LANE-SPLIT!!!! It's about the only "privilege" that we get in California.} | ||
| Dirty_john |
Mike, as a Mechanical Design Engr with 35 years riding bikes, rebuilding and modifiying engines for road and track use I will stand by why comments, 4 valve engines are nore efficient when turning over at higher rpm, look at the actual fuel consumption for a firebolt v an 1125R when operated at relativly low road speeds at you will see the difference. I regularly get at least 45 mpg (imperial) from the firebolt for a modest 20 mile commute and the 1125R shows a 33 mpg figure for exactly the same journey, I expect the 1125R to operate more efficiently when I get out into the country at higher road speeds | ||
| Fresnobuell |
The arguments stating the bike should never be below 3000 rpm is idiotic. Sounds like an XB rider who has never ridden the 1125. Also you should read the thread a little closer--no one claimed that the bike should NEVER be below 3000 RPM. | ||
| Doerman |
When lane splitting, all your concentration is going towards monitoring and anticipating the traffic around you. That sometimes result in being in an rpm range you did not anticipate. It is therefore more important that fueling is glitch free throughout the range. Mine is (08 1125R), but perhaps Mike's isn't. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
totally agree, Asbjorn, lane splitting requires 100% of concentration on the cagers surrounding you. However, I guess you could say that is the case always, not just lane splitting. I know in all lane spliting cases for myself personally (and I only do it in isolated circumstances), I use the clutch when needed. No thought required. Anyone having issues with the 1125r at sub-3000 RPM should try a 600cc bike. | ||
| Dirty_john |
Fresno buell you are right about 600s, I own a Firebolt, an 1125R and a GSXR 600 (for the track.) All three bikes are completely different in character and all three bikes have their good and bad points even though the 600 redlines at twice that of the Thunderstorm engine and has no torque whatever at lowe revs. However the two Buells are the bikes that make me grin the widest and longest ann are the ones I would never part with. Can't wait to get the 1125R run in. | ||
| Buellborn |
Anyone having issues with the 1125r at sub-3000 RPM should try a 600cc bike. They have no power but they don't stumble or die. And NO I'm not defending 600 I hate them but the world is full of bikes that run smoothly the entire power band. Even some high revving twins, ride a Duc.It must be a mapping issue because I have ridden Rotax Aprilia's . also that perform smoothly. | ||
| Fresnobuell |
And NO I'm not defending 600 I hate them but the world is full of bikes that run smoothly the entire power band. The Buell runs smoothly in its power band....actually it runs like a raped ape in the power band. The POWER band is 4K to 10.4K. The power band does NOT begin from barely above idle, let's get that straight. (Message edited by fresnobuell on January 15, 2009) | ||
| Spectrum |
I'm having a hard time with this discussion. By that I mean, trying to figure out what people are complaining about and what they expect. My 08 1125R has no drivability problems at any RPM range. It pulls just fine in first starting at 1500 rpm and in second starting at 2200. It will cruise just fine at 2200 in 1st through 4th gear. It will lug in 4 - 6 if you try to accelerate and pull slow if your that low in 3rd gear. With the exception of the air cooled low reving V-Twins, this is same RPM gear selection scenarios are true of any modern higher reving motorcycle I've ridden. My bike did have drivability problems between 1500 and 4500 when I first got it. But subsequent reflashes solved these issues. If you are having problems, I think perhaps your bike needs to go back to the dealer. Just my 2 cents worth. By the way my friends that have 1098's are still complaining about engine stalls below 3000 rpms, so don't tell me ducs don't have these characteristic. | ||
| Chadhargis |
I have a GSX-R600 for the track too. Hardest damn bike to ride in the world. I tested an 1125R (2008) at an Inside Pass track day, and it was SWEET!! | ||
| Buellborn |
Spectrum is proof on how a bike should run. If you 1125 performs differently it is not normal take it to the dealer. Thats the 'straight' talk fresno, or Carl Rove who ever you are. | ||
| Carbonbigfoot |
SO. Anybody have an ID # or something on this latest flash for the CR's? Or did I miss it. I have missed some of the conversation... Rob | ||
| Fresnobuell |
Buellborn, figure out what the power band is yet? Amazing you can have such strong opinions without even have been on one. All you do is constantly berate the 1125r/BMC or give phony props to any modification on the R that changes the appearance. But, hey, thanks for keep it real in here. |
