| Author | Message | ||
     Blake |
The recommendation from Mr. Ron Dickey:
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| Sarodude |
Blake- Just to clarify, there was no seizure - seizure being defined / interpreted as immobilization of the driveline, especially (in this case) by fusion of the piston to the cylnder. Nothing ever locked up. -Saro | ||
| Ezblast |
Actually - most of the drag racers I know - and that would be at least a hundred - lol - almost all run Iron, because it is inexpensive and will hold up for at least one pass - and since they know that they will be rebuilding between runs, with new cylinders and rings,etc. - it behooves them to save money where they can - so they of course opt for Iron over Nikasil, in other forms of racing - such as endurance racing in Europe - most opt for the Nikasil. EZ | ||
| Buelliedan |
Blake, I am sorry I admit I missed the part about the tens of thousands of miles. So are you bringing that bike to Homecoming to verify that it has tens of thousands of miles on the odometer? EZ, Yes Blake did call me a liar. See the part where he said I am making up theories to malign the competition. I say that is calling me a liar. It is obvious that some of you have your opinions and I obviously have mine. Just like the democrat vs republican divide there is not going to be a meeting of the minds here. I have stated my opinion and what I have personally seen to be the goods and bads of both styles of cylinders. I hope those of you who do have problems are able to get them worked out easily. I have sold more than one set of iron lined cylinders to somebody who got very digusted with the "lifetime warranty" after they had problems. In fact I just sold a set of iron lined 88" cylinders to a guy running a turbo after his 3rd failure. Have fun folks. | ||
| Blake |
Buelliedan, Repeating: What do you want for your "pile of bad Nikasil cylinders that were returned due to plating issues"? If they are otherwise in good shape (meaning that except for the bad plating they are in good working condition), I'll happily give you $10 a piece plus actual shipping via UPS ground. Please respond. | ||
| Buelliedan |
Blake, I do not own them. they are sitting out at Aarons house and I am pretty sure he would rather use them for target practice then to sell them to you for even $500 a piece. Some things are just about principle more than it is about money. I think one day he plans to take them to the aluminum recycler but we are in no hurry to get rid of them as they make great door stops. Have a blessed day. | ||
| Ezblast |
Dan - I missed that - folks please stay on topic - no slurs please - so have we qualified the best usage for each cylinder type - looks as if we have - EZ | ||
| Blake |
"Yes Blake did call me a liar. See the part where he said I am making up theories to malign the competition. I say that is calling me a liar." Baloney. It is exactly what I stated, nothing more. Folks can decide for themselves What Buelliedan the salesman says: Nikasil is great in watercooled engines but they are very heat sensitive. So much so that the plating often bubbles during powder coating if they are baked at anything more than 300 degrees. What Ron Dickey of Axtell says: (Aluminum cylinders with nickel/silicon carbide bore coating) have an exceptional rate of heat dissipation which is an advantage on an engine type that tends to run hot. Examples of what we would classify as an egg-cooker are Evo full dressers and Buells. Someone is making up stories. The highly respected Mr. Ron Dickey of Axtell recommends in writing on his own web site that their own plated cylinders are best for hot running engines. We can find additional proof in the fact that numerous Buell roadracers including all those running an XBRR (a hot running high performance roadracing engine)--recall the recent European championships and race wins as well as endurance race wins--run nickel-silicon-carbide plated cylinders. I've not heard of any that have ever suffered engine failure due to cylinder plating problems. (Message edited by Blake on May 15, 2008) | ||
| Blake |
Saro, The seizure type of failure is what happened multiple times with the iron cylinders. I didn't mean to imply that was the case with your Blast. | ||
| Ezblast |
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| Reuel |
Is it over?  | ||
| Ezblast |
What you have here are the facts needed to make an informed choice about your next cylinder up grade. So yes it is! EZ | ||
| Kustomklassix |
Wow. I just read the last few pages in and through the archives up to Ez's last comment. I could literally see the anger sharks swimming in!  | ||
| Reuel |
Whew! Now I know what to think about when the day comes that my wife says I can spend the money. Then again, I might just get that Canon Rebel SLR digital camera I've wanted for years. | ||
| Buelliedan |
over? It's not over until we say it's over! Did we give up when the germans bombed pearl harbor!! I wonder just how many of you are old enough to get that? | ||
| Ezblast |
Damn - I am! | ||
| Zane |
and the sign on the parade float said "Eat Me". yeah... I'm old enough to remember. (Message edited by zane on May 16, 2008) | ||
| Kustomklassix |
Hey now! I'm not old 'nuff to REMEMBER, but I do KNOW of what you all speak of. Do I get credit for that? LoL | ||
| Fast1075 |
Wait a minnit...I Resemble that Remark!!  I remeber that line, but I may have been impaired at the time!!!...it WAS the 70's after all!!!! TOGA! TOGA! TOGA! (Message edited by fast1075 on May 16, 2008) | ||
| Reuel |
Hey! Off topic! What's wrong with you guys?  | ||
| Fast1075 |
Oppppssss! uncontrolled flashback!! Errrrr...I will still stick with iron liners...better??? | ||
| Blake |
John Sullivan of V-Twin Magazine reviews Revolution Performance engine kit with Nickel-Silicon-Carbide cylinders. Excerpts follow: PRODUCT REVIEW REVOLUTION PERFORMANCE 98-INCH KIT (The Revolution Performance aerospace-grade aluminum alloy cylinders with nickel-silicon-carbide electroplated bores) do two things: they allow for a larger bore: and more importantly, they keep the motor cooler by providing better heat transfer between the combustion chamber and the outside air. As much as people talk about the "larger displacement" of the Revolution cylinders, their ability to dissipate heat is a larger benefit. Keeping a high-performance motor cool can be a problem. This is because for every extra horsepower generated over the stock motor, the cooling fins on cylinders and heads must remove an additional 2540 BTUs (British Thermal Units) (equal to of heat from the combustion process. This is no mean feat, as a well-tuned 95- to 107-inch motor can easily crank out an additional 125,000 BTUs over a stock motor. Because the stock steel liner-aluminum finned cylinders have a thermal joint at the connection of the two metals that have drastically differing rates of thermal expansion, their ability to dissipate heat is about 18% less than that of the all aluminum cylinders. The cooler-running Revolution cylinder-equipped motor will not only run longer, it will also put out slightly more power than a steel/aluminum barreled motor. The finished bike runs better than any 95-inch Twin Cam powered bike we have ever ridden. The low to midrange power is fantastic. --John Sullivan It's just plain foolish to battle on when every attack you launch is handily shot down. Even the Japanese and the Germans knew when to call it quits. It's unheard of to see NRHS speaking poorly of any of their current products as Dan has done wrt the Axtell plated cylinders. Kinda makes you go "hmmmm..."; it leads me to suspect that there may be more to the story, like that Axtell is dropping their four year old line of plated cylinders. Could it be? Just pure speculation on my part. Maybe Dan can comment. Dan, do you know if Axtell is planning to drop their line of plated cylinders? If so, that would sure explain a lot. (Message edited by Blake on May 16, 2008) | ||
| Ezblast |
Animal House - lol - very appropo to this topic - lol - and that is a good question? EZ | ||
| Buelliedan |
Nope not planning to drop the line at all. Like I said, you have one set of cylinders and you probably have the 80% good ones. Thats just it, they either work great or they have catastrphic failures very early in their life. If you make it past 1,000 miles they seem to last forever but you have not seen the ones that have problems that we as a seller have seen especially with the brand you prefer. A 20% failure rate is what we were experiencing which is just not good when trying to stay in business. Plus the cost of the Nikasils has gotten extremely high where many foks can no longer afford them. I am offering a 1250 kit for the twins with forged pistons for $700. What is the cost of the Nikasils with the same pistons? (Message edited by buelliedan on May 16, 2008) (Message edited by buelliedan on May 16, 2008) | ||
| Ezblast |
375.00 for the Blast kit from our good sponsor - Revolution Perf. - Lifetime Warranted 695.00 for your comparable kit - 6mo warranted? AKA - with Nikasil jugs. EZ | ||
| Buelliedan |
My blast kit is $299.95. My twin cylinder kit is $700. Are you saying you can get a Nikasil kit for $695?? last time i looked they are $899.95 for twins. I don't know where you got the $695 price from? http://www.revperf.com/XL/xlPerform1200.html )} This discussion is really going nowhere. I hope all of you have a great time out there on the road!! (Message edited by buelliedan on May 16, 2008) | ||
| Ezblast |
Well - this is the Blast Forum - so those are Blast prices - the kit you are talking about is with the Iron lined cylinders - I'm talking about your NIasil Blast kits - keeping the apples and oranges separated;0) EZ | ||
| Blake |
Dan, Let me fix/clarify that for you. "I am offering a 1250 kit for the twins with forged pistons and six-month warrantied Chinese cylinders using big thick and heavy iron sleeves for $700. What is the cost of the Revolution Performance 1250 kit with the same pistons and state-of-the-art, lifetime warrantied, Made-in-America, aerospace-grade all-aluminum alloy cylinders with nickel-silicon-carbide plating?" I dunno if the pistons are the same. Revolution Performance is now offering the very best that Wiseco has to offer. Forged pistons, special patent-pending coated skirts, gas nitrided ring pack specified especially for optimum performance in NSC plated cylinders, all top of the line, Formula-1 derived/inspired technology. To even try to compare the two is disingenuous in my view, an All-American Apple versus a Chinese orange. That said, and in order to be fair to our sponsors and uphold the integrity of BadWeB equally for all, if you post any more advertisements here, you'll find your posting privileges suspended. I'd much rather you just find it within yourself to honor our terms of use. Despite your obvious and blatant self-interest-driven agenda here, you are a Buell enthusiast and we welcome that part 100%. So do everyone a favor and please avoid posting any more promotional content for yourself here. It's entirely your choice. | ||
| Ezblast |
Besides - 899.00 is a great deal vs the 199 less the Iron is - especially with a lifetime warrantee. Sorry, but thats a no brainer. EZ Fixed the math for ya.  (Message edited by Blake on May 16, 2008)lol An accountant who can't do math - I forgot about his sale and looked up his regular price. (Message edited by ezblast on May 16, 2008) | ||
| Blake |
Also, if you fill out their survey, Revolution Performance will send you a 5% discount coupon. That drops the list on their 1250 kit down to $844. |
