| Author | Message | ||
     Ar15ls1 |
What does everyone think about Harleys 2 best performing bikes and how do they match up against each other? Which is better and at what?? Just trying to spark up the Quick board a little! | ||
| Mikej |
Vrod's a bar hopper straightliner for the most part, XB9R is the opposite. | ||
| Darthane |
Umm...can you say apples and oranges? And don't even start that bullshit about a V-Rod beating a XB in 1/4 mile times. God, what a stupid argument. Bryan | ||
| Anonymous |
Ummmm I have a better comparison XB9R vr Honda CBR 600 F4I or V-Rod vs V-Max. Lets stick each bike in it's own class. | ||
| Ar15ls1 |
I am talking about real world comparisons. These are the only 2 American made fairly fast motorcycles right now. I have a buddy that rides a vrod and we will race sooner or later on the street from many different speeds(dead stop,10 mph roll, 65mph roll etc.). I think with a little work I will be able to beat him in a straight line. We are good friends but argue all the time about what bike is better. So being both American bikes built by basically the same company I think this is a fair comparison. If this is apples and oranges than why not compare the xb9r to the rc51 instead of the cbr 600. Closer to the same size motors. A more realistic comparison! I am mainly looking for some feedback ! | ||
| Darthane |
Ar51ls1, As I said, Apples and Oranges. While they are both 'made by basically the same company' they are COMPLETELY different motorcycles. A V-Rod is a drag-inspired cruiser with a liquid cooled overhead cam 1100+ cc engine. The Firebolt is an aircooled 984cc pushrod. The RC51 isn't even a cloase comparison. Maybe in styling, but you're still talking about a liquid cooled, 4-valve, overhead cam engine. ::sigh:: If you want 'real world' comparisons, then go ahead and have your little straight line races...then take him to some twisty backroads. I'm guessing the fact that the Firebolt handles better than a filled water trough will make up for any time you grant to him straight line. Bryan | ||
| Ar15ls1 |
I only used the rc51 because it is a 1000cc twin, whereas the 600 is avery small inline 4. It is nomore of a comparison than either the vrod or rc51. Darthane I see that you enjoy drag racing, so what is wrong with competing with a vrod in a straight line test. What else would you race with an xb9r. More people buy sport bikes to go fast than they buy to tear up the backroads. I donot know anyone with a sportbike including gsxrs, cbrs, busas, etc that are worried about the road course. They want to acellerate as fast as possible. I know that the bolt only has its handling to fall back on because all of these bikes could hand it its own ass. This in turn makes it an underdog ( which I love). I ,like many ,many others bought my bike to go fast in a straight line. This is not apples or oranges!! Maybe we should tell all of the Buell drag racers that bust sportsters, dynas, and even vrods asses to quit what they are doing. Their bikes were designed to roadrace not drag race!! Hahaha! | ||
| Spiderman |
Ummmmmm I look for a sport bike to tear up the track and back roads. I am waiting for the V5 Honda to come out to make it into a track bike. Well handeling and full of HP and tourque. But i guess thats just me. | ||
| Rick_A |
That's a load of melarky. I think all that matters is that you have fun...riding whichever way is your preference.  I don't need over 100hp to enjoy myself...in fact...my measly 77 works just fine. IMO a high powered, ultra trick track bike is a waste, too, unless you're getting paid big bucks for your talent that can exploit that kinda machinery. I have nothing against V-Rods...everyone has their needs, wants, tastes, etc...but it sure ain't my thing. | ||
| Blake |
You may have bought the wrong bike. The VRod will be kicking your butt in a straight line as will any of the UJM repliracer sportbikes. | ||
| José_Quiñones |
You'd be amazed how many GSXR600&1000's and the like that I have seen with plenty of MEAT left on the side of the tires. THey look at my tires worn to near the edges on my Buell and they look at me like I'm some sort of freak. Most "squids" only care about going fast in a straight line. That's why lowering kits and extended swingarms are so popular for these bikes. If you bought an XB9R or any Buell to go fast in a straight line, you bought the WRONG bike. But people buy SUV's and never go offroad with them, so who am I to judge? | ||
| Hootowl |
Yeah, but people need them so they don't get stuck when they accidentally back over the flower beds. | ||
| Mikep |
I am agreeing with Rick_A, my XB with its stock h.p. is just fine. If I had a chance to spend a full week on a race course I might be asking for more, but I might also still be thrilled. I do still have 2 mm of unworn area at the edge of my rear tire. Neat Bike. mikep | ||
| Darthane |
If you bought your XB9R to go fast in a straight line, you not only bought the wrong bike, you wasted about $3,000. Get a GSXR. Yes, I like drag racing. No, I most certainly did not buy my XB9R to go fast straight. I drag race because right now it's the only kind of racing I can afford and have access to. Bryan | ||
| Ar15ls1 |
Maybe if you would not have bought a firebolt you could have put $3000 in the gsxr you could have bought and really dominated both tracks!! | ||
| S320002 |
Using the Firebolt as a drag racer could be compared to using a Porche Boxter as an off road vehicle. You might have some success but what's the point? Greg | ||
| Jmartz |
I think its a great idea to have a bike that can go fast in a straight line. Its also Ok to have a megabuck exotic (a la Duc 999) even if you are not skilled to use its full potential. Having and bragging and polshing and posing are fun too. Untill BMC puts a different motor in the XB we are going to require at least two bikes. | ||
| Darthane |
The problem with that is I hate the cookie-cutter rice-burners. GSXRs, R1s, CBRs. They're all the same. The only difference is who tweaked another 2HP out of their engine this year. I'll pay the extra money for a bike that does what I want, that not everyone else has, that's distinguishable from the vast majority of other sportbikes at a mere glance, etc, etc. Back to the original post, though. I love my Firebolt. I've never ridden and probably never will ride a V-Rod. Does that answer your question? Bryan | ||
| Djkaplan |
Hey Bryan, Drag race that Firebolt all you want. Most people that have never been to a strip before don't realize that bracket racing is what it is all about and not all out acceleration. I'm pretty sure I could be more consistent on my M2 than any other bike I've ever had at the strip. All out strip supremacy might be impressive to some people, but cutting a good light and nailing your dial-in will bring home the money. | ||
| Ar15ls1 |
Everyone here all has valid points. We buy our Buells to do certain things. That is whats good about our bikes. They do more than 1 thing well. I have never road raced anything. Ihave only drag raced cars and motorcycles . Darthane ,I agree with you I hate cookie cutter jap bikes. This is the main reason for getting a firebolt. Its American and also unique. As far as vrods go , it will not take much to beat one in a straight line. Most of them do not run better than low to mid 12s at the track. My old sportster ran very well against the vrod and my bolt is quicker than my sportster was. Keep the comments coming. I am getting good info here!!! | ||
| Darthane |
In any event, Ar15ls1, the easiest way to beat a V-Rod straight line is a little thing called a wheelie bar. The main reason that Buell's in general and Firebolts in particular aren't faster 1/4 mile time is the tendency to want to flip over backwards when you really nail it (think - short wheelbase, high torque - bad combo for dragging). As long as you're not racing riceburners that can finish a 1/4 in second gear, a wheelie bar should improve your jump off the line and therefore your overall time considerably. Best time I've ever seen posted for a 1/4 'bolt was something on the order of 11.9. Best I've done in only two trips is 12.2. I'm sure that my bike can beat 12 seconds, and a wheelie bar would only improve that. As DJ noted, though, in drag racing the real stuff is brackets, not fastest time down the strip. I haven't bothered sticking around to try the bracket racing because by that time the damned strip is too crowded for me to be willing to wait an hour for a single run. Bryan | ||
| Ar15ls1 |
A wheelie bar would be nice on the bolt. This thing likes to stand straight up in first, second, and sometimes third and I dont even have a race kit yet! 12.2's is not bad at all, especially only being your second time at the track! I have left hard on bikes before but I will need some practice on this bike. I will be doing a lot more street racing and probably leaving from a roll. This will help some. I wont be waisting my time racing anything bigger than a 600 from the jap bikes. I do know my limits! By the way my buddys vrod did beat a new cbr 600 tonight all the way to a 130. Needless to say I was impressed with the Harley. His next race was not so pretty though! A gsxr 1000 busted his ass! | ||
| Darthane |
A GSXR1000 will bust just about anyone's ass. When the rice burners line up next to me I just ignore them. I know they're gonna mop the floor with me time-wise. Yet somehow I always manage to look like I'm having more fun than them. Bryan | ||
| Jmartz |
There is this big guy who rides a GSXR 750. Ocassionally I encounter him on the freeway. Whe he sees me (mind you we are doing about 60) he pops a wheelie and speeds away. I got to ride one of them things once. They are dogs off the line but when they wind up (3 or 4 seconds later) BEWARE! | ||
| Ar15ls1 |
Those rice burners are very fast but they still dont look as good as our firebolts going down the street. Another guy I know with a 98 s1 that has been nallinized beat a busa in the 1/8 mile at the track but once past that the big bad busa blew by him. This does go to show you that from redlight to redlight we do stand a chance! | ||
| Darthane |
More than a chance. Red light to red light any four banger's gonna have problems. They make half the torque a Buell does. Bryan | ||
| Timmy2shoes |
no offense, but you guys are seriously on some good crack.... quote: ....."More than a chance. Red light to red light any four banger's gonna have problems. They make half the torque a Buell does. " A stock Busa (4 banger) makes almost 100 ft-lbs of torque. same with the zx12. I have owned 3 buells, and also a vrod (thankfully i was able to sell them... but that's a whole nother story) my best time was 11.83 at Beaver spring dragwway in Pa on the v-Rod. i could't break into the 11's on ANY of my Buells, and i KNOW that my White lightning (with 1000's into the motor) had more power than your stock f-bolt. I also know that just about ANY modern 600cc inline 4 would walk all over any of these bikes in question (buells/harley's) you're not beating any of these other bikes... you're beating the riders (that is, IF what you are saying is true) http://www.muzzys.com/dynocharts/ZX-12Dyno_4_15_02.jpg there's a dyno chart for a ZX12R, w/ and w/o a pipe and jet kit. 183 HP??? hahahahahha in your dreams, you're beating these things. | ||
| Darthane |
Timmy, Timmy, Timmy. I'm sorry, I'll qauntify my statement. It was a generalization and embellished to make a point. Ooh, a Hayabusa makes 100-ft/lbs! Wow...well, let's see, it's a 1300cc inline four overhead cam liquid cooled race bike that revs to 13000RPMs. Damn, I'm so surprised. A CBR600F4i, which is more in line with what I meant in my comparison, makes 44ft/lbs. I'm too lazy to look, but I'll bet even a GSXR750 makes under 70ft/lbs. And you have to rev them to the moon before they make any of this power, whereas a good tuner on a Cyclone will be making 60+ft/lbs at 2000RPMs and it climbs through the midrange to ~75ft/lbs at say 4000RPMs. The dyno sheet you posted means exactly squat to me. Horsepower is not what gets you off the line, and therefore you making 183HP means shit in 1/8th mile light to light runs. Oh, and __________________________________________________ Quote: hahahahahha in your dreams, you're beating these things. __________________________________________________ Let's see, in my post previous to that I believe I said... "A GSXR1000 will bust just about anyone's ass. When the rice burners line up next to me I just ignore them. I know they're gonna mop the floor with me time-wise." I don't have to dream about beating them because I don't care. Bryan | ||
| Reepicheep |
The inline fours will be much more dependent on rider skill, as they will have to be slipping the clutch through most of the short hard run. I like a bike that I can get a nice hard pull on without slipping the clutch... but that just makes it a really nice street bike, not a race winner. The other confounding factor is that the Buell can hit about 50 mph in first gear, I suspect that the inline fours will need at least one shift to do that. On a very short pull (your stoplight to stoplight scenario), the time taken to shift will be a significant percentage of the total run (I would think). Again, it requires more rider skill. That being said, speed is simply power versus weight. The inline fours are for the most part both lighter and more powerful. In terms of the track, they will likely win every time. If you don't mind riding your street bike like a trackbike, and treating the streets like a track, then you can win street races as well. I think doing that consistently on normal public roads is dangerous, stupid, disruptive, and tedious, but to each their own. The technology of a watercooled inline four will crush a pushrod long stroke 45 degree twin every time given equal displacements. Shrug. A two stroke anything will soundly spank a four stroke inline four to an even larger degree. Shrug. Jay Leno's turbine powered bike could probably power wheelie at a Busa's top speed. Shrug. I like my street bike to accelerate hard when I hit the throttle, regardless of where I am in the RPM band. I like a bike that will just barely lift the front wheel off the ground when I pin the throttle from a normal cruising RPM. I want a bike that performs well without resorting to such chicanery as slipping a clutch or keeping the engine revs at some absurd and annoying speed. I want a bike that performs well under the same conditions (RPM, no clutch feathering) that it is comfortable to ride. I want a bike that I don't have to drop a gear to make it perform. I like a bike that is narrow, with big torque from idle to redline, and a short wheelbase. I want an engine that is recognizable as an engine, and not some sort of abstract whooshing power module. So the inline fours are out for me, even though they are in every regard superior on the track. Of course, a TL1000 (and likely the SV1000) will kick the tube frame Buells asses in every street category I mentioned above (except sound, water cooling = farts under water)... but in spite of that I can't bring myself to like them, so there must be something more to it then that anyway  | ||
| Ar15ls1 |
I agree, most of the guys on these jap bikes are inexperienced and can be vulnerable on the street. Yes their bikes make way more power but how usable is it at certain speeds and rpms. If you know where to get them and they have to downshift 2 or 3 times, then you are already off to the races. Sure they will run you down but it will make them think a little. |
